Toddler kills himself with mother's gun

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Phoenix86

Lifer
May 21, 2003
14,643
9
81
So the status quo is A-OK in regards to accidental gun deaths?

What about criminal gun deaths?

What about if we had substantially less single-person gun murders but continued to have national massacres like we just did a couple days ago?
Accidental, probably. I knew it was low, but I had no idea it was that low.

Criminal, no way. However, I don't think gun control is an effective way to reduce thiss.

What-ifs are the death of discussions. Again, I don't think gun control is an effective way to prevent those types of incidents. These are social issues and have to be dealt with as such. Why was he crazy? What could we have done better to identify and treat it?
 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
38,548
349
126
Again, I don't think gun control is an effective way to prevent those types of incidents.

Good point.

Australia had a mass killing, passed gun laws, and it didn't reduce them at all.

Oh wait.

It's been 20 years and they haven't had one since.
 

shortylickens

No Lifer
Jul 15, 2003
82,854
17,365
136
Good point.

Australia had a mass killing, passed gun laws, and it didn't reduce them at all.

Oh wait.

It's been 20 years and they haven't had one since.

America had mass killings, passed gun laws, and it didn't reduce them at all.

Oh wait.

Thats exactly how it happened in America.
 

Fenixgoon

Lifer
Jun 30, 2003
31,823
10,361
136
Good point.

Australia had a mass killing, passed gun laws, and it didn't reduce them at all.

Oh wait.

It's been 20 years and they haven't had one since.

did australia have a constitution that ensured a right to bear arms, and did australia have the number of firearms that the US does? (> 1 per person)

and let's not forget crime in australia is different than crime in the US.

and even if you legally confiscated all firearms, i'm guessing you'd still see about 5-10,000 deaths per year (illegally owned/obtained firearms still in circulation). suicide rate by firearm would probably drop like a rock though (currently about 18,000/yr).
 

mikeford

Diamond Member
Jan 27, 2001
5,671
160
106
Australia is an ISLAND, America has two huge porous borders.

We also have a constitution that is NOT likely to be changed regarding the second amendment rights. Fix the crazy people because you aren't disarming the US.
 

fuzzybabybunny

Moderator<br>Digital & Video Cameras
Moderator
Jan 2, 2006
10,455
35
91
Accidental, probably. I knew it was low, but I had no idea it was that low.

Criminal, no way. However, I don't think gun control is an effective way to reduce thiss.

What-ifs are the death of discussions. Again, I don't think gun control is an effective way to prevent those types of incidents. These are social issues and have to be dealt with as such. Why was he crazy? What could we have done better to identify and treat it?

Then what are your ideas for an effective way to reduce gun-related crime without gun control? I still haven't heard the "reasonable" legislation you say you would support.
 

PliotronX

Diamond Member
Oct 17, 1999
8,883
107
106
http://www.wcpo.com/news/local-news...ld-hamilton-boy-who-shot-himself-with-her-gun

It was a Ruger LC9.
And that surprises me.


The Ruger pocket pistols have very heavy triggers. A 3 year old shouldnt have been able to pull it.
The LC9 is also supposed to have a manual safety, but I guess it wouldnt be difficult to accidentally flip.
Three year olds have fairly strong thumbs which makes sense since it was aimed at his chest. Toddlers and firearms just don't mix. Purse carry is such a bad idea.
 

Phoenix86

Lifer
May 21, 2003
14,643
9
81
Then what are your ideas for an effective way to reduce gun-related crime without gun control? I still haven't heard the "reasonable" legislation you say you would support.

And I'm still waiting for your to propose something instead of assume I have the answer. Again, you said change is needed.

What change are you suggesting?
What does that change intend to address?

I just know that many of the current gun control laws won't stop the thing they were created for.
 

fuzzybabybunny

Moderator<br>Digital & Video Cameras
Moderator
Jan 2, 2006
10,455
35
91
And I'm still waiting for your to propose something instead of assume I have the answer. Again, you said change is needed.

What change are you suggesting?
What does that change intend to address?

I just know that many of the current gun control laws won't stop the thing they were created for.
I just assumed that your criticisms and attacks were coming from a place where you had a more constructive alternative(s) that would further the discussion.
 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
38,548
349
126
did australia have a constitution that ensured a right to bear arms, and did australia have the number of firearms that the US does? (> 1 per person)

and let's not forget crime in australia is different than crime in the US.

and even if you legally confiscated all firearms, i'm guessing you'd still see about 5-10,000 deaths per year (illegally owned/obtained firearms still in circulation). suicide rate by firearm would probably drop like a rock though (currently about 18,000/yr).

I think an Australian mass shooter isn't all that different from an American mass shooter.

Admittedly our number of guns is an issue, and it doesn't end all murder.
 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
38,548
349
126
Australia is an ISLAND, America has two huge porous borders.

We also have a constitution that is NOT likely to be changed regarding the second amendment rights. Fix the crazy people because you aren't disarming the US.

Our two porous borders are not the issue for the US. We do not and would not have massive importing of guns across the borders. It's the other way around - Mexican cartels shop here.
 

CoPhotoGuy

Senior member
Nov 16, 2014
452
0
0
"Knowing" doesn't mean they are. It just takes one time, being in a rush, forgetting something, or numerous other mistakes, to lead to an act of irresponsibility.

But a responsible gun owner doesn't rush or act irresponsibly. I don't think you truly understand how serious we take our guns.
 

Phoenix86

Lifer
May 21, 2003
14,643
9
81
I just assumed that your criticisms and attacks were coming from a place where you had a more constructive alternative(s) that would further the discussion.

And I assumed when you said something should be changed you'd have a proposal instead of spinning your wheels and blaming me for you not having an idea.

Bold strategy, Cotton.
 

fuzzybabybunny

Moderator<br>Digital & Video Cameras
Moderator
Jan 2, 2006
10,455
35
91
And I assumed when you said something should be changed you'd have a proposal instead of spinning your wheels and blaming me for you not having an idea.

Bold strategy, Cotton.
Wow, you're pretty good at being respectful.
 

mikeford

Diamond Member
Jan 27, 2001
5,671
160
106
Kind of idiotic. Obviously my point is the gun laws I'm talking about were not passed.

No all guns were not outlawed, just meaningless crazy restrictions infringing on second amendment rights.

As for the border issue, look at Baltimore, highly restrictive gun laws, daily murders. The level of restriction just means honest people are disarmed, doesn't stop criminal use a bit when the border isn't closed to sources.
 

Man I Suck

Member
Apr 21, 2015
170
0
0
She's guilty, but I'm not sure they should charge her either. It makes about as much sense as prosecuting someone for getting their arm caught in a wood chipper. Yeah maybe they shouldn't have done it, but isn't the result punishment enough?

She needs to be chemically castrated and not be allowed to own firearms. She can't be responsible with either one, so she should not be allowed to have either.
 
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