Transmission for 07 Volvo XC90

[Snyderman7]

Hoping someone knows enough to guide me here.. I just purchased a 2007 Volvo XC90, V8 AWD w/ 6-speed tranny. It had 78k miles. I just drove it diagonally across the country about 4000 miles. Along the way, I noticed (fairly soon) that when I got off the highway, the car would shudder at 1500 rpms. I could stop this shuddering by increasing the rpms, either by accelerating, or by manually downshifting in tiptronic mode. I also came to notice that this shuddering only occurred when the engine was hot, but didn't seem to occur when the engine was cold. I immediately took it in to my volvo dealer, and they told me that a) someone had put incorrect fluid in at some point, either by mistake, or because they were trying to correct an existing problem, and that b) they recommended i get a new transmission for 6700 dollars. I asked about replacing the transmission fluid, and they responded that it would be a waste of money. I've read on another forum, though, that someone with the same car, having the same problem, replaced their cheap fluid with the proper and expensive synthetic, and that the studdering went away. I don't know however if that was a lasting fix, or just a temporary bandaid. At this point however, I don't see why the car isn't driveable, and feel like I should take the chance with replacing the fluid. It seems like the fluid alone can cause this studdering problem, because the viscosity is throwing off the pressure sensors. Am I wrong? If i have to replace the tranny anyway, is there any further damage that could occur by not doing it immediately? Thanks!

 

[SearchMaster]

First of all, for a diagnosis that expensive you should absolutely get another opinion.

And I think a fluid flush as a first attempt at fixing the problem is a good idea. My wife has an '07 Odyssey with the infamous Honda transmission. Hers was acting funny and a fluid flush fixed it.

Lastly, even if it does need a new transmission, I'd look around. Surely you can find a rebuilt or even a new unit from an independent mechanic that costs half that.

 

[Insomniator]

dealers are barely useful for even a decent diagnosis

They tell u a fluid change would be a waste of money after saying you need to spend 6700 on a new transmission? lol...

change the fluid, then find a new mechanic that isnt a total rip off if that doesnt work

 

[ThatsABigOne]

If you JUST purchased your car, you can try get it fixed from a dealer that you bought it from. Even though they might sell it AS IS, dealers like to get the highest reviews.

 

[nitrous9200]

A fluid change shouldn't cost more than $200 and seems to cure a lot of auto transmission problems. You won't know until you actually do it, and you don't have much to lose by trying it. The early XC90's used a GM transmission that had a lot of problems, but I don't think that is related to your year. I believe there's an ex-Volvo mechanic on this board who should have a pretty good idea of what's going on with your car.

 

[phucheneh]

Pat yourself on the back for not buying the T6. But maybe smack yourself a little for buying any XC90. It's a 5000lb SUV on a 3500lb car chassis. Barring anything else, you will put suspension parts on it if you want it to drive right and not make pops, clunks, creaks, and other racket.

The Yamaha V8 is a good motor (yep, Yamaha). And the TF80 is not a bad trans. At least, the GM trans in the 6cyls makes it look like fuckin' spaceship technology. Old 6cyls, that is, not the newer 3.2's (NA or single turbo)- I'm not positive what trans they use, but it's probably Aisin.

They had problems in the earlier years that were rectified by 05 or 06. There might be upgraded software available for your TCM, still, though. Also, if a flush is done, the TCM needs to be told about it. It is sensitive to changes in the fluid characteristics, and expects them to change in a predictable way as the trans ages. Changing the fluid is like putting a keyboard in front of your cat and telling it to write a novel. It is absolutely baffled. And it may scratch your eyes out for spite.

It is also not like a lot of transmissions that can take a generic bottle of 'DexMerc.' It wants its OEM fluid. I would not put anything in it that doesn't say 'Volvo' on the bottle. On a lube-related note, you may want to get some for your butt before you go to the dealer to buy it for the trans. I believe it's made of premium genetically engineered ground-up babies.

Do not buy any other fluid under the guise of 'hey, other manufacturers use the same trans!' Nope, they don't, because the TCM (trans computer) is a pretty important part of your [computer-controlled] transmission. And this guy programmed it with his own special blend:

I believe it's the same fluid as the AW55. Dealers will probably not want to perform flushes because it's a liability thing. If they think it's the wrong fluid, it might as well be filled with monkey piss, as far as they care.

If it's not slipping, though, it's probably okay. Your issue might be related to it shifting into neutral, even when the gear selector is in drive. It's part of the design. It was dumb, and IIRC, Volvo kicked it to the curb via a software update on the related five speed AW55. I'm not sure about the TF80.

So, synopsis:

Try and find a non-asshole dealer (....g'luck) to do a TCM flash. To check it, you follow this procedure- try to flash the TCM and see if it does anything. If the software is the latest available, it does nothing. If it's not, it updates and should generate some paperwork that can be printed off. Request it.

If you know the fluid has been changed...do it again, and let the dealer reset the TCM. Disconnecting the battery (or TCM) does nothing. I think the info is held in some kind of EPROM.

What evidence did the dealer provide for their claims that the fluid was not original?

 

[phucheneh]

Oh, also:

Oh, also, now that I think about it, your car may have shipped with the neutral thing already disabled. But unsure.

And I know that there are other kinds of fluid that meet JWS 3309. I still dunno if I'd try them. If you really don't want to pay for the Volvo fluid, you can try the Mobil 3309.

 

[phucheneh]

I was curious...this...

http://volvospeed.com/vs_forum/topic/59496-geartronic-transmission-fluid/

...plus a bunch of topics on Swedespeed seem to indicate that Volvo is full of shit and Mobil supplies their 3309. I cannot weigh in, as I am neither a chemical engineer nor a swedish chef.

 

[BUTCH1]

A fluid change shouldn't cost more than $200 and seems to cure a lot of auto transmission problems. You won't know until you actually do it, and you don't have much to lose by trying it. The early XC90's used a GM transmission that had a lot of problems, but I don't think that is related to your year. I believe there's an ex-Volvo mechanic on this board who should have a pretty good idea of what's going on with your car.

Yea, this, worst case you waste $200, best case you save several thousand, defiantly go this route first IMO..

 

[TonyH]

Changing the fluid will probably have little effect on the transmissions performance. The vehicle is equipped with an Aisin transmission and they have been plagued with problems in the newer generation front wheel drives like the 55-50SN. The problem I've come across in virtually every one is valve body related. I just won't build one now without a new valve body. I've tried remanufactured VBs with little success. Most other builder's that I know will do the same thing. Those who don't are having nothing but problems.

If the problems have just started the valve body may be all you need. If the problem has been occurring for some time it is possible that internal damage has been done. Even if the valve body is the cure it isn't cheap. The last Volvo VB that I bought was a little over $1300 and that doesn't cover what you'll be charged for installation.

 

[phucheneh]

I've heard of valve body issues with this family of transmission, as well. But I'm curious as to what the actual problem is...any insight to offer on that, Tony?

I'm just curious because my mind wants to think that those problems could still be related to the TCM programming. More specifically, that it's expecting different fluid (possibly just fluid with a lot more miles on it, as described above). Otherwise, I would think that valve body problems would be related to things just not operating smoothly...varnished/gummed up valves, or just a lot of sediment (clutch material) building up. Seems like a flush would help that. Only thing I see maybe requiring legit VB replacement would be some kind of line pressure issue, maybe.

Not disputing your stance on it; just wondering how many of these transmissions might be able to be saved with programming tweaks, fluid flushes...or maybe just a lack of fluid flushes. I know Aisin called the fluid 'lifetime,' as did all the manufacturers who used the transmissions. I always thought that was silly, but it's hard to know in a concrete, scientific kinda way whether the majority of these transmissions fail because someone didn't follow the manufacturer's rec...or maybe because they did. Just seems hard to imagine that there's not a logical reason why some of these things seem to last way longer than others.

 

[TonyH]

What goes bad in the valve bodies is the bores in which the valves ride. They become worn out and cross leaks occur that no amount of reprogramming can compensate for. The TCM turns solenoids on and off to stroke valves to direct fluid to specific locations inside the transmission. When the valve bores are worn out that control of flow is no longer possible.

I've seen wear occur in valve bodies from other transmission manufacturers but nothing on the scale that happens here. Oddly enough Aisin has produced transmissions for Toyota for decades and there have rarely been issues with their valve bodies.

 

[SpatiallyAware]

As everyone else said.... Do a volvo transmission fluid/filter change before anything else. That's fairly early for that trans to be going out.

Worst case, I would personally go to an indy shop for a trans replacement before the dealer.

 

[postmortemIA]

I think what dealer is saying (not that I trust them) is that previous owner knew of the problem, did what you are trying now. It did not work and they sold the car.