U.S. military to accept transgender recruits on Monday: Pentagon

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piasabird

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
17,168
60
91
Yes sir
yes mam
yes cousin it!

Having served in the Military this seems a little confusing. Not much time for being nice and compassionate in the military.
 
Reactions: IronWing

Paladin3

Diamond Member
Mar 5, 2004
4,933
877
126
Yes sir
yes mam
yes cousin it!

Having served in the Military this seems a little confusing. Not much time for being nice and compassionate in the military.
What the fuck does being nice and compassionate have to do with anything? Are you assuming that lifting the transgender ban will fill the ranks with less than capable recruits? Lifting the ban shouldn't and wouldn't lower the recruitment standards one bit. We're not talking about filling the ranks with drag queens, if that's what you are worried about.
 

snarfbot

Senior member
Jul 22, 2007
385
38
91
What the fuck does being nice and compassionate have to do with anything? Are you assuming that lifting the transgender ban will fill the ranks with less than capable recruits? Lifting the ban shouldn't and wouldn't lower the recruitment standards one bit. We're not talking about filling the ranks with drag queens, if that's what you are worried about.

Yes lol, I don't think that is unreasonable either.
 

brandonbull

Diamond Member
May 3, 2005
6,330
1,203
126
Regarding cost

"Out of an over $6 billion health budget for active duty members it's estimated that the cost for military trans health care is $8.4 million"

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/jul/26/trans-health-cost-us-military-budget-pentagon

Regarding numbers, hard to say:

"There is no official data to rely on, but the most recent research available estimates there are no more than 10,790 transgender individuals on active duty or in reserve forces."

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-40950946

If $8.4M isn't that much money, you pay for it. Glad people are so cavalier with others' money.
 

fastamdman

Golden Member
Nov 18, 2011
1,335
70
91
I don't see anything wrong with covering cost such as continuing hormone therapy or counseling for transgendered service members provided they had finished their transformation prior to enlistment. It's a relatively tiny, reasonable health care expense that is similar to that of a soldier who might need an inhaler for asthma or epipen for an allergy.

That doesn't mean that we allow currently serving service members to start and finish their transformation while remaining on duty and have it paid for by the taxpayer. I doubt a sincere transgendered person would even be crazy enough to want the VA to facilitate the change.

I don't think you realize exactly how the military works. You can't have asthma or allergies and be able to serve. If you need an inhaler or an epipen you are disqualified from serving. Even if you make it pass the beginning of shit somehow, you will be medically discharged in basic. It literally just happened to one of my really good friends.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
84,825
49,526
136
If $8.4M isn't that much money, you pay for it. Glad people are so cavalier with others' money.

I wonder how much it costs to recruit and train replacements for the transgender servicemembers they tried to get rid of and/or unit efficiency losses?

It's up to about $100k or so in training costs alone per soldier, not counting anything else. Glad people are so cavalier with others' money.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
84,825
49,526
136
I don't think you realize exactly how the military works. You can't have asthma or allergies and be able to serve. If you need an inhaler or an epipen you are disqualified from serving. Even if you make it pass the beginning of shit somehow, you will be medically discharged in basic. It literally just happened to one of my really good friends.

That's true, you can't serve with medical conditions that could become life threatening at any moment. His larger point is correct however in that there's nothing about being transgender that's similar to having life threatening asthma or allergic reactions and there's no reasonable or rational cause to bar them from serving.

Much like with the ban on gay people serving in the military this is asking trans people to pay the price for other's lack of mental or emotional maturity.
 
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Commodus

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 2004
9,215
6,818
136
If $8.4M isn't that much money, you pay for it. Glad people are so cavalier with others' money.

It's been said before, but it bears repeating: the military spends far more money on Viagra than it will on transgender health care.

It's not being cavalier -- it's making sure that people who are fit to serve can continue to serve.
 
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HomerJS

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
36,289
28,144
136
"After consultation with my Generals and military experts, please be advised that the United States Government will not accept or allow Transgender individuals to serve in any capacity in the U.S. Military. Our military must be focused on decisive and overwhelming victory and cannot be burdened with the tremendous medical costs and disruption that transgender in the military would entail. Thank you"

donald trump - 7/26/17

bwahahahahahahahahaha

commander in chief my ass.
Military to Trump: Fuck you Orange Boy
 

MagnusTheBrewer

IN MEMORIAM
Jun 19, 2004
24,135
1,594
126
My understanding is it's not an automatic discharge any longer pending the job of the servicewoman. I suspect the Navy has far less leniency with their shipboard personal than other branches do. Many in command still view it as malingering if it interferes with a deployment.

Nope. Life isn't fair and you can't have everything. If you are currently serving you should finish with your commitment before leaving the service to have your reassignment. If after your life is settled you want to apply for reenlistment then go ahead. Expecting the taxpayers to foot the bill for anything more than maintenance health care for a transgenders is wrong, IMHO.

Serving in the military isn't a right, and having a taxpayer funded reassignment definitely isn't. What transgendered absolutely do deserve is the right to be deemed eligible for service according to the same criteria as non-transgendered individuals.
One of the major draws to military service has always been healthcare.
 
Reactions: darkswordsman17

fastamdman

Golden Member
Nov 18, 2011
1,335
70
91
What the fuck does being nice and compassionate have to do with anything? Are you assuming that lifting the transgender ban will fill the ranks with less than capable recruits? Lifting the ban shouldn't and wouldn't lower the recruitment standards one bit. We're not talking about filling the ranks with drag queens, if that's what you are worried about.

He's probably assuming transgender people wear there heart on there sleeves. With all of the propaganda going around about the right pronouns to use, limiting free speech, etc etc it confuses a lot of people. A lot of people believe that they are all sissys who just want to be babied. Regardless of if that is how they are or not, as everyone is different, one fact still remains that needs to be addressed. The suicide rate of the transgender community is astronomical. It's higher than any other suicide rate. Couple that with the stresses of war and you have an extremely high chance of suicide. Couple that with PTSD after a war and you have an even higher chance of suicide. My only fear is that transgender people serving will lead to suicide. Whether its because they are bullied, see things they didn't think they would see, get bad ptsd or just aren't mentally ready for it I don't know...Regardless of WHY they have such a high suicide rate, we need to figure out how to fix it. I'm not buying that it's just because they are picked on. I think there is a deeper issue that needs to be addressed.

My view on the subject has changed drastically over the years. It's tough for me, I was raised...differently to say the least. Today's day and age and society has me baffled at times, but I love how accepting some of us can be. I believe we should try to be as accepting as possible of other people, less judgmental etc. I believe they should be accepted but the surgery stuff shouldn't be paid for by them / us. It's just not right. We don't have non transgender people saying that the military needs to pay for there hair loss treatments...I don't know, I can't think of the right analogy. But, I believe if they have transitioned and are capable of fighting and they pass basic, they should be able to fight. The only tricky part is whether or not they stay in the womens barracks or mens barracks. If they haven't transitioned fully it could make for some pretty awkward showers. Are they going to want private showers, private restrooms etc in the military? Are women going to feel comfortable showering with a woman with a penis? What about a woman with a penis that likes women? It could instill fear in women, albeit that is a rare scenario, but still. Women have plenty to fear as is in the military already. Sexual abuse / assault is way to common in times of war and that is something that needs to be addressed as well. I could see some of the guys raping transgender people to "teach them a lesson". Hopefully nothing like that ever happens and hopefully this all works out for the best, but I don't think it will honestly. In the end, years from now, possibly. But right now, I think there are going to be a lot of growing pains so to speak.
 

nakedfrog

No Lifer
Apr 3, 2001
58,570
12,874
136
What about an extended commitment if reassignment is elected?
Seems reasonable, when I joined the AF, the minimum enlistment for the same job (satellite/wideband comm) in the Army was 6 years (the training period was 9 months) versus the standard 2 years for Army at the time. No reason they couldn't do a similar thing, especially if you need to be put on an administrative job during recovery.
 

nakedfrog

No Lifer
Apr 3, 2001
58,570
12,874
136
Yes sir
yes mam
yes cousin it!

Having served in the Military this seems a little confusing. Not much time for being nice and compassionate in the military.
Guess times have changed, when I was in the military, we were expected to be respectable members of society, which generally includes being nice and compassionate.
 
Reactions: darkswordsman17
Jan 25, 2011
16,634
8,778
146
Fuckers are moving ahead with trying to ban transgender personnel.

https://www.politico.com/story/2018/03/23/trump-transgender-troops-ban-483434

The memorandum, which drew swift condemnation from gender rights groups, states that while the secretary of defense and other executive branch officials will have some latitude in implementing the policy, “persons with a history or diagnosis of gender dysphoria — including individuals who the policies state may require substantial medical treatment, including medications and surgery — are disqualified from military service except under limited circumstances.”

The memo also said that Secretary of Defense Jim Mattis, “in the exercise of his independent judgment, has concluded [the policies] should be adopted by the Department of Defense.” It added that “the Secretary of Homeland Security concurs with these policies with respect to the U.S. Coast Guard,” which would also be affected by the policy.

 
Last edited:

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
110,820
29,571
146
As far as cost goes, does anyone have any stats on the percentage of transgender people in the population or the cost of the surgery? I can't imagine there'd be that many people joining up and having the surgery, but that's just a guess on my part. That surgery has to be as invasive as it gets, so I'd guess anyone who opted for it would be pretty damned serious about it.

As far as letting them in, I'm all about recruiting the best and brightest for every position, so I say let's let them in.

I'm guessing it would cost less than a single weekend of Hair Fuhrer's golfing, to cover the surgeries for all and future transitioning soldiers, combined.
 
Reactions: Sonikku
Jan 25, 2011
16,634
8,778
146
I'm guessing it would cost less than a single weekend of Hair Fuhrer's golfing, to cover the surgeries for all and future transitioning soldiers, combined.
Well yeah but... ewww amiright?

It makes me sad to think where things will be when this idiots time is over.
 
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dawp

Lifer
Jul 2, 2005
11,345
2,705
136
seems this is going to be shot down in the courts anyways trump on.
 

BadTrip

Member
Sep 22, 2008
84
42
91
It is obvious. His base was up in arms yesterday over the budget bill. HE had to toss them some red meat to calm them back down.
 
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