No, you just don't get to arbitrarily choose what is Historic though. First Black US President is Historic.
Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
Originally posted by: sandorski
It doesn't really matter what you accept or reject. It is Historic because of past History.
By that logic, everything is historic.
ZV
Originally posted by: sandorski
Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
Originally posted by: sandorski
It doesn't really matter what you accept or reject. It is Historic because of past History.
By that logic, everything is historic.
ZV
No, you just don't get to arbitrarily choose what is Historic though. First Half-White US President is Historic.
Originally posted by: SparkyJJO
Goodbye choice of my doctor, been nice knowing you
Goodbye freedom of speech, been nice knowing you
Goodbye 2nd Amendment, been nice knowing you
Goodbye paycheck, been nice knowing you
Goodbye cheap electricity, been nice knowing you
Hello 4 years of hell
:frown:
Originally posted by: Cogman
Whatever happens, it will be an interesting 4 years for sure. Now the dems control everything, house, senate, president, and media. At very least this should have been a wakeup call to the republican party "Hey, your candidates suck. We are sick and tired of having some of the worst candidates in history run for president"
I just pray that the "Spread the wealth" and the universal health care don't make it. They'll cause way more issues for everyone. If you think health care is bad now, just wait for it to be run by the government.
Originally posted by: sandorski
Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
Originally posted by: sandorski
It doesn't really matter what you accept or reject. It is Historic because of past History.
By that logic, everything is historic.
ZV
No, you just don't get to arbitrarily choose what is Historic though. First Black US President is Historic.
Originally posted by: sandorski
Originally posted by: Mursilis
Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
By and large, the people who are calling this "historic" are middle-class white folks who want to be able to pat themselves on the back and use this as reassurance that they really aren't prejudiced because, after all, they just elected an African American to the Presidency.
ZV
They may also be white folks who want to shed all the liberal guilt dumped on them constantly, and the associated package, such as affirmative action, race-based gerrymandering of voting districts, and the like. Hopefully, electing a black president means we can start abandoning gov't-sponsored racism as social policy.
Just last week I was talking with my brother-in-law about some of this, as his daughter (my niece) is preparing to apply for college, with her first choice being a state school. She's equal parts asian and hispanic, so she's torn between what race classification box to check on her admission form. All her advisors are telling her checking hispanic will increase her odds of getting into a state school, so that's the way she's going. It's absurd she even has to think about this - why is her race even relevant, why is the state even asking about it, and why does choosing one block over another magically increase her chances of getting admitted?
History. Sins of the Father and all that Jazz.
Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
Originally posted by: sandorski
Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
Originally posted by: sandorski
It doesn't really matter what you accept or reject. It is Historic because of past History.
By that logic, everything is historic.
ZV
No, you just don't get to arbitrarily choose what is Historic though. First Black US President is Historic.
Give me one good reason why this is so. At most, it is a trailing indicator and so marks that the turning point is already well behind us. It certainly does not mark the turning point itself.
In terms of political theory or governmental model, Obama represents nothing new or revolutionary. That's not necessarily a bad thing, it just means this really isn't "historic" in any important sense.
ZV
Originally posted by: Mursilis
Originally posted by: sandorski
Originally posted by: Mursilis
Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
By and large, the people who are calling this "historic" are middle-class white folks who want to be able to pat themselves on the back and use this as reassurance that they really aren't prejudiced because, after all, they just elected an African American to the Presidency.
ZV
They may also be white folks who want to shed all the liberal guilt dumped on them constantly, and the associated package, such as affirmative action, race-based gerrymandering of voting districts, and the like. Hopefully, electing a black president means we can start abandoning gov't-sponsored racism as social policy.
Just last week I was talking with my brother-in-law about some of this, as his daughter (my niece) is preparing to apply for college, with her first choice being a state school. She's equal parts asian and hispanic, so she's torn between what race classification box to check on her admission form. All her advisors are telling her checking hispanic will increase her odds of getting into a state school, so that's the way she's going. It's absurd she even has to think about this - why is her race even relevant, why is the state even asking about it, and why does choosing one block over another magically increase her chances of getting admitted?
History. Sins of the Father and all that Jazz.
Hilarious, since her mother wasn't even born here, and her father is first-generation American-born. It's not like her (mixed) race has held her back one bit; heck, she was voted homecoming queen. And her family is in no way "disadvantaged" - they're definitely upper class or upper middle class. She's got good grades and diverse talents - that's what should get her into college, not because she can claim membership in some "special" racial group.
Originally posted by: sandorski
Oy vey. Forget it. Others will be writing the History Books, they'll write it in as Historic.
Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
Originally posted by: sandorski
Oy vey. Forget it. Others will be writing the History Books, they'll write it in as Historic.
Oh, I agree that it will be written as historic. My comment is more about the sort of trivial things that tend to become "historic moments".
Obama is a highly-educated legal scholar and, while I tend to disagree with him in an academic sense, I have a lot of respect for his intelligence and his dedication to what he believes is right. I think it's a tragedy that, instead of going down in history as a well-educated and highly-intelligent scholar and statesman, he is now very likely to be remember almost exclusively as only, "the first African-American to be elected as President of the United States". I think that rather does him a disservice.
ZV
Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
Originally posted by: sandorski
Oy vey. Forget it. Others will be writing the History Books, they'll write it in as Historic.
Oh, I agree that it will be written as historic. My comment is more about the sort of trivial things that tend to become "historic moments".
Obama is a highly-educated legal scholar and, while I tend to disagree with him in an academic sense, I have a lot of respect for his intelligence and his dedication to what he believes is right. I think it's a tragedy that, instead of going down in history as a well-educated and highly-intelligent scholar and statesman, he is now very likely to be remember almost exclusively as only, "the first African-American to be elected as President of the United States". I think that rather does him a disservice.
ZV
Originally posted by: loki8481
every gay rights issue on the ballots across this country went down in flames.
I'm not especially proud of America today.
Originally posted by: sandorski
Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
Originally posted by: sandorski
Oy vey. Forget it. Others will be writing the History Books, they'll write it in as Historic.
Oh, I agree that it will be written as historic. My comment is more about the sort of trivial things that tend to become "historic moments".
Obama is a highly-educated legal scholar and, while I tend to disagree with him in an academic sense, I have a lot of respect for his intelligence and his dedication to what he believes is right. I think it's a tragedy that, instead of going down in history as a well-educated and highly-intelligent scholar and statesman, he is now very likely to be remember almost exclusively as only, "the first African-American to be elected as President of the United States". I think that rather does him a disservice.
ZV
At the end of his Presidency, more will be added, Good and Bad.
Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
Originally posted by: sandorski
Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
Originally posted by: sandorski
Oy vey. Forget it. Others will be writing the History Books, they'll write it in as Historic.
Oh, I agree that it will be written as historic. My comment is more about the sort of trivial things that tend to become "historic moments".
Obama is a highly-educated legal scholar and, while I tend to disagree with him in an academic sense, I have a lot of respect for his intelligence and his dedication to what he believes is right. I think it's a tragedy that, instead of going down in history as a well-educated and highly-intelligent scholar and statesman, he is now very likely to be remember almost exclusively as only, "the first African-American to be elected as President of the United States". I think that rather does him a disservice.
ZV
At the end of his Presidency, more will be added, Good and Bad.
And yet, he will always be remembered first for a genetic accident and not for any actual achievements. The achievements will, in the minds of the vast majority, be a footnote to his race. This is quite sad.
ZV
Originally posted by: SparkyJJO
Goodbye choice of my doctor, been nice knowing you
Goodbye freedom of speech, been nice knowing you
Goodbye 2nd Amendment, been nice knowing you
Goodbye paycheck, been nice knowing you
Goodbye cheap electricity, been nice knowing you
Hello 4 years of hell
:frown:
Originally posted by: brandonbull
Originally posted by: loki8481
every gay rights issue on the ballots across this country went down in flames.
I'm not especially proud of America today.
Why? Because a minority wanted their opinions over a majority?
Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
You know, I really question the "America should be proud" comments and the "this is an historic moment" comments. I mean, let's look at what really happened:
What happened was the landslide victory of a Democratic candidate from a city renowned for creating strong politicians at a time when there is overwhelming disgust with the incumbent and when the incumbent's party is directionless and fragmented. Frankly, in this election, the Democratic party ought to have been able to put a head of cabbage up as their candidate and still manage a victory. No-one in his or her right mind would have thought that there was any significant chance of a Republican victory regardless of candidates.
What, then, makes this "historic"? What makes it a "great event"? Obama is educated, intelligent, and has an exceptional presence in public. He is the sort of candidate that is an obvious choice and an obvious winner. There is nothing new or unusual about Obama's policies; his platform is solidly Democratic. His voting record shows no more real attempts at bipartisanship than any other politician's does. In every way, Obama is a typical Democratic candidate. He is an extremely good typical Democratic candidate, but policy-wise he is little different from Clinton, Carter, or Johnson. So why is this historic?
It's not.
I am interested to see how Obama fares. I think he has the ability to do quite well and I hope that he is able to take advantage of his potential, but I hardly think that this is an historic event.
By and large, the people who are calling this "historic" are middle-class white folks who want to be able to pat themselves on the back and use this as reassurance that they really aren't prejudiced because, after all, they just elected an African American to the Presidency.
ZV
Originally posted by: brandonbull
Originally posted by: loki8481
every gay rights issue on the ballots across this country went down in flames.
I'm not especially proud of America today.
Why? Because a minority wanted their opinions over a majority?
Originally posted by: brandonbull
Originally posted by: loki8481
every gay rights issue on the ballots across this country went down in flames.
I'm not especially proud of America today.
Why? Because a minority wanted their opinions over a majority?
Originally posted by: ch33zw1z
Originally posted by: tamaron
I am really glad of this victory, but what I like most is the fact that we are free of that stupid ex-president. The worst USA president that I know: two wars, broken economy, no social policy and proud to be uneducated.
He was a BIG danger, and by extension, he made that the people of the world felt that America was a danger too... very sad... and a false statement that you CAN change americans.
And he's still in office for 3 more months...:thumbsdown: