Trump just fired Comey!

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Jaskalas

Lifer
Jun 23, 2004
33,576
7,637
136
Holy crap, I can't believe I'm living through these times. Senate democrats are pondering a procedural option to shut down the Senate until the repubs agree to an independent investigation.

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/5/10/15610894/democrats-comey-senate-shutdown

They haven't decided to do it yet, but it's under consideration. If they do, so much for that healthcare bill. Among other things.

I say do it. Do it now.

Normally I'd never consider such an action, but at this point I agree. Do it now.

I pondered such action(s) on Feb1, 2017.

My feelings were that such obstruction and non participation promotes single party rule. Which fuels isolation of the opposition party and feelings of separation. From separatism comes separatist movements and true acts of rebellion. I do not like where that path leads in theory, assuming retaliation and escalation on both sides.

But at the same time... it feels like our opposition party lacks the sort of investigative teeth that meets the base expectation of what participation means. To be able to play watch dog and place proper scrutiny on the majority. It's likely our Democratic safeguards need some improvement to replace obstruction with transparency and accountability.

Democrats should absolutely be able to call forth an independent investigation. Perhaps with assistance from the Courts.
 

Chiropteran

Diamond Member
Nov 14, 2003
9,811
110
106
The timing! The timing!

Serious reason for the timing:



Democrats dragging feet and making every presidential appointment take as long as possible is the reason why the timing was what it was.

"President Donald Trump nominated Rosenstein to serve as Deputy Attorney General for the United States Department of Justice on January 13, 2017. Rosenstein was confirmed by the U.S. Senate on April 25, 2017."


When it takes an obstructionist senate over 3 months to do a basic confirmation, they look pretty silly complaining about the AG taking a couple weeks to decide to recommend firing Comey.
 

Younigue

Diamond Member
Feb 5, 2017
5,888
1,446
106
The timing! The timing!

Serious reason for the timing:



Democrats dragging feet and making every presidential appointment take as long as possible is the reason why the timing was what it was.

They had the very best [Republican] tutors these last years wouldn't you agree.
 

UNCjigga

Lifer
Dec 12, 2000
24,842
9,088
136
The timing! The timing!

Serious reason for the timing:



Democrats dragging feet and making every presidential appointment take as long as possible is the reason why the timing was what it was.

"President Donald Trump nominated Rosenstein to serve as Deputy Attorney General for the United States Department of Justice on January 13, 2017. Rosenstein was confirmed by the U.S. Senate on April 25, 2017."


When it takes an obstructionist senate over 3 months to do a basic confirmation, they look pretty silly complaining about the AG taking a couple weeks to decide to recommend firing Comey.

Sorry it took so long to confirm Trump's stooge, apparently he didn't take kindly to being setup as the fall guy:

http://www.cnbc.com/2017/05/11/depu...depiction-of-his-role-in-comey-dismissal.html
 
Reactions: Aegeon

ivwshane

Lifer
May 15, 2000
32,333
15,128
136
The timing! The timing!

Serious reason for the timing:



Democrats dragging feet and making every presidential appointment take as long as possible is the reason why the timing was what it was.

"President Donald Trump nominated Rosenstein to serve as Deputy Attorney General for the United States Department of Justice on January 13, 2017. Rosenstein was confirmed by the U.S. Senate on April 25, 2017."


When it takes an obstructionist senate over 3 months to do a basic confirmation, they look pretty silly complaining about the AG taking a couple weeks to decide to recommend firing Comey.

Just a point of fact for you, you stupid, stupid, piece of crap:

Rosensteins nomination was held up by Chuck Grassley a Republican.

http://www.politico.com/story/2017/03/chuck-grassley-rod-rosenstein-justice-nomination-236483

Senate Judiciary Committee Chairman Chuck Grassley (R-Iowa) is finally letting the nomination of a top Justice Department official advance, after refusing to schedule a vote because he had not received sufficient information on the ongoing Russia probe.

The committee announced Friday that it will take up the nomination of Rod Rosenstein for deputy attorney general at its business meeting on Monday. Grassley had complained the administration was stonewalling his requests for more information, and earlier this month said he would not schedule a vote for Rosenstein until he was briefed by the FBI.
 

woolfe9998

Lifer
Apr 8, 2013
16,189
14,102
136
I pondered such action(s) on Feb1, 2017.

My feelings were that such obstruction and non participation promotes single party rule. Which fuels isolation of the opposition party and feelings of separation. From separatism comes separatist movements and true acts of rebellion. I do not like where that path leads in theory, assuming retaliation and escalation on both sides.

But at the same time... it feels like our opposition party lacks the sort of investigative teeth that meets the base expectation of what participation means. To be able to play watch dog and place proper scrutiny on the majority. It's likely our Democratic safeguards need some improvement to replace obstruction with transparency and accountability.

Democrats should absolutely be able to call forth an independent investigation. Perhaps with assistance from the Courts.

I agree with everything you said. The problem is, there is no system in place to permit a minority party any latitude to play watch dog. It's an obvious flaw in our system which has only been exposed now that we've become so partisan. During Watergate, there were still enough republicans willing to do the the right thing, so the flaw wasn't apparent then.

At this point, I'm at a loss as to how to address what I believe is a rather dire circumstance. The only other thing I can think of is to wait until next year and see if the democrats can retake at least one house of Congress. However, by then I suspect the issue may have gone cold. For now, the FBI investigation at least is almost certainly over.
 

ivwshane

Lifer
May 15, 2000
32,333
15,128
136
I agree with everything you said. The problem is, there is no system in place to permit a minority party any latitude to play watch dog. It's an obvious flaw in our system which has only been exposed now that we've become so partisan. During Watergate, there were still enough republicans willing to do the the right thing, so the flaw wasn't apparent then.

At this point, I'm at a loss as to how to address what I believe is a rather dire circumstance. The only other thing I can think of is to wait until next year and see if the democrats can retake at least one house of Congress. However, by then I suspect the issue may have gone cold. For now, the FBI investigation at least is almost certainly over.


Is it a flaw? I can't imagine how many bullshit investigations a party like the current Republican party would try and bring to stop the other party or to try and deligitimize it. If anything, I think the minority party has too much power in the house.
 

trenchfoot

Lifer
Aug 5, 2000
14,681
7,180
136
Lol, the Dems didn't pressure Trump into firing Comey. I guess you could rationalize anything. His supporters will stand by Trump no matter what happens. That's only because many are upset and they feel left behind. Many are still pining for the 1950s. In reality, many are going to be left behind. Trump and the Republicans aren't going to save them. The Trumpsters refuse to take responsibility for a changing America. History is not on their side.

Anyway, many Trumpsters are probably strong Hitler supporters, and many will tell you that the Halocaust was made up. That's just the reality. BTW, I don't support Hillary. She's just as bad. Actuallly both parties suck.

My bad on that post. For the most part it was a rag on Trump supporters, some tongue in cheek, some parody and posting some stuff I saw on network news showing how Trump supporters were explaining away his uhhhhhh, eccentricities?

In hindsight, I'm thinking including an /s tag would've helped some too.
 

woolfe9998

Lifer
Apr 8, 2013
16,189
14,102
136
Is it a flaw? I can't imagine how many bullshit investigations a party like the current Republican party would try and bring to stop the other party or to try and deligitimize it. If anything, I think the minority party has too much power in the house.

Yes, I thought about that, but what do you see as the remedy here? We have a POTUS who is using the levers of power to kill an executive branch investigation into himself and his associates. And we have a Congress controlled by his political party who shows little to no inclination to operate as a check against Trump's abuse of power. Democracy is on the line right now.
 

Azuma Hazuki

Golden Member
Jun 18, 2012
1,532
866
131
@Chiropteran: Stop. Just...stop. Every time you pop your head up it's another lie and someone slams down on you like a ton o' rectangular buildin'-things. I am embarrassed for you reading this thread, as it is clear you have no shame yourself. Are you a masochist or what?
 

ivwshane

Lifer
May 15, 2000
32,333
15,128
136
Yes, I thought about that, but what do you see as the remedy here? We have a POTUS who is using the levers of power to kill an executive branch investigation into himself and his associates. And we have a Congress controlled by his political party who shows little to no inclination to operate as a check against Trump's abuse of power. Democracy is on the line right now.

Democracy only works if its citizens are active. If our democracy fails it will because of us. The test isn't about what our government does but what do the people do.

For me, it's inconceivable to vote for politicians that dislike government so much that their policies cause it to stop functioning but apparently that's exactly what a large portion of the country wants.

We'll see who wants it more.
 

ch33zw1z

Lifer
Nov 4, 2004
37,995
18,344
146
Like I said in the p &n middle name is thread: Chiro doesn't deserve anything but the ignore button.

Please stop quoting his posts, I don't want to see his nut job articles.
 
Reactions: Younigue

emperus

Diamond Member
Apr 6, 2012
7,782
1,540
126
The timing! The timing!

Serious reason for the timing:



Democrats dragging feet and making every presidential appointment take as long as possible is the reason why the timing was what it was.

"President Donald Trump nominated Rosenstein to serve as Deputy Attorney General for the United States Department of Justice on January 13, 2017. Rosenstein was confirmed by the U.S. Senate on April 25, 2017."


When it takes an obstructionist senate over 3 months to do a basic confirmation, they look pretty silly complaining about the AG taking a couple weeks to decide to recommend firing Comey.

Talking to people like you is like playing whack a mole. You whack one lie you pop up with another one. FYI, there have already been reports that he threatened to resign since TRUMP et al were attempting to put the blame on him. I think he's embarrassed himself already and should have resigned instead of writing that letter.

Btw. Who would want a job in this administration. It seems everybody around his orbit torpedoes whatever perceived credibility they had. Rosenstein just made himself a patsy.
 

Thebobo

Lifer
Jun 19, 2006
18,592
7,673
136
Not sure if this has been posted, but rut ro...

Deputy attorney general threatened to quit after being cast as impetus of Comey’s dismissal, source says

Accounts from more than 30 officials at the White House, Justice Department and on Capitol Hill indicate that President Trump was angry that FBI Director James B. Comey would not support his baseless claim that President Obama had his campaign offices wiretapped. Trump also fumed that Comey was giving too much attention to the Russia probe and not enough to investigating leaks to journalists.
 

Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
50,879
4,266
126
Not sure if this has been posted, but rut ro...

Deputy attorney general threatened to quit after being cast as impetus of Comey’s dismissal, source says

Accounts from more than 30 officials at the White House, Justice Department and on Capitol Hill indicate that President Trump was angry that FBI Director James B. Comey would not support his baseless claim that President Obama had his campaign offices wiretapped. Trump also fumed that Comey was giving too much attention to the Russia probe and not enough to investigating leaks to journalists.

I read the DAG report and while it was harsh it was also accurate in many ways. There were some things added which I didn't understand, but now I do. This wasn't a performance review which was requested but a comprehensive list of real and potential shortcomings. Pretty much "write down everything you think Comey did that you disagree with and why, don't exclude anything". That put the DAG is the noose where the AG and Trump can (and did) say in effect "Don't blame us, it was Rosenstein". Rosenstein didn't tell anyone to fire Comey, what he said that Comey went beyond what he considered proper and since there was little attempt to correct his errors, Comey was not fit. Well the Dems have been saying that all along and Rosenstein provided the means to the end. Now Rosenstein is the scapegoat.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
84,812
49,499
136

Yeah as 'both sides' attempts go that one was pretty pathetic. The only thing that's actually interesting about it is if he's crazy enough to actually believe this is a little thing or that this compares to anything Obama (or any president other than Nixon) has done.
 
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