UK's Altrincham Grammar School for Girls bans calling pupils 'girls'

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Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
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At first I had to check my calendar to see if it was April's Fools Day, nope. They have Girls in the name of the school but have banned the word girls from language at the school to more inclusive to trans. When does this insanity end and when is it taking it too far?
Why would anybody take it too far? Perhaps I can help you to learn how to think so you don't have to go through life always feeling you're being reamed, unless, of course, that's your goal in life. Well, never mind then. I think the evidence is pretty clear on that.
 

Vic

Elite Member
Jun 12, 2001
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If a man sincerely believes he is a woman, he is deluded. Just as he would be if he thought he was a gorilla. Or 40 years old when he is in fact 60.

Is that what trans men generally believe (that they are in fact women)?
Why is any of this up to you to decide? How did you get the right to dictate to other people how they may or may not live their own lives?
And couldn't it also be considered a delusion to believe that the inability to control other people lives is the same as being oppressed?
 
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vi edit

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Oct 28, 1999
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I don't normally wade into topics like this...but someone that is religious tossing out the word delusional in regards to transgender is well...fucking laughable.
Is praying to the grand sky wizard any less delusional?
 
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Atreus21

Lifer
Aug 21, 2007
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I don't normally wade into topics like this...but someone that is religious tossing out the word delusional in regards to transgender is well...fucking laughable.
Is praying to the grand sky wizard any less delusional?

That I may be delusional according to atheists doesn't mean that a man believing he is a woman isn't.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
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That I may be delusional according to atheists doesn't mean that a man believing he is a woman isn't.

Male and female are sex characteristics, not gender characteristics. Transgender people do not believe they are of the opposite sex.
 

Atreus21

Lifer
Aug 21, 2007
12,007
572
126
Why is any of this up to you to decide? How did you get the right to dictate to other people how they may or may not live their own lives?
And couldn't it also be considered a delusion to believe that the inability to control other people lives is the same as being oppressed?

People have the right to peaceably live their lives how they wish. They don't have the right to expect me to sanction it. Tolerance is a two way street.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
84,807
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People have the right to peaceably live their lives how they wish. They don't have the right to expect me to sanction it. Tolerance is a two way street.

As far as I can tell here the two way street of tolerance involves you calling them delusional and them tolerating you calling them delusional.

Would you consider an atheist to be tolerant of your religion if they described you as delusional?
 
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Atreus21

Lifer
Aug 21, 2007
12,007
572
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Male and female are sex characteristics, not gender characteristics. Transgender people do not believe they are of the opposite sex.

I guess that distinction confuses me. If I separated my biological species from my perceived species, claiming I identified as a gorilla, would that warrant societal acceptance and accommodation, and even enforcement (requiring people by law to use preferred pronouns)?
 

interchange

Diamond Member
Oct 10, 1999
8,022
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What if they get the surgery?

Then they would actually have the physical characteristics of another sex, wouldn't they?

Amazingly, one person can believe something wholly incompatible with something another person believes with neither person being delusional.
 

Atreus21

Lifer
Aug 21, 2007
12,007
572
126
As far as I can tell here the two way street of tolerance involves you calling them delusional and them tolerating you calling them delusional.

Would you consider an atheist to be tolerant of your religion if they described you as delusional?

Of course. They already do. Tolerance ends when force becomes involved.
 

Atreus21

Lifer
Aug 21, 2007
12,007
572
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Then they would actually have the physical characteristics of another sex, wouldn't they?

Amazingly, one person can believe something wholly incompatible with something another person believes with neither person being delusional.

If a man got surgery to create (or in truth simulate) the sexual anatomy of a woman, and thus truly believed he was a woman, would he be delusional?
 

interchange

Diamond Member
Oct 10, 1999
8,022
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I guess that distinction confuses me. If I separated my biological species from my perceived species, claiming I identified as a gorilla, would that warrant societal acceptance and accommodation, and even enforcement (requiring people by law to use preferred pronouns)?

What law is requiring people to use someone's preferred pronoun?

Acceptance in society as a greater concept is a choice made by society as a collective. Agreeing with it is not compulsory.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
84,807
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I guess that distinction confuses me. If I separated my biological species from my perceived species, claiming I identified as a gorilla, would that warrant societal acceptance and accommodation, and even enforcement (requiring people by law to use preferred pronouns)?

The distinction is that sex describes biological characteristics and gender describes how they present themselves socially and culturally. When someone is transgender this describes that they present socially and culturally as a different gender than would generally be expected, it does not mean they believe they are a member of the opposite sex. It's pretty insulting to call someone delusional when you don't appear to understand the basics of what they are about.
 
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Vic

Elite Member
Jun 12, 2001
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People have the right to peaceably live their lives how they wish. They don't have the right to expect me to sanction it. Tolerance is a two way street.
Says the guy who makes up paranoid conspiracy theories of being oppressed in order to justify his intolerance.

This isn't about sanctioning anyone's lifestyle. If you see common courtesy and simple politeness to your fellow human beings as a sanction for anything, then you are truly delusional. And un-Christian, if I may say so.
 
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interchange

Diamond Member
Oct 10, 1999
8,022
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If a man got surgery to create (or in truth simulate) the sexual anatomy of a woman, and thus truly believed he was a woman, would he be delusional?

If they believed that their anatomy was not a result of surgery, yes that would be delusional.
 

Atreus21

Lifer
Aug 21, 2007
12,007
572
126
The distinction is that sex describes biological characteristics and gender describes how they present themselves socially and culturally. When someone is transgender this describes that they present socially and culturally as a different gender than would generally be expected, it does not mean they believe they are a member of the opposite sex. It's pretty insulting to call someone delusional when you don't appear to understand the basics of what they are about.
If they believed that their anatomy was not a result of surgery, yes that would be delusional.

I would be inclined to take your word for this approach if it weren't for the movement to admit biological men into women's sports. Clearly, there are those who draw no distinction even on biological grounds, which is the entire basis for sex-segregated sports. It seems obvious to me that whereas not all transgenders believe they really are the opposite sex, there's a contingent of them who do.

And those who do are deluded.
 

Vic

Elite Member
Jun 12, 2001
50,415
14,307
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As far as I can tell here the two way street of tolerance involves you calling them delusional and them tolerating you calling them delusional.

Would you consider an atheist to be tolerant of your religion if they described you as delusional?
Right???
 
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