UFC 193 tonight on PPV 10PM/7PM ET PT

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spacejamz

Lifer
Mar 31, 2003
10,843
1,491
126
yup.
I'm surprised Rousey kept the same strat in round2.
would have figured that her corner would tell her to take holms down.

cant wait to hear what Rousey has to say about her lack of takedown attempts

RRR's strategy was probably to win in the first 30 seconds...when that didn't pan out, they didn't know what to tell her since they didn't think they needed a Plan B. Guess they believed all of the media hype before the match....
 

khel

Senior member
Nov 21, 2012
363
0
0
Its been awhile since i posted on a ufc thread in anandtech but yeah great stuff from holm! Started screaming like crazy when the ko happened
 

JSt0rm

Lifer
Sep 5, 2000
27,399
3,947
126
Ronda was trying to get inside of that range in a stupid way and got drunk for it. She wanted to grapple. All of those wild punches were to try and get inside. Holly was having none of it.
 

JBT

Lifer
Nov 28, 2001
12,095
1
81
That was flipping awesome. Holm had her number from the get go. I actually think Rhonda was trying to execute her normal game plan but was just getting shut down at every attempt.
 

norseamd

Lifer
Dec 13, 2013
13,990
180
106

Dana has his hand in his pockets. Given that he is obviously very upset you can tell he is thinking of all the revenues he just lost. Also if that is Loretto, he does not look like he is in a very good mood right now.
 

shortylickens

No Lifer
Jul 15, 2003
82,854
17,365
136
If it started at 7PM eastern time why were people packed into the sports bar at 11:30 watching it? Is the replay really that exciting?
 

CPA

Elite Member
Nov 19, 2001
30,322
4
0
Dana has his hand in his pockets. Given that he is obviously very upset you can tell he is thinking of all the revenues he just lost. Also if that is Loretto, he does not look like he is in a very good mood right now.

They are not losing any revenues. Geez Louise, knock it off.

In any case, I wish I wasn't sick with food poisoning last night. Missed the damn fight.
 

norseamd

Lifer
Dec 13, 2013
13,990
180
106
They are not losing any revenues. Geez Louise, knock it off.

In any case, I wish I wasn't sick with food poisoning last night. Missed the damn fight.

I think you are looking for a fight, and you have no real knowledge of Zuffa revenues at all. It must rectally pain you that capitalist, fascist company like Zuffa might get insulted.
 

Hulk

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 1999
4,374
2,251
136
Those who live by the sword die by the sword.

It's only a matter of time when you fight to finish you eventually get finished.
Anderson Silva
Wanderlei Silva
Rashad Evans
Lyoto Machida
Chuck Liddell
GSP
Mike Tyson

And of course there are many more. All of these guys look unbeatable until their first loss.

Rhonda will come back. The problem is she never faced someone with the physical size, poise, and most importantly the striking technique to keep her off them.

The biggest problem with her and the rematch is how can she make up the 15 years of striking experience Holly has on her? That is a tough nut to crack. And now there is a game plan on how to beat her for other fighters to follow. And there will be cracks in her aura of invincibility, both within herself, and with her opponents.

Funny thing is Tate is a pretty decent striker with a good chin, she might have a better chance against Holm than Rousey. But Tate is so slow I still see Holly winning that one.

Maybe it's just me but I'm thinking Rhonda could actually make the cut to 115? She looked "thick."
 

norseamd

Lifer
Dec 13, 2013
13,990
180
106
Maybe it's just me but I'm thinking Rhonda could actually make the cut to 115? She looked "thick."

Genetics work as genetics, not as just making you better in every way possible. If she has the natural genetics to make her stocky, at least for a girl, then she probably can not get down to 115 even if a girl with the same nonmuscle mass as her can. Genetics can have a baseline of generated muscle, and if you do not get that amount of nutrition and muscle your body can make a pompous righteous fit.
 

Hulk

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 1999
4,374
2,251
136
Genetics work as genetics, not as just making you better in every way possible. If she has the natural genetics to make her stocky, at least for a girl, then she probably can not get down to 115 even if a girl with the same nonmuscle mass as her can. Genetics can have a baseline of generated muscle, and if you do not get that amount of nutrition and muscle your body can make a pompous righteous fit.

Understood.

Thing is rationality goes out the window when a fighter can't get past the champion.
Remember when Kenny Florian went from 185 to 170 to 155 and finally to 145 fighting many of the champs on the way down? Or Diego Sanchez. Frankie Edgar, Joe Lauzon, etc...

Often times it doesn't work but when there is a roadblock at your current weight they seem to go around it.

Don't be surprised if the UFC opens a weight class for women at 125lbs just for Rhonda
 

JEDI

Lifer
Sep 25, 2001
30,160
3,302
126
Those who live by the sword die by the sword.

It's only a matter of time when you fight to finish you eventually get finished.
Anderson Silva
Wanderlei Silva
Rashad Evans
Lyoto Machida
Chuck Liddell
GSP
Mike Tyson

And of course there are many more. All of these guys look unbeatable until their first loss.

Rhonda will come back. The problem is she never faced someone with the physical size, poise, and most importantly the striking technique to keep her off them.

The biggest problem with her and the rematch is how can she make up the 15 years of striking experience Holly has on her? That is a tough nut to crack. And now there is a game plan on how to beat her for other fighters to follow. And there will be cracks in her aura of invincibility, both within herself, and with her opponents.

um,, gsp left ufc as champion.

as for rematch gameplan, how about taking holms down?

wtf were they thinking about standing toe to toe w/holms?!
go for their weak points instead of entering their world where they are strong
 
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destrekor

Lifer
Nov 18, 2005
28,799
359
126
If it started at 7PM eastern time why were people packed into the sports bar at 11:30 watching it? Is the replay really that exciting?

7pm is start of coverage and a lot of prelims - the fights nobody pays for but are of up and coming MMA fighters scrapping for their chance to earn time in the spotlight.

Main card typically starts at about 10. There are five fights on the main card.

11-11:30 is typically the time when you can expect to see the main fight on the card, which is entirely dependent upon how long the other fights take. I've seen entire PPV events end before 11pm, a ton of quick-ending fights. But I've also seen it where the main fight didn't even start until after midnight.

I didn't get to see this one, wish I had as it sounds like there were some good fights. I wanted my girl Ronda to win but in a way glad she lost. She's been cocky and disrespectful and deserved to be knocked down a peg, to face reality.

She is a sloppy striker and needs to seriously tighten up her game if she wants to face fighters like Holm. If the fight was on the ground, Rousey probably comes away with the win, but when she can't land solid strikes on Holm and can't defend against Holm's brilliant striking... she was simply out-matched, plain and simple.
 

WaTaGuMp

Lifer
May 10, 2001
21,207
2,506
126
I want to coach Rhonda in the rematch, I would teach her that blocking punches with your face never works out.
 

norseamd

Lifer
Dec 13, 2013
13,990
180
106
These were written from before Ronda got KTFO.

There has always been a tendency to pretend that because someone is winning now, they are perfect. It happened with Anderson Silva, B.J. Penn, Georges St. Pierre and it will happen with anyone who ever picks up a UFC strap and holds it for a couple of defencss. But they weren't perfect and neither is Rousey. Rousey's greatest flaw is in that boxing that she trains constantly. She hits well, and hard, and that is more than enough if opponents are already terrified of getting locked in a clinch with you. Her problem is in the craft. The movement of the feet. The difference between the charge and the taking of space is key. Mike Tyson was accused of charging opponents but really what he did was crowd them until they threw a punch at him. They would miss his constantly bobbling head and then he would counter. His head was always working to evade while his feet were always working to engage.







A charge is a rapid advance on a straight line.





The problem with charging forwards is that it relies on speed and gives a fighter very little control to change direction. If you are bursting straight forwards and the opponent cuts an angle out to the left or right, you have an instant to react or you're busy moving past them like a bull past a matador. It is clumsy but most importantly it is labor intensive. Miss charges for a round and it doesn't matter if you're Joe Average or an endurance athlete, you are going to wear yourself out. That and even against lower tier opponents like Correia, the charging fighter will eat a ton of punches to the face. It is not a method which favors bout longevity. In a division of competent hitters it is an invitation to be knocked out.

There's been plenty of fighters in the men's divisions who charged straight forward time and again. Then the sport grew a bit and bull rushing stopped working. Fortunately, everyone that Rousey has fought, instead of circling out or flat out running away, has decided to try their hand at knocking her out. As soon as a fighter squares up to throw their power hand, whether they miss or land, they are in position to be tied up. And it has happened every single time.
http://fightland.vice.com/blog/the-night-of-female-champions-can-joanna-steal-rondas-thunder


Now as I've said before, the best way to go about beating an 'unbeatable' champion is to not focus on countering them or looking for cheap exploits for that one shot knockout. It is to take away their bread and butter and make them work a game they aren't used to. Think Anderson Silva being forced to lead, Georges St. Pierre with no jab, Renan Barao without his right low kick, Jon Jones without his low line kicks. So rather than saying “gotta work on that takedown defense” or “get yourself a judo coach,” let's work on reverse engineering the Rousey A-game, because so far no one has done that.
It's been said that women's MMA is ten years behind the men's game. The references to Rousey as the Royce Gracie of women's MMA certainly seem to support that. The lesson that most learned at UFC 1 was “wow this ground fighting is really something”. The real lesson should have been that it is very, very difficult to avoid the clinch.

You miss a punch, you're in the clinch. You land a punch, you're in the clinch. You don't punch, they walk straight in and you're in the clinch. Against Gracie it was bad for the confused nobodies he was fighting, against Rousey even a veteran grappler is in bad shape when they get to the clinch with her.

So for a long time in mixed martial arts there was an attitude of “I better knock this guy out before he gets to the clinch”. Wild right hands and intercepting knee attempts abounded, and they very seldom worked. And yet, that's exactly where we are in the women's bantamweight division right now. The vast majority of Rousey's opponents come out and immediately try to hit her as hard as they can with varied degrees of panicked flailing.

Here was the opening ten seconds from Miesha Tate.



I'm not even going to touch the quality of the boxing right now (I'll talk a little bit about that later when we get to Bethe Correia), the most important thing to note is that every time Tate throws the right hand, she squares up—as anyone does—and that gives Rousey the clinch with no trouble at all and nothing between her and Rousey to at least make it awkward for her.

And every time the fight got back to the feet, Tate would swing wild and end up chest-to-chest with the Olympian, just in time to get dumped on her back.
I will say it right now, unless someone pulls off that fluke knockout as Rousey steps in, no-one is going to stop her from tying them up without moving their feet, holding off on their power hand, and circling away.
http://fightland.vice.com/blog/killing-the-queen-ronda-rousey
 
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QueBert

Lifer
Jan 6, 2002
22,460
775
126
I'm sure they'll setup a rematch asap so Rousey can get her title back. They need someone marketable, after all.

The big thing marketable about Rousey was she was undefeated and finished almost everyone she fought in like a minute or less. She's absolutely horrible at interviews and in general doesn't do well in media situations. After not just losing, but getting steamrolled like she did her invincible monster aura has been slayed and she's not marketable any more. Now a rematch would easily be marketable, but Ronda's image is pretty much done. She had half of Hollywood running around yapping about how they were going to post the entire fight on Vine because she's that damn good. She beat a lot of scrubs and a few decent fighters who fought like retards. Which is exactly how she fought last night. I suspect in a rematch she'll have learned and won't buy into her own hype and try to box Holly again.

She suffered her 1st loss, it wasn't a fluke and reports came out since that her jaw in broken. We don't even know how she'll handle losing, but I don't see her coming back stronger. If she was to retire it wouldn't surprise me. She doesn't strike me as the humble pie type. The bully got smashed and can no longer be a bully. I'd love to see in the rematch Ronda trying to touch gloves and Holly not doing it.
 
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GagHalfrunt

Lifer
Apr 19, 2001
25,297
2,001
126
RRR's strategy was probably to win in the first 30 seconds...when that didn't pan out, they didn't know what to tell her since they didn't think they needed a Plan B. Guess they believed all of the media hype before the match....

That. Once Rousey finally got inside the rain of punches and managed to take Holm down she thought it was over. When Holm escaped and went back to repeatedly pounding Rhonda's head Rhonda didn't have anything else. She got on tilt, panicked and looked like an amateur. Her entire gameplan was "take down Holm immediately, get submission, party".
 
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