"Thousands" of min-wage McDonalds workers to walk off jobs to demand better pay

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Ruptga

Lifer
Aug 3, 2006
10,247
207
106
Yes, there are many people who will not work hard no matter what they get paid and yes there are people that work hard no matter how little they get paid. Those people that work hard at their minimum wage jobs are the ones that get moved up and become the managers, supervisors etc at their jobs but there's a reason why some people are stuck at their minimum wage job, because they don't try.

And most people fall somewhere in the middle, they do middling work and will work at least a little harder when they're treated right. You're just looking for an excuse to look down on "those people."

So you believe that the guy who has been there for a year and making minimum wage + $1 won't mind if if the new guy standing next to him suddenly gets bumped up to the same rate? And that now he's back to minimum wage?

Ideally, the employer would move everyone up the same dollar amount, preserving raises earned. In practice, dbag employers will do the absolute minimum, which is what the guy should really be mad about. People that want others' lives to suck simply because theirs sucked are at the height of selfish irrationality. This should sound familiar.
 

monkeydelmagico

Diamond Member
Nov 16, 2011
3,961
145
106
I have come to the conclusion that you attack anything posted.

As an engineer, if I could get by at my salary just answering tech support calls for 8 hours a day; I am damn sure my CSR skills would be through the roof.

I have come to the conclusion you view any response to your posts as an attack.



Lighten up Francis, it was a quote from a funny movie.
 

BoberFett

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
37,563
9
81
Ideally, the employer would move everyone up the same dollar amount, preserving raises earned. In practice, dbag employers will do the absolute minimum, which is what the guy should really be mad about. People that want others' lives to suck simply because theirs sucked are at the height of selfish irrationality. This should sound familiar.

Which means all wages go up, meaning prices will rise to match the new cost of the goods produced.
 

Ruptga

Lifer
Aug 3, 2006
10,247
207
106
Which means all wages go up, meaning prices will rise to match the new cost of the goods produced.

To a degree, yes, but you aren't even telling half the story. Wages are just one part of the final cost of production, particularly when the average labor cost is at or near the legal minimum. For example, for McDonald's, the cost of raising the minimum to 10$ could be covered completely by raising the price of the big mac by ten cents. A single menu item would go up by 2.5 percent, that's it.

echo echo echo echo echo...
 
Jul 10, 2007
12,050
3
0
1) Are we really naive enough to think that the pool of available jobs is high enough so that everyone in the country over the age of 21 can have a skilled (read: need to go to college) career position?
2) Are we really naive enough to think anyone in any situation in life can be accepted into and afford to go to college just to get those "higher" paying jobs?
3) Do you think it's "entitlement" when someone asks for a livable wage just because you feel that the job is "beneath" educated people?
4) Do you really think that most of these people are just spending the money on doing drugs and buying Uggs?

One last point to my rant. My understanding is that they asked for $15/hr. Sounds like a lot? That's about $30,000 a year before tax. If that's entitlement, it's laughable.

1 & 2) Not everyone needs a college degree to land a non-min wage job. plenty of trade/vocation schools will teach skills necessary for a higher wage job like a plumber or electrician.

3) it's not about a job being beneath someone. it's about what the market will bear.
and the way they are going about it, yes, it's entitlement. why does one feel an unskilled position, a job that requires the mental capacity of a 3rd grader, suddenly deserves nearly double the current min wage?

4) not necessarily drugs, but if they're still stuck in a dead end job, we know they're not the brightest and hence not financially saavy. they'll use that money towards 20" rims and iphones (and yes, they already do).

lastly, entitlement isn't about dollar amount. i'm sure someone as educated and successful as you already knew that though.
 

BoberFett

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
37,563
9
81
To a degree, yes, but you aren't even telling half the story. Wages are just one part of the final cost of production, particularly when the average labor cost is at or near the legal minimum. For example, for McDonald's, the cost of raising the minimum to 10$ could be covered completely by raising the price of the big mac by ten cents. A single menu item would go up by 2.5 percent, that's it.

That "study" by an ignorant student was soundly debunked. They used McDonald's financial report and didn't even read the data correctly.

And you don't thing the entire supply chain would be affected by increased wages, meaning the cost of everything McDonald's purchases would rise as well as their direct labor costs? Indirect labor costs would go up as well.
 
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Ruptga

Lifer
Aug 3, 2006
10,247
207
106
That "study" by an ignorant student was soundly debunked. They used McDonald's financial report and didn't even read the data correctly.

And you don't thing the entire supply chain would be affected by increased wages, meaning the cost of everything McDonald's purchases would rise as well as their direct labor costs? Indirect labor costs would go up as well.

This is what I'm referring to, what the hell are you referring to? In the first line, "we the undersigned professional economists..."

If that paper has been disproved, it wasnt done in this thread. Feel free to enlighten us.

And here's the cliff's notes, since you probably can't be bothered to even skim the original, let alone do any actual digging.
 
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Connoisseur

Platinum Member
Sep 14, 2002
2,471
1
81
1 & 2) Not everyone needs a college degree to land a non-min wage job. plenty of trade/vocation schools will teach skills necessary for a higher wage job like a plumber or electrician.

3) it's not about a job being beneath someone. it's about what the market will bear.
and the way they are going about it, yes, it's entitlement. why does one feel an unskilled position, a job that requires the mental capacity of a 3rd grader, suddenly deserves nearly double the current min wage?

4) not necessarily drugs, but if they're still stuck in a dead end job, we know they're not the brightest and hence not financially saavy. they'll use that money towards 20" rims and iphones (and yes, they already do).

lastly, entitlement isn't about dollar amount. i'm sure someone as educated and successful as you already knew that though.

On 1 and 2, you're right of course. Not every skilled labor position requires a college degree. I put too much focus on higher education where there's a high barrier to entry (namely tuition). My main point is that there are fewer jobs than people willing to take them. Therefore, SOMEONE has to end up doing the crap jobs. Not everyone can be a plumber, electrician, carpenter or college educated worker. There's a million and one reasons that someone might not be able to find a position. I just don't see a point in punishing people just because they have a job that seems "beneath" others by forcing them to earn a wage that's not livable. Does it suck that there are grown adults working the counters? Sure does. But that's a fact of life and it's sure as hell better than them being homeless and completely reliant on welfare.

On 3. Don't kid yourself. The market can probably bear a MUCH LOWER wage than minimum wage if it weren't a law. Like I mentioned before, fewer jobs than people. Guess where the power is? Absolutely does not mean we should just remove it. On the flip side, who says the market can't bear a higher minimum wage? Other first world countries do it and are just fine. I don't think it'll cause apocalyptic inflation. I'm on the OPs side of this. I think it'll cause a modest rise in the price of some goods which higher wage earners will barely notice and that's about it. I'm sure there's some percentage of the population (between lower income and middle class) who will be impacted somewhat more but you can't condemn an entire demographic to poverty just to keep everyone else comfortable.

4) Yeah sorry, this is just blatant stereotyping with a hint of racism. A couple of points here:
a) Sure there's people who blow what little money they have on stupid stuff. But I also see a lot of people who can't afford a car and take the bus to work or have to run 2-3 jobs to make up their rent check. Don't lump everyone in together.
b) What business is it of anybody else how one's money is spent? Can we honestly say everyone on this forum is perfectly fiscally prudent (myself included)? Did you really need your designer clothes, watch, tv, computer, smartphone or whatever the hell else it is you fancy? I'm sure if we were all good savers here, we'd all own a house before we're 30 and be able to retire by 45. But we're not because we all like to spend money on stupid stuff (and vacations). The only difference is that we're (i'm assuming most ATOTers make at least middle class wage) not on welfare and we're using our own money to do it because we make. Why not extend that benefit to the poorest class? That way at least, our tax dollars won't directly be going to support whatever habits you think are endemic to the poor. Give them a livable wage so they can spend it prudently if they're smart or stupidly if they're not.

Entitlement is a term that carries negative connotation almost universally when referring to a person. People are using it in this thread as if McDonald's workers are each demanding a new Maserati and a BJ for free instead of asking for a bump in minimum wage which can maybe give them some ability to pay rent, be fed and have some clothes. God forbid you own a cell phone...
 

Connoisseur

Platinum Member
Sep 14, 2002
2,471
1
81
a job that requires the mental capacity of a 3rd grader, suddenly deserves nearly double the current min wage?
.

Just one more comment on this point. I think quite a lot of jobs can be accomplished by retarded chimps. Even those that require college degrees. I'm willing to bet that most people who get a job out of college utilize little to nothing they actually learned at college besides how to download lots of movies. The really only important question to ask is: Are they performing a service and is this service their primary source of income?

For minimum wage purposes, you can't start comparing types of jobs. Anything above and beyond minimum is rightfully determined by the industry. This isn't just about McDonald's either. It's about all min wage jobs, the majority of which are physically tiring, grueling and/or just plain suck.
 

bradley

Diamond Member
Jan 9, 2000
3,671
2
81
This is what $15 minimum wage will lead to

We already experienced it. Horn & Hardart opened the first food service automats in Philly and New York in 1902. They were successful enough until a slow gradual decline in the sixties, and finally became defunct in the nineties. They also faced huge opposition from unionized workers.

 
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Connoisseur

Platinum Member
Sep 14, 2002
2,471
1
81
This is what $15 minimum wage will lead to

And yet somehow neither of those countries has crippling unemployment or apocalyptic inflation (i'm assuming the first is the Netherlands and the second is Japan). I'm pretty sure vending machines are not reflective of economic health.

Doing some Wiki-Fu, the relative Purchasing Power for citizens of the Netherlands on minimum wage is significantly higher than that in the US and their unemployment rate is comparable to the US.
 

Ns1

No Lifer
Jun 17, 2001
55,414
1,574
126
And yet somehow neither of those countries has crippling unemployment or apocalyptic inflation (i'm assuming the first is the Netherlands and the second is Japan). I'm pretty sure vending machines are not reflective of economic health.

I never said that it was.

I'm just saying, as a business owner if you jacked up minimum wage to $15 you bet your ass I'm buying a whole bunch of machines to replace as many employees as I can.

I'm sure there are a ton of reasons for crippling unemployment, one of them being 24 months of paid federal vacation in the form of unemployment benefits.
 

IEC

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Jun 10, 2004
14,362
5,032
136
$15 an hour? Replace them all with machines.
 
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