Unarmed black 17 year old shot by Neighborhood watch captain in gated community...

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soundforbjt

Lifer
Feb 15, 2002
17,788
6,040
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He didn't need to commit a crime, following is not a crime, no crime took place until TM assaulted GZ.

What does it matter what someone else would have done?

Because he has actually been trained in law enforcement and knows what to do and what justifies/triggers warranted suspicion.

It's no crime to do alot of stupid things, but doing them when you know it's stupid and against the guidelines/instructions laid out is asking for a bad outcome. I know it's stupid to wear a tie when operating a drill press, if I wear one and get hurt, was it the drill presses fault?
 

owensdj

Golden Member
Jul 14, 2000
1,711
6
81
... All while forgetting/ignoring if that was his true plan, why would he still be carrying the drink & Skittles with him.

You're assuming Trayvon was thinking like a mature, rational 17yo should. He wasn't. Part of it was the influence of the marijuana on his judgement. We have to consider the brain damage found by the autopsy as well.
 

lotus503

Diamond Member
Feb 12, 2005
6,502
1
76
No he didn't say that he just went down. During the re-enactment he demonstrated with his arms that he was pushing Martin away and that he was trying to get away. And the lack of detail at that point is quite possibly due to the stunning effect of being punched in the nose. I just don't understand why the distance can't be understood as a combination of trying to get away while pushing away with his arms, rolling after falling, and movement during the struggle.


He did say that in his statements the night of the 26th.

It changed in the reenactment to pushing stumbling a bit and then he went down. Nothing explains 30' in any meaningful or reasonable way.

Where Z points in the reenactment is about where the key chain flashlight was found 8' or so from the T. I think its possible to stumble 8 feet before going down, but then wheres the other 22'?
 

Patranus

Diamond Member
Apr 15, 2007
9,280
0
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Because he has actually been trained in law enforcement and knows what to do and what justifies/triggers warranted suspicion.

It's no crime to do alot of stupid things, but doing them when you know it's stupid and against the guidelines/instructions laid out is asking for a bad outcome. I know it's stupid to wear a tie when operating a drill press, if I wear one and get hurt, was it the drill presses fault?

You are operating the drill-press (an inanimate object) that only does what you tell it to do.

Zimmerman was ASSAULTED by Martin. Martin isn't an inanimate object, he made a CHOICE.
 

lotus503

Diamond Member
Feb 12, 2005
6,502
1
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You're assuming Trayvon was thinking like a mature, rational 17yo should. He wasn't. Part of it was the influence of the marijuana on his judgement. We have to consider the brain damage found by the autopsy as well.


LOL
 

boochi

Senior member
May 21, 2011
983
0
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Trayvon had 4 minutes to go 100 yards if he was scared. The truth is he was not scared, he was angry and wanted a confrontation.
 

Patranus

Diamond Member
Apr 15, 2007
9,280
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Trayvon had 4 minutes to go 100 yards if he was scared. The truth is he was not scared, he was angry and wanted a confrontation.

He also had 4 minutes to call the police.
He didn't.
He wasn't scared of that "crazy ass cracker" following him.

Calling the police is the first thing any sane/rational person would do if they were scared. Martin did not.

You are correct. He wanted a confrontation.
 

Attic

Diamond Member
Jan 9, 2010
4,282
2
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Much better atmosphere on CNN with Sunny not around ... -- She is MOST biased of all of them (CNN people) there

Sunny had to take that stance. Nobody is going to tune in if it's 4 vs 0 or 3 vs 1 regarding GZ's innocence and the absurdity of the case.

Sunny comes off as smart enough to know that she had to sit squarely in the prosecutions dugout if she was going to earn that chedder for appearing on CNN during the entire trial. She also knows if she didn't someone else would, but she had first shot because she's hot.
 

Darkman

Diamond Member
Feb 24, 2013
4,033
0
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I stand by acquittal, the case is a doubt case.
I didn't ask that ... LOL ... (even though I see, I kinda asked somewhat vague)

the key word there was today (or NOT today)

... and not the prediction on the verdict itself
 
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MH2007

Senior member
Jun 26, 2007
830
0
0
Yeah why sign up for a group with rules when you can just so your own thing?

You insinuate he didn't do it to support he wasn't a wannabe cop.

Yet he still was patrolling the NH armed and following suspects, much like a cop

His next door neighbor said she never saw him patrolling, just walking his dog (which I suppose could be considered patrolling of some kind). Was there ever any evidence of any kind of patrol schedule or were they just calling if they saw something?

Is there any evidence that he ever followed anyone before that night?
 

lotus503

Diamond Member
Feb 12, 2005
6,502
1
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Trayvon had 4 minutes to go 100 yards if he was scared. The truth is he was not scared, he was angry and wanted a confrontation.

That makes more sense if he didn't run to begin with.
Truth is we don't know the truth.
 

Patranus

Diamond Member
Apr 15, 2007
9,280
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Sunny had to take that stance. Nobody is going to tune in if it's 4 vs 0 or 3 vs 1 regarding GZ's innocence and the absurdity of the case.

Sunny comes off as smart enough to know that she had to sit squarely in the prosecutions dugout if she was going to earn that chedder for appearing on CNN during the entire trial. She also knows if she didn't someone else would, but she had first shot because she's hot.

Sunny comes off as wanting to jump Guy's junk.
She was actually called out on it by Mark Firman.
It was pretty funny.
 

soundforbjt

Lifer
Feb 15, 2002
17,788
6,040
136
You're assuming Trayvon was thinking like a mature, rational 17yo should. He wasn't. Part of it was the influence of the marijuana on his judgement. We have to consider the brain damage found by the autopsy as well.

Yeah, lack of blood & oxygen to the brain caused by a gunshot to the heart could never cause brain damage, could it? And LOL at the pot statement.
 
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JD50

Lifer
Sep 4, 2005
11,750
2,334
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Yeah why sign up for a group with rules when you can just so your own thing?

You insinuate he didn't do it to support he wasn't a wannabe cop.

Yet he still was patrolling the NH armed and following suspects, much like a cop

Or just like you'd expect someone to do in the neighborhood watch...
 

Darkman

Diamond Member
Feb 24, 2013
4,033
0
0
Sunny had to take that stance. Nobody is going to tune in if it's 4 vs 0 or 3 vs 1 regarding GZ's innocence and the absurdity of the case.

Sunny comes off as smart enough to know that she had to sit squarely in the prosecutions dugout if she was going to earn that chedder for appearing on CNN during the entire trial. She also knows if she didn't someone else would, but she had first shot because she's hot.
BBM

Good one .. You're right, actually .....
 

lotus503

Diamond Member
Feb 12, 2005
6,502
1
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His next door neighbor said she never saw him patrolling, just walking his dog (which I suppose could be considered patrolling of some kind). Was there ever any evidence of any kind of patrol schedule or were they just calling if they saw something?

Is there any evidence that he ever followed anyone before that night?

I don't know is the answer to most of it, seeing as how he had made numerous calls about suspicious activity, I have to think at least part of what he had witnessed to trigger those calls was from patrolling the NH.

Being as how a lot of the calls he wouldn't be able to witness from his residence.
 

Patranus

Diamond Member
Apr 15, 2007
9,280
0
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Or just like you'd expect someone to do in the neighborhood watch...

Zimmerman was watching and reporting and there is no EVIDENCE to contradict that. Since he is innocent until PROVEN guilty (beyond a reasonable doubt) he gets the benefit of the doubt.
 

Attic

Diamond Member
Jan 9, 2010
4,282
2
76
Sunny comes off as wanting to jump Guy's junk.
She was actually called out on it by Mark Firman.
It was pretty funny.


Love it. Whenever I watched it was basically Mark saying, "Sunny, Sunny!, really?, Earth to Sunny?" as she drums on into absurdity.
 

soundforbjt

Lifer
Feb 15, 2002
17,788
6,040
136
Trayvon had 4 minutes to go 100 yards if he was scared. The truth is he was not scared, he was angry and wanted a confrontation.

And GZ had over 2 minutes to return to his truck and wait for police. The truth is GZ was still actively looking for TM, he was going to make sure this asshole did not get away...see how that works?
 

Doppel

Lifer
Feb 5, 2011
13,306
3
0
He also had 4 minutes to call the police.
He didn't.
He wasn't scared of that "crazy ass cracker" following him.

Calling the police is the first thing any sane/rational person would do if they were scared. Martin did not.

You are correct. He wanted a confrontation.
He absolutely did.
That makes more sense if he didn't run to begin with.
Truth is we don't know the truth.
He ran to elude GZ and get a better vantage. At that point he probably stalked him, and then went for the attack.
 

lotus503

Diamond Member
Feb 12, 2005
6,502
1
76
Or just like you'd expect someone to do in the neighborhood watch...

Not really seeing how patrolling armed and following suspects is outside the guidelines of NHW, I think most NHW folks don't do that vs do that.
 
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