tweaktown review GTX660Ti

[Scoobyboo]

Ohh... that is good to know!

 

[AtenRa]

The 680 Lightning has 32 ROP, 256-bit bus, 1536 SPs and 1176 GPU Boost. How is a 660Ti PE beating it in Skyrim and ties it in Dirt 3? I would believe it if the 680 and 660Ti were run on different drivers or using different CPUs. Still a $300 card beating a $600 card within NV's range? That would make the 660Ti the greatest mid-range GPU ever made that somehow with less shaders, memory bandwidth and ROPs it can beat a flagship based on the same chip? That's like having a GTX560Ti beating a GTX580.

Tweaktown's review actually shows something that's expected from an ROP neutered (AA dependent spec) and memory bandwidth starved (AA dependent spec) card:

GTX670 vs. 660Ti

Mafia 2 = 10% faster
AvP = 26% faster
FC2 = 26% faster
Metro 2033 = 22% faster
JC2 = 17% faster
Avg = 20% faster

I expect NV to tell reviewers to use FXAA as much as possible and to stay away from traditional MSAA to mask the AA deficiency of this card.

Well perhaps they used different drivers, but without AA the ROP count doesn't play that much of a role in performance at 1080p, texture fill rate does. Dont forget that the MSI GTX660Ti is factory OCed at 1020MHz vs 915MHz in the Tweaktown review.

Edit: I will say that if you could match the Texture Fill Rate of the GTX680 with the GTX660Ti at 1080p (without any AA used) in some games you will get almost the same fps.

 

[toyota]

http://www.legionhardware.com/articles_pages/gigabyte_geforce_gtx_660_ti,13.html

 

[kaihonsou]

http://www.legionhardware.com/articles_pages/gigabyte_geforce_gtx_660_ti,13.html

AMD will have to lower prices to compete now.

 

[hyrule4927]

Benchmarks in that Legion Hardware review are really screwy. Multiple instances of 660ti beating 670 and 7870 beating 7950. I get the feeling not all cards were tested with the same drivers.

That and the 660ti somehow has higher load power consumption than the 7950 in their results?

Looks like we'll have to wait for the AT review to get a decent idea of what the 660ti can really do.

 

[f1sherman]

Doesn't look so hot : about even with the 7870

http://elchapuzasinformatico.com/2012/08/review-msi-geforce-gtx-660-ti-power-edition/

Right... ()


The performance of the MSI GTX 660 OC Edition Ti Power is excellent in the current games with full graphics settings and under a resolution of 1920 x 1080 pixels. The only one who gets an average of less than 50 FPS is the Showdown DiRT released this year. To overclock on this graph, we get a higher performance than the GTX 680 Lightning except Battlefield 3, but it is true that the newer drivers and polished can help outdo her older sister.

MSI launches a 660 GTX OC Edition Ti Power improved to better support overclocking and thus offer sufficient performance for current games, although not as extreme at all times. Its starting price will be around 330 euros , so it stands midway between the last units to the sale of the GTX 570 and GTX 670 for the new reference to AMD, competes in price with the HD 7950. The MSI GeForce GTX 660 Ti Power Edition stands as one of the best options for price / performance for those looking for a chart prepared for the next generation of games remarkably high quality graphics.

 

[ShintaiDK]

http://www.legionhardware.com/articles_pages/gigabyte_geforce_gtx_660_ti,13.html

Nice, basicly performs in the same step as 670 vs 680.

No wonder AMD is throwing pricecuts left and right. The HD78xx is starting to look like valueend cards in terms of performance.

 

[toyota]

its still said the way these modest performing cards get so much praise. the gtx660ti even loses to the 2 year old gtx580 in some cases and is not a worthwhile upgrade from the gtx480 or gtx570. only if you have something like a gtx560 is this going to be a good upgrade but of course if you are the type that buys a gtx560 then you might have trouble justifying a whopping 300 bucks for an upgrade.

 

[3DVagabond]

As we wrote in the test methods section, AMD has prepared to meet the GeForce GTX 660 Ti release by updating the Radeon HD 7950’s BIOS and increasing the latter’s GPU clock rate by 125 MHz. With the new BIOS the Radeon HD 7950 is clearly better than the GeForce GTX 660 Ti.

Doesn't quite hang with the 7950. As many thought, it doesn't do well with AA or as the res increases either.

 

[zaydq]

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/geforce-gtx-660-ti-benchmark-review,3279-3.html

there you go toms hardware review... it competes with a 7870 at $300+. Fail.

Overclocking potential is fail, it competes with a 7870/7950 @ stock speeds... when they compare the 7950 ghz edition to their oc'd 660ti, it was nearly uncomparable. 7950s are well known to OC well past 1ghz on the core... mines at 1200. So essentially the 660ti loses out to the 7950 (which pricing is similar to considering the ref 660ti is $300, so AIBs will be more) and its on an overall just slightly faster than a 7870 at stock vs stock. I would suggest buy a 7850, OC the tits out of it, and you win on cost/performance. OR buy a 7950 and OC and still win.... 1ghz Ocs are guaranteed and thats all you need to put a 660ti into the dust.

 

[parkerlewis]

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/geforce-gtx-660-ti-benchmark-review,3279-3.html

there you go toms hardware review... it competes with a 7870 at $300+. Fail.

Overclocking potential is fail, it competes with a 7870/7950 @ stock speeds... when they compare the 7950 ghz edition to their oc'd 660ti, it was nearly uncomparable. 7950s are well known to OC well past 1ghz on the core... mines at 1200. So essentially the 660ti loses out to the 7950 (which pricing is similar to considering the ref 660ti is $300, so AIBs will be more) and its on an overall just slightly faster than a 7870 at stock vs stock. I would suggest buy a 7850, OC the tits out of it, and you win on cost/performance. OR buy a 7950 and OC and still win.... 1ghz Ocs are guaranteed and thats all you need to put a 660ti into the dust.

Sounds like someone's justifying the 7950 listed in their sig. I see the 660 Ti competing with the 7950 while costing $30 less and including a free Borderlands 2. Tom's Hardware seemed to get different results than every other review site.

...win?

 

[RussianSensation]

Sounds like someone's justifying the 7950 listed in their sig. I see the 660 Ti competing with the 7950 while costing $30 less and including a free Borderlands 2. Tom's Hardware seemed to get different results than every other review site.

Actually Tom's got the right results. If you stop cherry-picking games, and look at say 15+ games, you'll see that 660Ti is = 7950 at 1080P 4AA, but loses at 1080P with 8AA.

Ya what happens when you turn on 8AA in Batman?

Everyone knows 7950 is dog slow at 800mhz. Also, zaydq is right on the $ that 7950 overclocks like a dream. At 1.25ghz a 7950 was 10% faster than GTX680 in a BF3 benchmarks that was linked a couple weeks ago.

How about 1.025ghz 7950 vs. an 1150 GPU clock 660Ti in BF3?

BF3 is almost the best case scenario for NV cards. Not to mention his HD7950 is at 1.2ghz....

 

[zaydq]

Sounds like someone's justifying the 7950 listed in their sig. I see the 660 Ti competing with the 7950 while costing $30 less and including a free Borderlands 2. Tom's Hardware seemed to get different results than every other review site.

...win?

...lose? Toms Hardware has always given reputable results... I dont need justification for my 7950, i've justified it by outdoing a friend's GTX 670 in all benchies and average frames. The 660Ti is absolute trash for the price of $300. My 7950 was $309.99 and overclocked to outperform 670s and 680s. Even when the 660ti is OCd its still not that much better than it was stock. Think what you wish, i preach truth.

Also, lets be honest, even Nvidia fanboys can admit the 7970 is a fast card... so a $300 midranged nvidia gpu is superior in all benchmarks according to the graphs you just posted. Really...?

 

[parkerlewis]

I guess? To me it still just looks like the 7950 has comparable performance (after fiddling with OC) but costs more, is louder, runs hotter, uses more power, doesn't have PhysX, and has bad OpenGL drivers/performance. And doesn't come with a free $60 copy of Borderlands 2.

I want to play games at 1080p with 2x-4x AA. I don't care about 2560x1440 or 8x AA benchmarks. Cling to that outlier Tom's Hardware review I guess and ignore:

http://www.anandtech.com/show/6159/the-geforce-gtx-660-ti-review/21

there are a couple of niches one card or another serves particularly well, such as overclocking with the 7950, but ultimately unless you have a specific need either card will serve you well enough.

http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/MSI/GTX_660_Ti_Power_Edition/33.html

the card easily beats AMD's HD 7950 in all important criteria: performance, power, noise, heat, performance per Dollar, performance per Watt

http://www.hardocp.com/article/2012/08/16/galaxy_geforce_gtx_660_ti_gc_3gb_video_card_review/14

The GALAXY GTX 660 Ti GC is a much better value than the Radeo HD 7950 at $339. In all our gameplay the GALAXY GTX 660 Ti GC provided a better gaming experience than the Radeon HD 7950.

Doesn't really sound like absolute trash to me.

 

[OILFIELDTRASH]

Im tired of Nvidia and AMD. Its not about innovating and bringing the best products to the market anymore. It's about just barely edging out the other as far as price/performance goes then undercutting the other by $5. This whole gen of cards reeks of price fixing.

 

[toyota]

Im tired of Nvidia and AMD. Its not about innovating and bringing the best products to the market anymore. It's about just barely edging out the other as far as price/performance goes then undercutting the other by $5. This whole gen of cards reeks of price fixing.

hasn't it been like that for a while?

 

[OILFIELDTRASH]

hasn't it been like that for a while?

If we were to go back to 8800gtx release Nvidia would of probably gimped it and we'd never seen its full potential till 2 years later when AMD caught up.
I also didn't feel Nvidia skimped on last 2 gen. Sure the 480 was a fire breather but it was an absolute hold nothing back make the fastest card you can period type card.

 

[toyota]

If we were to go back to 8800gtx release Nvidia would of probably gimped it and we'd never seen its full potential till 2 years later when AMD caught up.
I also didn't feel Nvidia skimped on last 2 gen. Sure the 480 was a fire breather but it was an absolute hold nothing back make the fastest card you can period type card.

Nvidia needs to compromise. the 2880sp gk100 or 110 was insane and would have had to been clocked really low not to be even worse than the 480. still the gk114 just does not feel like a real high end gaming gpu worthy of 500 bucks. something like a 1920sp/160tmu/48rop/384 bit card from the beginning would have made much more sense.

 

[RussianSensation]

I guess? To me it still just looks like the 7950 has comparable performance (after fiddling with OC) but costs more, is louder, runs hotter, uses more power, doesn't have PhysX, and has bad OpenGL drivers/performance. And doesn't come with a free $60 copy of Borderlands 2.

That part you either have to back up because it's 100% wrong. Up until GTX285, NV had superior OpenGL performance. After that, it's all AMD in OpenGL. Even GTX470 lost in some OpenGL games to GTX285. It has been widely documented that NV traded OpenGL performance in older games for DX11 + tessellation performance in newer games. Wolfenstein is an OpenGL game and Kepler and Fermi are far far behind Cypress, Cayman and Tahiti.

Also, hardly anyone develops games in OpenGL now, so not sure why you even bothered to bring this up, esp. since NV is worse in OpenGL.

 

[Arzachel]

If we were to go back to 8800gtx release Nvidia would of probably gimped it and we'd never seen its full potential till 2 years later when AMD caught up.
I also didn't feel Nvidia skimped on last 2 gen. Sure the 480 was a fire breather but it was an absolute hold nothing back make the fastest card you can period type card.

You do know that 7900GTX -> 8800GTX nearly doubled the TDP right?

 

[toyota]

That part you either have to back up because it's 100% wrong. Up until GTX285, NV had superior OpenGL performance. After that, it's all AMD in OpenGL. Even GTX470 lost in some OpenGL games to GTX285. It has been widely documented that NV traded OpenGL performance in older games for DX11 + tessellation performance in newer games. Wolfenstein is an OpenGL game and Kepler and Fermi are far far behind Cypress, Cayman and Tahiti.

http://alienbabeltech.com/main/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/DX9-ogl.jpg

Also, hardly anyone develops games in OpenGL now, so not sure why you even bothered to bring this up, esp. since NV is worse in OpenGL.

why does Wolfenstein say its DX in Precision? also I dont see how those benchmarks are so low for those Nvidia cards. my much slower card has never once dropped below the 60 fps cap in the game so far.

 

[RussianSensation]

why does Wolfenstein say its DX in Precision? also I dont see how those benchmarks are so low for those Nvidia cards. my much slower card has never once dropped below the 60 fps cap in the game so far.

It may not drop below 60 fps but a modern AMD card would run it 50-100% faster. So yes, it'll still be playable on the NV card, but NV is far behind in OpenGL now.

I remember BFG did a very thorough analysis of GTX470 vs. 285. 285 came out on top in many older OpenGL titles.

It's more or less well known that now AMD leads massively in OpenGL vs Kepler and Fermi. So his comment that NV is better in OpenGL only applies to previous eras, but not anymore. In any case, I don't think it matters since 99.9% of games are DX.

I'd be more concerned that GTX660Ti is not a real 2GB card, and that it's 144GB/sec bandwidth will become a liability later on. It's overclocking is also nothing special. Can't see any reason at all to pick this over a solid 7950 such as the MSI TF3 unless someone doesn't OC at all and cares about performance/watt.

BL2 is what makes it a good deal, almost like a $250 card. If you remove that game though, then for $300 it's not the powerhouse that an overclocked 7950 is.

 

[Hypertag]

Honestly, if people care about BL2 that much, the GTX 670 is $370 with a coupon code and free BL2. Seems like a much more logical choice than the other options.

 

[toyota]

I remember BFG did a very thorough analysis of GTX470 vs. 285. 285 came out on top in many older OpenGL titles. But it's pretty much well known that now AMD leads massively in OpenGL vs Kepler and Fermi. So his comment that NV is better in OpenGL only applies to previous eras, but not anymore. In any case, I don't think it matters since 99.9% of games are DX.

I'd be more concerned that GTX660Ti is not a real 2GB card, and that it's 144GB/sec bandwidth will become a liability later on. Can't see any reason at all to pick this over the MSI TF3 unless someone doesn't OC at all and cares about performance/watt.

BL2 is what makes it a good deal, almost like a $250 card. But for $300 no way would I get this over the 7950.

yeah but BL 2 also makes the gtx670 look like better deal too. :sneaky:

 

[toyota]

Honestly, if people care about BL2 that much, the GTX 670 is $370 with a coupon code and free BL2. Seems like a much more logical choice than the other options.

what coupon code?