"Thousands" of min-wage McDonalds workers to walk off jobs to demand better pay

[Kaido]

Yet you refuse to answer the question?

Why should they be paid more than their value?
It is an entry level job that requires no skill set.
Intended on generating some spending money.

You want more spending money; either move up or out.
Many fast food places have help wanted signs for shift managers as well as regular workers out all the time.

A shift manager may have to be more responsible; work harder and get a little higher pay.

There are limited slots within a location; but if those are unfilled; it indicates that the entry level people are not wanting to qualify for those slots. They are happy having to take no responsibility, not work harder and receive the pay they signed up for.

Well that's more of a system question. Our current system is capitalism; under those rules, you get paid what your perceived value is. Bottom line: the world pays you what they think you are worth. That doesn't make it right from a moral standpoint; it's pretty cold-hearted to say that people who can't do better should be stuck in poverty for life, but that's the reality of our existing system.

The common debate is, should you help a homeless person, like if the guy is a vet with his legs blown off and has PTSD? Some camps say your situation is your situation and so there ("get a job!"), but I'd like to see those same people be put in that exact situation and not be on the street begging for handouts. It's just an excuse, and also, some people really are that cold.

The trouble is, it's hard to make sweeping changes on things that aren't cut & dried. Social workers are already overloaded as it is and the system is extensively abused. Habits get made and people get comfortable. One of the benefits of capitalism is that it provides a lot of motivation through financial incentives, because if you get out there & work, you get paid and have more economic power. Wait, this is starting to sound like a P&N thread

 

[Fritzo]

I say do it. Raise it to $15. Then these idiots will lose out to a higher quality worker and I might actually be inclined to go into a McD's.

Then they'll complain about the low wages at the carry-out jobs they migrate to.

 

[Wonderful Pork]

I think it's more people who are more or less stuck where they are, i.e. (just generally speaking, no offense to anyone) the disabled, immigrants, people with low IQ's, people with mental handicaps, etc. I doubt many people want to make McDonalds or Walmart their career choice for life, you know?

Society has entitlement programs for the legitimately disabled (mentally, physically, etc) and folks that are unable to work. Supplementing this by working an entry level job is perfectly reasonable. (Lets gloss over any abuse of said entitlement programs for the moment)

People that are mentally and/or physically able but are lazy or generally not motivated enough to better their careers get no sympathy from me. I'll help somebody who needs it, but not somebody who feels they are entitled to it.

Anecdotally, there is a stark difference in attitudes between the ones who really need help and the ones who just want more.

 

[OILFIELDTRASH]

Yet you refuse to answer the question?

Why should they be paid more than their value?
It is an entry level job that requires no skill set.
Intended on generating some spending money.

You want more spending money; either move up or out.
Many fast food places have help wanted signs for shift managers as well as regular workers out all the time.

A shift manager may have to be more responsible; work harder and get a little higher pay.

There are limited slots within a location; but if those are unfilled; it indicates that the entry level people are not wanting to qualify for those slots. They are happy having to take no responsibility, not work harder and receive the pay they signed up for.

I think we disagree on their value. I'd say an employee of a fast food chain that is experienced (few years) and efficient is definitely worth about $10-$10.50 a hour. No way is it a $15 a hour job and imo it is worth more than $7.25. I'd just like to see those stuck or there by choice have some option for making more than minimum wage. At least at $10 a hour they could support themselves and even a child. At the current rate we are just allowing McD's to use the taxpayer to supplement the income they should be paying themselves.

 

[Hugo Drax]

What they need to do is cut all federal benefits to fast food restaurant workers. (no WIC,foodstamps,welfare,headstart,etc..)


Taxpayers should not be paying the spread.

 

[Fritzo]

I think we disagree on their value. I'd say an employee of a fast food chain that is experienced (few years) and efficient is definitely worth about $10-$10.50 a hour. No way is it a $15 a hour job and imo it is worth more than $7.25. I'd just like to see those stuck or there by choice have some option for making more than minimum wage. At least at $10 a hour they could support themselves and even a child. At the current rate we are just allowing McD's to use the taxpayer to supplement the income they should be paying themselves.

I'd agree with $10-$11 after a few years of experience. But yeah---$15 is crazy.

 

[Ruptga]

I think we disagree on their value. I'd say an employee of a fast food chain that is experienced (few years) and efficient is definitely worth about $10-$10.50 a hour. No way is it a $15 a hour job and imo it is worth more than $7.25. I'd just like to see those stuck or there by choice have some option for making more than minimum wage. At least at $10 a hour they could support themselves and even a child. At the current rate we are just allowing McD's to use the taxpayer to supplement the income they should be paying themselves.

I was going to say something like that, but let's also recognize that there are people out there that would be working for $3/hour if there were no minimum wage, because that is what supply/demand says they are worth. If we instituted a pure lassaiz faire economy with no unions, no minimum wage, and no handouts, well, wages would plummet, especially for the bottom quintile of earners. People would die by the tens of thousands, and maybe by the millions. First they would die from lack of medical care, then from malnutrition, exposure, hunger, and violence. Assuming the disenfranchised millions didn't vote away the rights of the wealthy minority, they would eventually revolt. If the revolt didn't succeed, society would still collapse due to the growth of the top quintile at the expense of the bottom four quintiles' earning capacities.

Our economy requires a healthy middle class, which requires social welfare policies. Those policies keep people from sliding down to the bottom class during hard times, and they help more people move into the middle class during decent times. If you want to pretend poor people don't exist, or to even help Darwin along, you will need a plan for transitioning to a completely different economic system.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

I think we disagree on their value. I'd say an employee of a fast food chain that is experienced (few years) and efficient is definitely worth about $10-$10.50 a hour. No way is it a $15 a hour job and imo it is worth more than $7.25. I'd just like to see those stuck or there by choice have some option for making more than minimum wage. At least at $10 a hour they could support themselves and even a child. At the current rate we are just allowing McD's to use the taxpayer to supplement the income they should be paying themselves.

Look, your ability to make a sammich or push buttons on a machine isn't exactly learning from the experience when it comes to retail. The only way to move up in retail is management. And the only way to learn from experience in management is dealing with customers.

If you have a retarded looking face and always dicking customers, don't know how to deal with customer situations, etc.. etc... then yeah, you haven't learned anything - and you should be staying at the only thing you know how to do.

Moving up has to do with learning things through experience - Not moving up just because you pushed some buttons for a few years.

 

[BoberFett]

Or you get into a wreck in your car and suffer some mental damage

So that's what happened to you.

Yeah I agree these guys don't deserve 50 grand a year. Not even saying they should get 30k. They should at least get enough they can have an apartment, a car, pay for their own food etc..

Really? Never heard of roommates? Never heard of the bus? Why should a menial job entitle one to some random standard of living that you have determined is the minimum?

 

[Hugo Drax]

I was going to say something like that, but let's also recognize that there are people out there that would be working for $3/hour if there were no minimum wage, because that is what supply/demand says they are worth. If we instituted a pure lassaiz faire economy with no unions, no minimum wage, and no handouts, well, wages would plummet, especially for the bottom quintile of earners. People would die by the tens of thousands, and maybe by the millions. First they would die from lack of medical care, then from malnutrition, exposure, hunger, and violence. Assuming the disenfranchised millions didn't vote away the rights of the wealthy minority, they would eventually revolt. If the revolt didn't succeed, society would still collapse due to the growth of the top quintile at the expense of the bottom four quintiles' earning capacities.

Our economy requires a healthy middle class, which requires social welfare policies. Those policies keep people from sliding down to the bottom class during hard times, and they help more people move into the middle class during decent times. If you want to pretend poor people don't exist, or to even help Darwin along, you will need a plan for transitioning to a completely different economic system.

You really think so in this country? I think what will happen is people are not just going to sit idle and starve to death.

Look what happened to Nikolay Alexandrovich Romanov and the turmoil that ensued. Many empires/forms of government have fallen when you have a shit load of hungry pissed off people.

I say cut all taxpayer subsides to fast food workers. Let the natural market do its work. I guarantee you are not going to see people just sitting idle and waiting to die quietly of starvation.


The natural unsubsidized wages will prevail and it will be higher than todays minimum wage if you cut all the lemon socialist programs.

 

[BoberFett]

Just like every profession in life. Just because mommy and daddy sent you to techie school that doesn't give you the right to look down on others. You have no idea what those people have been through. Hell working the counter at mcd's could be a hell of an accomplishment for them. Maybe they are slow or came out of homelessness and are taking the first job they could find. You have no idea. I'd say the guy that was beat his whole life by his family and thrown out at 16 years old would be doing damn fine for himself just being a functioning member of society and working at mcd's. I'd say he came alot further in life than some pampered boy whose parents sent him to school and still hasn't learned what it is to be a man.

You're a moron. You keep using this "mommy daddy tech school" line like a fucking retarded parrot.

I've been up and down. Right now I'm in the top 5% of income earners in the US. That's not luck. That's not an accident. I worked my ass off when I was out of high school to better myself. Instead of going out drinking all the time like most fresh-out-of-high-school idiots, I bought a used computer and taught myself the beginning of what would later turn into a solid IT career.

But even since my career started, I've had low periods. I relocated to be closer to my daughter and spent months eating ramen and doing odd jobs for a bit of cash. Lived with a roommate. Driven beater cars. I tossed boxes at a UPS facility for $8/hr. I did what it took. But entitled losers like you think the world owes them and everybody else a comfortable living no matter what brainless job they do.

Bullshit. You want more then go earn it, you lazy bitch.

 

[OILFIELDTRASH]

You're a moron. You keep using this "mommy daddy tech school" line like a fucking retarded parrot.

I've been up and down. Right now I'm in the top 5% of income earners in the US. That's not luck. That's not an accident. I worked my ass off when I was out of high school to better myself. Instead of going out drinking all the time like most fresh-out-of-high-school idiots, I bought a used computer and taught myself the beginning of what would later turn into a solid IT career.

But even since my career started, I've had low periods. I relocated to be closer to my daughter and spent months eating ramen and doing odd jobs for a bit of cash. Lived with a roommate. Driven beater cards. I tossed boxes at a UPS facility for $8/hr. I did what it took. But entitled losers like you think the world owes them and everybody else a comfortable living no matter what brainless job they do.

Bullshit. You want more then go earn it, you lazy bitch.

lol. Been working in the oilfield for almost 6 years now you retarded fool. Hence the username. Before that I worked in a steel forging factory. I earn plenty You lazy bitch. Go back to wearing your khakis and pretending to work and let the men speak. I didn't pay a dime for my training in fact I got paid for mine you retard.

 

[BoberFett]

Can a robot push a mop?

Not sure if serious...

 

[OILFIELDTRASH]

Sounds like I hit a nerve with the mommy tech school bit. lol. Figures, you retarded bitch. I'm a self made man you little pampered boy. Everything I own I worked for. Didn't get so much as a set of clothes when I made out on my own. I definitely didn't have mommy and daddy send me to tech school. lol. No wonder you turned out to be such a pampered little bitch.

 

[IndyColtsFan]

Sounds like I hit a nerve with the mommy tech school bit. lol.

No, it just continues to show your ignorance.

 

[EagleKeeper]

I was going to say something like that, but let's also recognize that there are people out there that would be working for $3/hour if there were no minimum wage, because that is what supply/demand says they are worth. If we instituted a pure lassaiz faire economy with no unions, no minimum wage, and no handouts, well, wages would plummet, especially for the bottom quintile of earners. People would die by the tens of thousands, and maybe by the millions. First they would die from lack of medical care, then from malnutrition, exposure, hunger, and violence. Assuming the disenfranchised millions didn't vote away the rights of the wealthy minority, they would eventually revolt. If the revolt didn't succeed, society would still collapse due to the growth of the top quintile at the expense of the bottom four quintiles' earning capacities.

Our economy requires a healthy middle class, which requires social welfare policies. Those policies keep people from sliding down to the bottom class during hard times, and they help more people move into the middle class during decent times. If you want to pretend poor people don't exist, or to even help Darwin along, you will need a plan for transitioning to a completely different economic system.

Those policies are not setup to protect the middle class.
They are setup to support the lower class and generate warm fuzzies for the liberals

Middle class is not considered to be eligible for food stamps; subsidized housing, Medicaid, etc. All of those require a means test; that test is not looking at just income projected; but income past and assets.

A middle class has to unload their assets and/or falsify info to be able gain access to such benefits. Or wait until they are broken down and are actually lower class.

 

[slag]

You're a moron. You keep using this "mommy daddy tech school" line like a fucking retarded parrot.

I've been up and down. Right now I'm in the top 5% of income earners in the US. That's not luck. That's not an accident. I worked my ass off when I was out of high school to better myself. Instead of going out drinking all the time like most fresh-out-of-high-school idiots, I bought a used computer and taught myself the beginning of what would later turn into a solid IT career.

But even since my career started, I've had low periods. I relocated to be closer to my daughter and spent months eating ramen and doing odd jobs for a bit of cash. Lived with a roommate. Driven beater cards. I tossed boxes at a UPS facility for $8/hr. I did what it took. But entitled losers like you think the world owes them and everybody else a comfortable living no matter what brainless job they do.

Bullshit. You want more then go earn it, you lazy bitch.

I completely agree with everything BoberFett said. Not because it's directed towards someone, but because he speaks the truth. This is the land of opportunity and there is no reason to not make it.

 

[BoberFett]

lol. Been working in the oilfield for almost 6 years now you retarded fool. Hence the username. Before that I worked in a steel forging factory. I earn plenty You lazy bitch. Go back to wearing your khakis and pretending to work and let the men speak. I didn't pay a dime for my training in fact I got paid for mine you retard.

Well you got the TRASH part right anyway.

 

[BoberFett]

Sounds like I hit a nerve with the mommy tech school bit. lol. Figures, you retarded bitch. I'm a self made man you little pampered boy. Everything I own I worked for. Didn't get so much as a set of clothes when I made out on my own. I definitely didn't have mommy and daddy send me to tech school. lol. No wonder you turned out to be such a pampered little bitch.

So you did get your training paid for. Awww, ain't that sweet, somebody paid for you blue collar training. How is that any different than mommy or daddy paying?

 

[RPD]

I like how everyone is just saying "Well I think they should be paid this..". As Chris Rock once said: “I used to work at McDonald's making minimum wage. You know what that means when someone pays you minimum wage? You know what your boss was trying to say? "Hey if I could pay you less, I would, but it's against the law.”

Wages aren't magically set by what society deems as sufficient, the market does. There's a reason some wages vary. Again I don't know nor do I recall anyone saying this, but just because you make less money doesn't make you bad or evil. As I previously said what you make has no bearing on that. However when you want to flip the script and demand more, then we have a problem.

I say this having worked at a car wash in high school, a video rental store/soccer ref/pizza delivery/cashier @ a gas station/data entry/machinist in college and now work as 100% commissioned sales post college for the past 10 years. I'll also add in each and every job I've held where pay was hourly, I earned hourly pay increases multiple times in less than a year.

 

[CZroe]

So that's what happened to you.



Really? Never heard of roommates? Never heard of the bus? Why should a menial job entitle one to some random standard of living that you have determined is the minimum?

Also, dual income households regardless of roommates (includes most families), retired but working, summer job, pension recipients, individuals with a second job, etc. There are a ton of scenarios where the current minimum wage doesn't have to be enough for raising a family.

What's next? "Livable wages" for unpaid interns?!

 

[Ichinisan]

I was going to say something like that, but let's also recognize that there are people out there that would be working for $3/hour if there were no minimum wage, because that is what supply/demand says they are worth. If we instituted a pure lassaiz faire economy with no unions, no minimum wage, and no handouts, well, wages would plummet, especially for the bottom quintile of earners. People would die by the tens of thousands, and maybe by the millions. First they would die from lack of medical care, then from malnutrition, exposure, hunger, and violence. Assuming the disenfranchised millions didn't vote away the rights of the wealthy minority, they would eventually revolt. If the revolt didn't succeed, society would still collapse due to the growth of the top quintile at the expense of the bottom four quintiles' earning capacities.

Our economy requires a healthy middle class, which requires social welfare policies. Those policies keep people from sliding down to the bottom class during hard times, and they help more people move into the middle class during decent times. If you want to pretend poor people don't exist, or to even help Darwin along, you will need a plan for transitioning to a completely different economic system.

If people were getting paid as little as $3/hour, costs of products would drop.

Inflation might even drop a bit

 

[Atomic Playboy]

If people were getting paid as little as $3/hour, costs of products would drop.

Inflation might even drop a bit

Not necessarily. The cost of the product is based around what people are willing to pay. If you decrease your production costs, that doesn't mean that people's willingness to pay a certain price diminishes, and there's no incentive for a corporation to sell a product for less than the market deems it is worth. More often than not, lower production costs aren't realized as lower product costs, they're realized as higher profits.

 

[CZroe]

Not necessarily. The cost of the product is based around what people are willing to pay. If you decrease your production costs, that doesn't mean that people's willingness to pay a certain price diminishes, and there's no incentive for a corporation to sell a product for less than the market deems it is worth. More often than not, lower production costs aren't realized as lower product costs, they're realized as higher profits.

Wrong. People earning less are not willing to pay as much as they always have so prices must fall or else the market shrinks. Everything is connected.

It's lunacy to think that only regulation and minimum wage laws are keeping the middle class strong and saving us from a revolt. Similarly, they wouldn't be able to get away with paying $3 an hour because the labor market isn't there. They'd either have to pay more or close up shop due to not having anyone interested in working there. The people working minimum wage today are obviously willing to or else they'd find a more difficult unskilled labor job that pays more (they DO exist).

 

[halik]

People should be outraged, or I mean tax payers should be.
McD's may pay minimum but YOU the taxpayer are making up the difference.
All the while McD's laughs all the way to the bank.

The public are so gullible and just plain stupid.
They think it's fine to pay minimum wage yet can not add 2+2 realizing they the taxpayer are picking up the tab.

If a worker makes $7.25 an hour full time that equals just over $15,000 a year before taxes.
Obviously that worker qualifies for food stamps and other taxpayer public assistance.
All while McD's laughs their collective asses off all the way to the bank.

If, on the other hand, that same worker earned $15 an hour full time, that equals $31,000 plus change a year, before taxes.

$31,000 would not qualify for public assistance nor food stamps.
You, the tax payer, would save money. Your tax paying neighbors would save money, and McD's as well as the other business welfare whores would carry that burden they created.
Never again passing the buck onto the taxpayer.

Now... Which of the two is the fair wage with benefitting the taxpayer?
McD,s as well as Wally World and all the others are not only screwing the worker by paying minimum wage, they are screwing you too, that tax payer.

And republicans in congress fight against a wage increase, yet have the nerve to call Obama the food stamp president.
WHY are people soooooo totally retarded not to see thru this scam?
Low wage companies screwing them, us, everyone.
And your congress?

At 31K a year McDs isn't making any profit. What will happen is they cut the hours on the workforce and replace them with technology to make profit. Now all these people that you mandate $15/hr are unemployed and gov't is paying for 100% of their expenses rather than the $(expenses - mcd wage)