"Tom Brady prefer his balls to feel a certain way" - balls underinflated

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rudeguy

Lifer
Dec 27, 2001
47,371
14
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The report admits that there is no direct evidence; just indirect and innuendo. Assumptions that because one person said something; that Brady had to have been responsible.

Because the NFL allowed this issue (game) to potentially go forward and their own officials did nothing to ensure the integrity; the league is as much responsible and they want to claim Brady is.

They were gunning for the Patriots; possbile because of the Raven's game

There is evidence Tom likes his balls deflated.
There is evidence balls were deflated.
Tom did not report the balls being deflated.

This is not a murder trial. There is no "beyond a reasonable doubt". Tom and the Pats cheated and I hope the whole team is punished well beyond what the Saints got.
 
Mar 10, 2005
14,647
2
0
The report admits that there is no direct evidence; just indirect and innuendo. Assumptions that because one person said something; that Brady had to have been responsible.

Because the NFL allowed this issue (game) to potentially go forward and their own officials did nothing to ensure the integrity; the league is as much responsible and they want to claim Brady is.

They were gunning for the Patriots; possbile because of the Raven's game

that's a very good point. i, like most, was surprised to hear that the league does (did) not maintain custody of game balls and had no structure for their testing. such poorly constructed rules are inevitably going to be abused across an entire league.
 
Mar 10, 2005
14,647
2
0
There is evidence Tom likes his balls deflated.
There is evidence balls were deflated.
Tom did not report the balls being deflated.

This is not a murder trial. There is no "beyond a reasonable doubt". Tom and the Pats cheated and I hope the whole team is punished well beyond what the Saints got.

worse than the saints got for making deliberate serious injuries an official policy? GTFO

again, the evidence you speak of does not exist. if a penalty is applied without proof, the next stop is victory in a courtroom.
 
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BUTCH1

Lifer
Jul 15, 2000
20,433
1,769
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There is evidence Tom likes his balls deflated.
There is evidence balls were deflated.
Tom did not report the balls being deflated.

This is not a murder trial. There is no "beyond a reasonable doubt". Tom and the Pats cheated and I hope the whole team is punished well beyond what the Saints got.

I agree punishment is deserved but the Saints were punished very harshly because it involved players getting bonuses for injuring opposing players, I can't see letting a pound of PSI out of some balls compared to that as that serious. Certain injuries can destroy someone's entire career.
 

rudeguy

Lifer
Dec 27, 2001
47,371
14
61
worse than the saints got for making deliberate serious injuries an official policy? GTFO

again, the evidence you speak of does not exist. if a penalty is applied without proof, the next stop is victory in a courtroom.

Evidence doesn't exist? Do you live in some altered state of reality?

And I highly doubt Tom wants this in a court room. His texts and emails would be subpoenaed and he would be screwed.

Do you deny Tom cheated?
 

rudeguy

Lifer
Dec 27, 2001
47,371
14
61
I agree punishment is deserved but the Saints were punished very harshly because it involved players getting bonuses for injuring opposing players, I can't see letting a pound of PSI out of some balls compared to that as that serious. Certain injuries can destroy someone's entire career.

And the NFL needs to send a message that cheating will not be tolerated.
 
Mar 10, 2005
14,647
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Evidence doesn't exist? Do you live in some altered state of reality?

nope, just this reality:

The report admits that there is no direct evidence; just indirect and innuendo. Assumptions that because one person said something; that Brady had to have been responsible.

Do you deny Tom cheated?

i don't know what happened, to what extent, or who was involved. and neither do you.
 

BUTCH1

Lifer
Jul 15, 2000
20,433
1,769
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And the NFL needs to send a message that cheating will not be tolerated.

I'm sure they will, this will not be fines only, it will involve suspension(s). While I doubt the 1-1.3 PSI gave Brady much of any advantage the fact that he knowingly encouraged others to break the rules is enough. One wonders if the league would have waited till after the SB to start the investigation Brady might have possibly come clean but the team is scheduled to play in the SB it's possible he did not want to jeopardize being suspended for the game. Like I had mentioned earlier, the league could have issued a warning to all the teams about illegal tampering with game balls and this embarrassing for all situation would not exist. Yea, I get it that the Pat's or any other team does not deserve any "warning" not to tamper, but now you are forced to suspend the SB winning QB and had the Colts game been a close one and they lost, the Colts as a team would be rightly pissed off, you would have wanted the Ref's to re-check the balls again prior to the start of the game. not wait till halftime to check ball pressure.
 

rudeguy

Lifer
Dec 27, 2001
47,371
14
61
I'm sure they will, this will not be fines only, it will involve suspension(s). While I doubt the 1-1.3 PSI gave Brady much of any advantage the fact that he knowingly encouraged others to break the rules is enough. One wonders if the league would have waited till after the SB to start the investigation Brady might have possibly come clean but the team is scheduled to play in the SB it's possible he did not want to jeopardize being suspended for the game. Like I had mentioned earlier, the league could have issued a warning to all the teams about illegal tampering with game balls and this embarrassing for all situation would not exist. Yea, I get it that the Pat's or any other team does not deserve any "warning" not to tamper, but now you are forced to suspend the SB winning QB and had the Colts game been a close one and they lost, the Colts as a team would be rightly pissed off, you would have wanted the Ref's to re-check the balls again prior to the start of the game. not wait till halftime to check ball pressure.

None of that matters.

You don't fucking cheat. Period. Besides, there is no reasonable person who believes this only happened in one game. He cheated and if it were my call, he would forfeit all pay from last year and be banned for life.
 
Mar 10, 2005
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None of that matters.

You don't fucking cheat. Period. Besides, there is no reasonable person who believes this only happened in one game. He cheated and if it were my call, he would forfeit all pay from last year and be banned for life.

good thing it's not your call, because you apparently have no grasp of business or law.
 

BUTCH1

Lifer
Jul 15, 2000
20,433
1,769
126
None of that matters.

You don't fucking cheat. Period. Besides, there is no reasonable person who believes this only happened in one game. He cheated and if it were my call, he would forfeit all pay from last year and be banned for life.

Your into LOL territory. If you think Brady is the 1st NFL player caught breaking a rule you don't follow football very much. I do agree with you though in that he should be punished, but a lifetime ban? let the punishment fit the crime as they say, 2-4 games and a hefty $$ for the team.
 

Capt Caveman

Lifer
Jan 30, 2005
34,547
651
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None of that matters.

You don't fucking cheat. Period. Besides, there is no reasonable person who believes this only happened in one game. He cheated and if it were my call, he would forfeit all pay from last year and be banned for life.

Pretty funny how not a single QB in the league currently has said a word on the subject. Luck should be banned too since the Indy balls were deflated?

Funny thing is in all the texts there's not a single one talking about deflating the ball below the limit. And gotta love how the refs inflate the balls out of regulation to 16psi. Ban the refs too.

Believe in the NFL rule book, the penalty is a $25k fine.

Should the Panthers and Vikings all be banned when they were caught heating balls in the middle of a game?
 

BUTCH1

Lifer
Jul 15, 2000
20,433
1,769
126
Pretty funny how not a single QB in the league currently has said a word on the subject. Luck should be banned too since the Indy balls were deflated?

Funny thing is in all the texts there's not a single one talking about deflating the ball below the limit. And gotta love how the refs inflate the balls out of regulation to 16psi. Ban the refs too.

Believe in the NFL rule book, the penalty is a $25k fine.

Should the Panthers and Vikings all be banned when they were caught heating balls in the middle of a game?

I'm sure people (specially QB's) try and "bend" rules all the time, Brady's problem is he was asked point-blank if anything like that (ball-tampering) was happening and he flat-out denied it, but the text's are pretty damming. I'd like to defend TB12 here but after reading the text's I just can't and I'm still baffled as to why he would be involved with this crap. Every situation has a "risk/reward" element attached to it and I just don't think the reward was worth the risk here. Even more moronic is the three of them sending text's on their own personal phones, if your involved with breaking NFL rules for God's sake use a $30 pre-pay bought by someone that can't be traced to you, these guys would make lousy criminals.
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
110,821
29,574
146
There is evidence Tom likes his balls deflated.
There is evidence balls were deflated.
Tom did not report the balls being deflated.

This is not a murder trial. There is no "beyond a reasonable doubt". Tom and the Pats cheated and I hope the whole team is punished well beyond what the Saints got.

Man, imagine if you ascribed this level of certain validation to all types of data, like when it comes to peer-reviewed science, and you know--things that actually matter.

there isn't even a single smoking gun here.

 
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techs

Lifer
Sep 26, 2000
28,561
4
0
I knew this "scandal" would have legs but its just going to keep on going past kickoff 2015 the way things are going.
 

GagHalfrunt

Lifer
Apr 19, 2001
25,297
2,001
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Every situation has a "risk/reward" element attached to it and I just don't think the reward was worth the risk here.

Brady and the Pats obviously think the reward was worth the risk, otherwise they would not have done it. No matter how you interpret the oft-discussed fumble data, the Patriots seem to be an outlier. Tommy and his minions were risking a lot of money, a lengthy suspension and a pretty big scandal to do it, so they apparently saw a sizable potential reward and the data suggests they got it.
 

BUTCH1

Lifer
Jul 15, 2000
20,433
1,769
126
Brady and the Pats obviously think the reward was worth the risk, otherwise they would not have done it. No matter how you interpret the oft-discussed fumble data, the Patriots seem to be an outlier. Tommy and his minions were risking a lot of money, a lengthy suspension and a pretty big scandal to do it, so they apparently saw a sizable potential reward and the data suggests they got it.

I'm not sure if your familiar with BB's coaching style, if you fumble, you sit. Most fumbles are actually balls that are stripped away from a player and I just do not think 1-1.3 PSI is going to make a dramatic difference.
 

KMFJD

Lifer
Aug 11, 2005
29,701
43,970
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Cheating is part of all sports, the only thing bad about it is getting caught
 

GagHalfrunt

Lifer
Apr 19, 2001
25,297
2,001
126
I'm not sure if your familiar with BB's coaching style, if you fumble, you sit. Most fumbles are actually balls that are stripped away from a player and I just do not think 1-1.3 PSI is going to make a dramatic difference.

The 1-1.3 PSI or whatever it was made a dramatic enough difference to be worth the risk of being caught. That's the part you're not getting. These guys have footballs in their hands every day, they test balls that are over-inflated, under-inflated and properly inflated. Tom looked at the under-inflated balls, tested the under-inflated balls and thought "boy, I'm screwed if I get caught, let's do it anyway." He most definitely did not do that on a whim and he did not do it without a damn good reason. While you, in your professional opinion (hey, what position do you play anyway?) do not think there's a dramatic difference BRADY DOES. He saw a big enough difference to make it worth cheating. It can't be explained any more simply than that.
 
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