TN Gaming Monitor or IPS All Round Monitor

[tweakboy]

The latency will cause FPS to not be like a CRT.. 6ms is actually pretty low for LED. If you turn on vsync I wonder if mouse will be laggy or instant like CRT and smooth, THere will be some ghosting and what not. I purchase these fancy monitor when they come out with 1ms latency. Thanks

 

[SirCanealot]

The whole situation is actually REALLY annoying me right now.

I currently have a 27" iiyama ProLite E2773HDS TN monitor (got it just before they released 120hz versions, doh!) -- so it's sort of a mid-end TN. The monitor claims 1ms input lag and it IS fast as hell. It's the closest any sort of non-CRT screen has gotten to CRT's response time (and I have a Samsung HD CRT behind my iiyama still for when I dust off my consoles every now and again).

Obviously with my TN monitor viewing angles are not good (vertical viewing angles are amazing -- if I'm playing anything from my bed, I have to prop the monitor up on something and angle it sharply downwards!) and colours are strictly average -- gamut is quite limited. Blacks are decent, however.

But I've been looking into getting a high end IPS monitor, but there's simply nothing that suits me. The ONLY thing that looks at all suitable would be the Korean 2k monitor with only a DVI, since they approach 1ms input lag, but I have a stupid GTX 680 with no DVI (only display port and 4 mini HDMIs, looool). And the overclocks aren't really at all guarantied with them. That and stuck pixels would drive me mad.

I'd be happy to spend £1000-2000 to get something that would be suitable for everything, but it DOESN'T EXIST.

DO YOU KNOW HOW FRUSTRATING THAT IS? ARGH!

So I'm going to stick with my cheap 60hz 1080p TN for now which my 680 can drive at max settings in most games and spend the money on cake instead!

 

[spat55]

I just tried my first IPS panel and was not impressed at all. its was the LG 23EA63V-P and I have already boxed it back up. black was grey and if I turned down the brightness enough to where it did not blind me then I could see almost nothing in dark scenes. Dead Space 3 looked like crap compared to other monitors I have used. and regardless of the claims, the viewing angles were hardly any better than my old TN panel Dell.

I think some of you are flat out full of crap or either borderline blind. its like you just want to like whatever you have bought that you don't even see the flaws. I am now at the point where I think I will never be able to find a new gaming monitor that does not piss me off.

That is your opinion, maybe you just got a slightly poop model? I know the blacks do lack on my monitor, but everything else is beautiful and the best view I have ever seen. I also think you are being to fussy, there are decent monitors out there, and maybe you just arn't putting enough money into it.

 

[Mark Rejhon]

IPS without a question. TN is discount panels with poor image quality.

Depends. There are people who prefer TN over IPS, due to motion clarity.
http://www.blurbusters.com/zero-motion-blur/testimonials/
This includes people who replaced IPS displays for LightBoost, because they found motion blur was more important.

So I'm going to stick with my cheap 60hz 1080p TN for now which my 680 can drive at max settings in most games and spend the money on cake instead!

Let me make things simple for you:
1. You are used to TN so anything is an upgrade.
2. You are used to CRT response time, so anything is an upgrade.
Just look at the Amazon Customer Reviews of VG248QE, a whopping 4.5 out of 5 stars. And that's a lower-quality 120Hz panel than the 27" models (VG278H and XL2720T).

I almost immediately put the order on hold when I started learning about the difference in TN vs IPS panels. TN are much faster (better for gaming, but the picture is horrible and colours are not accurate), and IPS (potentially higher resolution much better colour and image quality available, but possibly too slow for gaming).

That's a definite buying consideration, and you may prefer to buy IPS instead for sure. Fast IPS panels are relatively good for gaming now, but if you are sensitive to motion blur (e.g. you like the CRT look, plasma look, 120Hz look), then you may end up preferring TN over IPS. In an ideal world, you can go to a store and try both technologies out and try both for their pros and cons for your specific purposes. But that can be quite hard. If you are doing photo editing, then you want to lean more IPS, while if motion-blur-free gaming is the highest priority, you may want to lean towards 120Hz.

 

[The0ne]

If you're not a hardcore gamer that must have the response time then go IPS, no question and no doubt about it. Those precious ms matter little to the vast majority of gamers, myself included. Making a poor decision or a mistake in game mutes the whole point.

 

[Teizo]

If you're not a hardcore gamer that must have the response time then go IPS, no question and no doubt about it. Those precious ms matter little to the vast majority of gamers, myself included. Making a poor decision or a mistake in game mutes the whole point.

That's the truth. I remember when IPS used to be minimum 15ms or something like that and ghosting was terrible, and TN came out with 5ms response times and everyone was all it's the best thing since sliced bread...no motion blur, etc.

Now, all of a sudden...5ms is slow (which most good IPS's have). The blacks on my IPS are deep and rich with Ycbcr444 and I'd have to be looking through a telescope to see motion blur at 5ms. But, alas, some people claim it is there...so they prefer the lower response time. I will qualify my statement with the fact I have never seen a 144hz TN monitor with lightboost running so I can't vouch for the quality of the picture. But, if it close to IPS IQ...then gaming wise they probably are better so long as your gpu is fast enough to benefit.

 

[hans030390]

I just tried my first IPS panel and was not impressed at all. its was the LG 23EA63V-P and I have already boxed it back up. black was grey and if I turned down the brightness enough to where it did not blind me then I could see almost nothing in dark scenes. Dead Space 3 looked like crap compared to other monitors I have used. and regardless of the claims, the viewing angles were hardly any better than my old TN panel Dell.

I think some of you are flat out full of crap or either borderline blind. its like you just want to like whatever you have bought that you don't even see the flaws. I am now at the point where I think I will never be able to find a new gaming monitor that does not piss me off.

I just got a Qnix QX2710 in and tested it out a bit during my lunch break. The panel is just gorgeous...much better than any TN panel I've owned previously (it blows the VG248QE away in picture quality). This is before I even got a chance to tweak it at all. I know some have claimed (proven?) these Korean 1440p monitors use the same or similar panels Apple uses in their Cinema Displays, and I would not be surprised by that one bit based on how good this monitor looks.

I even tested 96Hz and 120Hz on it...didn't check for stability or anything, but both settings appeared to work just fine with the 20 seconds I spent trying them out. I also appear to have gotten a very nice unit...no dead pixels that I could see, and the backlight bleed was very minimal even in a completely dark room (it's very common to have issues with that on these monitors).

On the downside, if you're used to a TN panel with low motion blur and ghosting (not counting LightBoost), you might notice more motion blur/ghosting on the Qnix. I certainly do. I have yet to see how much I notice it while gaming. I'm not saying it's BAD by any means...it might be on par with an average TN panel that isn't heavily focused on reducing motion blur and such. However, if you're coming from LightBoost...LOL...the Qnix is a smearfest in comparison. But LightBoost has its own set of issues and compromises, not to mention it requires your games to run at least 100fps stable to prevent judder. Even with my OCed 2500k and 780, that's a tough proposition in some newer games, and I prefer keeping my settings high than having perfect clarity (at least, I feel that way for now...).

Honestly, unless you need LightBoost, an OCed IPS monitor is the way to go. If you don't want to mess with that, I'd go 120Hz TN. Some of those monitors are actually pretty decent, even from a picture quality standpoint. But, if picture accuracy is more important to you than gaming, I'd probably lean towards an IPS regardless of the refresh rate.

 

[Gryz]

I think we are all waiting for a 4K IPS 120+hz 24+ inch monitors. SHUT UP AND TAKE MY MONEY!

Missed one little detail there buddy.

Nope.
I would like a 1920x1200 monitor too, IPS, 27 inch, 120+Hz.

Not 4k. Not 2560x1600. Just 1920x1200. I don't care about my screen when I am on the desktop. I want my games to look good. And I want to play my games in 1920x1200. If I'd have a 4k screen, the extra pixels (4 times more) would just tax the framerates too much. So I would never run a game in 4k anyway. 1920x1200 is enough. Also, I really want 16:10 in stead of 16:9. And I suspect all 4k monitors will be 16:9.

So 1920x1200 it is. IPS, 27 inch, 120+Hz. Preferably with LightBoost, so I can run zero-motionblur.

How long do we need to wait ?

 

[Z15CAM]

I'd be happy to spend £1000-2000 to get something that would be suitable for everything, but it DOESN'T EXIST.

Consider 3 Korean 2650 x 1440 PLS (similar to IPS but a little faster) MATTE Displays in Vertical position running at 120 Hz for under $1000. The thing is you need at least 2 Radeon HD 7990's in CF ($1,400) or 3 Titans in SLI ($3000) to achieve a rewarding FPS for that monstrous 4320 x 2650 Res 4x3 aspect ratio. One $700 Sapphire HD 7990 should handle 60FPS.

That's just under $2400 with 3 QX2710's and 2 HD 7990's or say $1,700 with one HD 7990.

I'm considering the Sapphire HD 7990 for my one QX2710 for 1440p gaming but think I'll hold out till October and see what AMD has in store.

 

[Mark Rejhon]

So 1920x1200 it is. IPS, 27 inch, 120+Hz. Preferably with LightBoost, so I can run zero-motionblur.

If you don't mind 22 inch, here's your dream display:
Viewpixx Scientific Research LCD Display. 1200p, IPS, 120Hz, strobed!

Unfortunately, if you have to ask for the price, you can't afford it. It's for vision researchers / scientific purposes.

 

[Mark Rejhon]

That's the truth. I remember when IPS used to be minimum 15ms or something like that and ghosting was terrible, and TN came out with 5ms response times and everyone was all it's the best thing since sliced bread...no motion blur, etc.

Pixel transition times no longer determine motion blur when transition time is far less than 1 frame of refresh. Displays with 1ms, 2ms, 5ms, 8ms, often look almost the same. Most LCD's continuously shine their refreshes, which creates sample-and-hold motion blur, even if pixel transitions are instant (0ms).

Sample-and-hold is the major cause of motion blur on modern LCD's.
Just look at this: Web Animation of Sample-And-Hold Motion Blur

To really noticeably reduce motion blur on modern LCD's, you have to shorten the length of the visible refreshes -- either by higher refresh rate, or by adding black periods between refreshes (e.g. strobing LightBoost style). That's where dramatic further motion clarity improvement occur. Also, Eizo's FDF2405W new satellite mapping VA LCD display running 120Hz/240Hz is strobe backlight based too, doesn't use interpolation. And Viewpixx showed that 120Hz strobed IPS is possible. They're professional displays but it hints that better-quality 120Hz is coming eventually. I am personally excited.

 

[Throckmorton]

I'm going crazy to decide what to buy (I've put my order on hold and could use some help).

I ordered all the components to build a PC that I'm going to use for photo/video editing and my kids will use for gaming (I might start dabbling also ;D).

For the video card I ordered an NVIDIA GTX 770, and for the monitors I had ordered two Benq XL2420TE gaming monitors (144Hz, 1ms response time, 1080p).

I almost immediately put the order on hold when I started learning about the difference in TN vs IPS panels. TN are much faster (better for gaming, but the picture is horrible and colours are not accurate), and IPS (potentially higher resolution much better colour and image quality available, but possibly too slow for gaming).

I then started considering getting PA249Q from Asus (1920x1200, 6ms, 76Hz) which has top notch colour and image quality but I'm wondering if it will be too slow for gaming.

Another option is to get 1 of each monitor but that probably wouldn't work out that well.

Any advice would be appreciated.

Thanks,

Rob.

I have a PA248Q with the factory calibration and it's fine for gaming. No way would I choose a stupid TN monitor over this. For photo editing you have NO choice, a TN just won't work.

According to this thread though the PA249Q is wide gamut and has longer pixel response time than the PA248Q http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1756173

I would get the PA248Q since for photo editing you would want SRGB not wide gamut.

 

[taq8ojh]

I would like a 1920x1200 monitor too, IPS, 27 inch, 120+Hz.
Not 4k. Not 2560x1600. Just 1920x1200. I don't care about my screen when I am on the desktop. I want my games to look good. And I want to play my games in 1920x1200.Also, I really want 16:10 in stead of 16:9.

So 1920x1200 it is. IPS, 27 inch, 120+Hz. Preferably with LightBoost, so I can run zero-motionblur.

Finally someone I can relate to.

 

[PrincessFrosty]

This is a classic problem, unfortunately there is no panel type that is good at everything, no matter how much money you have.

I spent a great many years gaming on a 30" IPS panel, I loved the high resolution and the fantastic colors, however when dabbling in competitive gaming you could always notice the difference of 60hz and slower pixel response times.

I recently added a 120hz TN panel to my list of displays, partially for competitive gaming and partly for trying out the new stereoscopic 3d, it's actually the 120hz version of the BENQ monitor you considered.

The simple fact is that it depends on your preference, the 120hz is undoubtedly better for gaming, it's so much smoother and more responsive, but the colours and viewing angles are just crap, the IPS looks amazing but lacks that responsive edge.

Ultimately if you can get both then you'll get the best of both words, obviously you can use 2 monitors and span your desktop, and it's a click of a button to switch for whatever application you want to use.

If you're doing design work and care about colour accuracy and you want to do it professionally you NEED an IPS panel, bottom line.

Ignore the people saying you can overclock IPS panels, the pixel response time of the IPS technology isn't high enough to support this gimmick.

 

[taq8ojh]

I have TN panel based monitor in next room, so I have direct and semi-instant comparison possibility when looking at anything, and I can honestly say there are no powers in this or another world that would force me to play games on TN panel. The colour difference is just way too big to swallow.

 

[Gams]

Thanks everyone for your input.

I decided to change my order to the two Asus PA249Q AH-IPS panels.

We will just be casual gamers and if the boys get more serious in the next couple years we can always buy a gaming monitor then.

Here are the full specifications:

http://www.asus.com/Monitors_Projectors/PA249Q/#specifications


The main highlights for me are (I'm giving priority to the photo editing):

Resolution: 1920x1200
Response Time : 6ms (Gray to Gray)
Viewing Angle (CR≧10) : 178°(H)/178°(V)
Display Colors : 1073.7M (10bit)
Colour Accuracy: True, consistent color with 99% Adobe RGB, 100% sRGB, and 120% NTSC
Brightness(Max) : 350 cd/㎡
Swivel : Yes
Pivot : Yes

It's certainly expensive (overpriced) but I think I will be happy working on these day to day so I'm hoping it will be worth it.

Some of the monitors suggested in the thread look great and interesting at better value, so thanks again for your suggestions and help.

Cheers,

Rob.

 

[Teizo]

That's an awesome monitor. You will be very pleased when you get it and see just how good in the color reproduction is.

 

[Throckmorton]

Thanks everyone for your input.

I decided to change my order to the two Asus PA249Q AH-IPS panels.

We will just be casual gamers and if the boys get more serious in the next couple years we can always buy a gaming monitor then.

Here are the full specifications:

http://www.asus.com/Monitors_Projectors/PA249Q/#specifications


The main highlights for me are (I'm giving priority to the photo editing):

Resolution: 1920x1200
Response Time : 6ms (Gray to Gray)
Viewing Angle (CR≧10) : 178°(H)/178°(V)
Display Colors : 1073.7M (10bit)
Colour Accuracy: True, consistent color with 99% Adobe RGB, 100% sRGB, and 120% NTSC
Brightness(Max) : 350 cd/㎡
Swivel : Yes
Pivot : Yes

It's certainly expensive (overpriced) but I think I will be happy working on these day to day so I'm hoping it will be worth it.

Some of the monitors suggested in the thread look great and interesting at better value, so thanks again for your suggestions and help.

Cheers,

Rob.

You don't want Adobe RGB unless you actually need that for your editing purposes, like for a professional print lab. For web and sharing pics with your friends, you need sRGB

Edit: Looks like it has an sRGB mode. Looks like an awesome monitor http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pm083Sl6J8o

 

[Gams]

Yes, it comes factor pre-calibrated and has won awards for it's colour accuracy.

I do intend on printing shots taken with my Nikon D600 edited in Lightroom. I understand that images going to the web have to be converted to sRGB, it sounds like if I want the most accurate prints I should have a calibrated monitor with as wide a colour range as possible and I can convert to whatever is the best option the print shops have.

I found a nice explanation of sRGB vs Adobe RGB here: http://fstoppers.com/adobergb-vs-srgb

I'll be getting back into photography after a few year hiatus (I've forgotten most of what I had learned about matching colour spaces - I'll have to relearn) ;D.

Cheers.

 

[taq8ojh]

I wonder if AH-IPS is much better than H-IPS.

 

[PrincessFrosty]

Thanks everyone for your input.

I decided to change my order to the two Asus PA249Q AH-IPS panels.

We will just be casual gamers and if the boys get more serious in the next couple years we can always buy a gaming monitor then..

Good choice IMO, it's what I would have gone with.

TN panels are also much cheaper and so you can pick one up later on easily, gaming on 60hz is still a perfectly decent experience. Even though I have 2 high quality panels side by side right now 1 TN and 1 IPS I sometimes pick the IPS for gaming, each have their pros AND cons, the only really decent solution is to have one of each IMO