US Sending 300 Newly Returned Troops Back to Iraq

[Deptacon]

Originally posted by: maluckey
jackschmittusa

What is supposed to mean is that you seem to have bought the party BS, hook, line, and sinker......

What the hell are you trying to say in the post above?? I don't get anything...From what I read of your post, it appears that BBond hijacked your icon and name. From what I read...It appears that you are anti-military and pro Liberal. Good for you! At least you are honest.

War is not Liberal or Conservative. It is the ultimate economic tool. For every armchair general out there in AT land, there are several REAL commanders in the REAL war who differ from the armchair POV.

As far as the howling from some in this thread that more troops are needed...NOT!! more troops cause more friction, more chances for more crimes by the soldiers, more resentment by the Iraqi (the radicalized Muslims seem to hate everyone). More troops cannot change beliefs of a nation. More troops cannot secure freedom after it is already won. More troops cannot accomplish the rebuilding of infrastructure or of attitudes. More troops cannot stop Sunnis from hating Shia. I can go on about what troops cannot do, but nobody is listening.

Well said, but i dont think we should waste our breath, this armchair general tihnks he knows all, but from what he has said tells me he enver spent a day in uniform.... which there is nothing wrong with that, but those who have see thingsa fro ma different perspective, not to mention see things first hand, unfiltered, over there...

 

[Deptacon]

Originally posted by: tommywishbone

* 70-80% of the insurgents are from countries other than Iraq?
* Syrians & Iranians were killing Americans before bush invaded?
* Why do we want to "roll into" Syria's & Iran "backyard"? What's in their backyard?
* Saddam's administration is long gone... why aren't we long gone?
* Beaten & tourtured & killed with car batteries... like we did to the detaines at Abu Gharib prison?

I think you might be backing a losing horse in this race. But it's your money, so good luck in the derby.

#1, Yes, the vast majority of gurellies that soldiers come into contact in Iraq, and not Iraqi... don't tell me otherwise, i have read many more field reports than you have...and unless your your security clerence is above Secret, you havent...

#2 Syria and Iran are home to many terrorist entities and training sites. Not to mention that is where most radicalism comes from, within those borders...

#3 answered in in #2

#4 Ok, lets leave then, before the country is stable, so it can become the new "taliban Afghanistan" of the muslim world, and at the same time give up a foothold and a spot on the fence with syria and Iran....cause thats smart!! Yeah right.

#5 There you go, throw a spin on it, hit at the one thing a dozen stupid and now being imprisioned soldiers did..... What Iwas sayin is that was common practice b4 in Iraq, but I know, your just looking for things to spin.

#6 You done ranting and pooring out rhetoric, cause thats all you just did...

And Im not backing any horse, im ready for a new administraion, as long it they have some balls...


I DONT WANNA HEAR ABOUT MY SPELLING, ITS JUST A MESSAGE BOARD

 

[jackschmittusa]

Deptacon

Your powers of deception deceive you. I got out of the military in '71; probably before you were born.

Even the Pentagon has reported that most of the insurgents are of local origin. There are no official reports that I have heard of that say otherwise. The foriegners are there for terrorist OJT, thanks to us.

Believing that there will ever be a stable Iraq without an overbearing government is a pipe dream.

And so much of the local population must just love us when we regularly attack residential neighborhoods with warplanes. I seem to remember we condemned Saadam for doing the same to the Kurds.

And the media has reported on many instances of the government's letting vet's down. This administration depends on people like you to stay uninformed. That's how they get you to drink the kool aid. Perhaps if you paid some attention to the news, you might develope a new perspective yourself.

And maluckey, how do you consider me to be anti-military? I'm not even anti-war. But I am pretty fed up with the colossal number and magnitude of the mistakes we have made in the M.E.. And I am discusted by this administration's refusal to admit error, or take corrective action. And when criticized, they either blow it off or start up the smoke and mirrors show. I've lived through a lot of presidents, and never seen anything even remotely as bad as this one.

 

[Deptacon]

I have no problem admiting there are mistakes, but I have a problem when peopl cant admit they dont have a better idea besudes cut tail and run.

 

[Todd33]

Originally posted by: Deptacon
#1, Yes, the vast majority of gurellies that soldiers come into contact in Iraq, and not Iraqi... don't tell me otherwise, i have read many more field reports than you have...and unless your your security clerence is above Secret, you havent...

I'd like some proof, and not just your word. You could be any smuck on the net, we have zero reason to think you are reading top secret Pentagon papers that magically disagree with everything known in the public.

The US and Iraqi governments have vastly overstated the number of foreign fighters in Iraq, and most of them don't come from Saudi Arabia, according to a new report from the Washington-based Center for Strategic International Studies (CSIS).

While the foreign fighters may stoke the insurgency flames, they make up only about 4 to 10 percent of the estimated 30,000 insurgents.

This is a little old, but I somehow doubt that foreign fighters now make up over 50%.

 

[Deptacon]

Originally posted by: Todd33

Originally posted by: Deptacon
#1, Yes, the vast majority of gurellies that soldiers come into contact in Iraq, and not Iraqi... don't tell me otherwise, i have read many more field reports than you have...and unless your your security clerence is above Secret, you havent...

I'd like some proof, and not just your word. You could be any smuck on the net, we have zero reason to think you are reading top secret Pentagon papers that magically disagree with everything known in the public.

The US and Iraqi governments have vastly overstated the number of foreign fighters in Iraq, and most of them don't come from Saudi Arabia, according to a new report from the Washington-based Center for Strategic International Studies (CSIS).

While the foreign fighters may stoke the insurgency flames, they make up only about 4 to 10 percent of the estimated 30,000 insurgents.

This is a little old, but I somehow doubt that foreign fighters now make up over 50%.

whats your source...

Mine is from a biref I got 2 months ago for predeployment..... I cant atest to its accuracy becuase I didnt make the briefing, but I have no reason to see why it wasnt.... The basically gist i got that most threats we run into there will not be locals but more syrian or Iranian nationals inside Iraq....

 

[CaptnKirk]

Originally posted by: Deptacon
I have no problem admiting there are mistakes, but I have a problem when peopl cant admit they dont have a better idea besudes cut tail and run.

'cut and run' is nothing more than a bullshit bumper slogan statement.
it means nothing, and nobody has proposed that at all.

Just a mindless statment ment to group and incite the weakminded.

 

[DurocShark]

Originally posted by: catnap1972
How about sending some of P&N's 101st Keyboard Brigadists? I'm sure most of them would be more than happy to go serve.

Honestly? I would. It would be an honor. And has nothing to do with whether the fighting is right or wrong.

I would be fighting alongside the best in the world.
I would be fighting to support my country.

I was scheduled to join the army out of high school in 1988. (Hey, I'm not THAT old!) With my beautiful ASVAB and my physical conditioning I was being given the keys to the kingdom. Until they found out I had dorsal kyphosis (hunchback) that was corrected with harrington rods. They wouldn't let me in with that.

 

[brandonbull]

Why couldn't the US government comeup with the $300+ bl USD before attacking Iraq to move America off ME oil and end the revenue stream for these terrorists?

 

[Todd33]

Originally posted by: Deptacon

Originally posted by: Todd33

Originally posted by: Deptacon
#1, Yes, the vast majority of gurellies that soldiers come into contact in Iraq, and not Iraqi... don't tell me otherwise, i have read many more field reports than you have...and unless your your security clerence is above Secret, you havent...

I'd like some proof, and not just your word. You could be any smuck on the net, we have zero reason to think you are reading top secret Pentagon papers that magically disagree with everything known in the public.

The US and Iraqi governments have vastly overstated the number of foreign fighters in Iraq, and most of them don't come from Saudi Arabia, according to a new report from the Washington-based Center for Strategic International Studies (CSIS).

While the foreign fighters may stoke the insurgency flames, they make up only about 4 to 10 percent of the estimated 30,000 insurgents.

This is a little old, but I somehow doubt that foreign fighters now make up over 50%.

whats your source...

Mine is from a biref I got 2 months ago for predeployment..... I cant atest to its accuracy becuase I didnt make the briefing, but I have no reason to see why it wasnt.... The basically gist i got that most threats we run into there will not be locals but more syrian or Iranian nationals inside Iraq....

Sorry I forgot the original link, but here is a few.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/4186766.stm

http://www.csis.org/component/option,com_csis_pubs/task,view/id,3304/

Sounds like the numbers are from CENTCOM.

 

[Deptacon]

Originally posted by: CaptnKirk

Originally posted by: Deptacon
I have no problem admiting there are mistakes, but I have a problem when peopl cant admit they dont have a better idea besudes cut tail and run.

'cut and run' is nothing more than a bullshit bumper slogan statement.
it means nothing, and nobody has proposed that at all.

Just a mindless statment ment to group and incite the weakminded.

What? its suggested in every thread o nthis forum, and if its not being suggested, WAHT IS? everyone says Iraq is bad, poor planning, poor orgainization, etc etc, but no good plausable solutions, to actually fixing the situation, BESIDES bringing the troops home...

 

[Deptacon]

Originally posted by: DurocShark

Originally posted by: catnap1972
How about sending some of P&N's 101st Keyboard Brigadists? I'm sure most of them would be more than happy to go serve.

Honestly? I would. It would be an honor. And has nothing to do with whether the fighting is right or wrong.

I would be fighting alongside the best in the world.
I would be fighting to support my country.

I was scheduled to join the army out of high school in 1988. (Hey, I'm not THAT old!) With my beautiful ASVAB and my physical conditioning I was being given the keys to the kingdom. Until they found out I had dorsal kyphosis (hunchback) that was corrected with harrington rods. They wouldn't let me in with that.

When it comes to medical reasons, somtimes it just depends how bad you want to serve I have several buddies who have done some creative things with paperwork and thier medical records, to get on through.....

But of course that all dpends on the seriousness of the issues, somethings shouldnt be attempted to get squezzed by..... somethings should restricted you fgrom serving, just no one bothers updateing some requirements after 50 years....

 

[Deptacon]

Originally posted by: Todd33

Originally posted by: Deptacon

Originally posted by: Todd33

Originally posted by: Deptacon
#1, Yes, the vast majority of gurellies that soldiers come into contact in Iraq, and not Iraqi... don't tell me otherwise, i have read many more field reports than you have...and unless your your security clerence is above Secret, you havent...

I'd like some proof, and not just your word. You could be any smuck on the net, we have zero reason to think you are reading top secret Pentagon papers that magically disagree with everything known in the public.

The US and Iraqi governments have vastly overstated the number of foreign fighters in Iraq, and most of them don't come from Saudi Arabia, according to a new report from the Washington-based Center for Strategic International Studies (CSIS).

While the foreign fighters may stoke the insurgency flames, they make up only about 4 to 10 percent of the estimated 30,000 insurgents.

This is a little old, but I somehow doubt that foreign fighters now make up over 50%.

whats your source...

Mine is from a biref I got 2 months ago for predeployment..... I cant atest to its accuracy becuase I didnt make the briefing, but I have no reason to see why it wasnt.... The basically gist i got that most threats we run into there will not be locals but more syrian or Iranian nationals inside Iraq....

Sorry I forgot the original link, but here is a few.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/4186766.stm

http://www.csis.org/component/option,com_csis_pubs/task,view/id,3304/

Sounds like the numbers are from CENTCOM.

Are you Serious???? That BBC link is over a year old...

and your CSIS report, backed up what I SAID:

PAGE 5

Terrorists and Foreign Fighters. Terrorists and foreign fighters, although far fewer in number than the
Rejectionists or former regime loyalists, conduct most of the highprofile, high-casualty attacks and
kidnappings. Many foreign fighters continue to arrive in Iraq via Syria? Al-Qaida in Iraq (AQI) is
currently the dominant terrorist group in Iraq. They continue efforts to spark a self-sustaining cycle of
ethno-sectarian violence in Iraq? AQI pursues four broad lines of operation: anti-MNF-I, antigovernment,
anti-Shi?a, and external operations.

As a soldier going over there to conduct my mission, rebuild a contury and continue to pass off control to Iraqis, I dont care about people with rocks...I care about the ones with bombs..... I consider them the insurgency, not the "Unhappy Locals". Everyone isnt going to be happy during a transition, but we are still going to do our job over there, and deal insurgents, and thier leaders, but its kind of hard to cut off the head when thier orders come from theran and syria.

90% of suicide attacks are carried
out by AQI?The current positive effects of intolerance for Al-Qaida in Iraq (AQI) among Sunni Arabs
may be limited if Sunnis perceive a lack of progress in reconciliation and government participation or if
increased sectarian violence draws various Sunni insurgency elements closer. Local

 

[CaptnKirk]

Originally posted by: Deptacon

Originally posted by: CaptnKirk

Originally posted by: Deptacon
I have no problem admiting there are mistakes, but I have a problem when peopl cant admit they dont have a better idea besudes cut tail and run.

'cut and run' is nothing more than a bullshit bumper slogan statement.
it means nothing, and nobody has proposed that at all.

Just a mindless statment ment to group and incite the weakminded.

What? its suggested in every thread o nthis forum, and if its not being suggested, WAHT IS? everyone says Iraq is bad, poor planning, poor orgainization, etc etc, but no good plausable solutions, to actually fixing the situation, BESIDES bringing the troops home...

For your being an 'alledged' member of the military, you absolutely don't know sh|t, do you.

You sure as hell aren't high enough up the food chain to be privey to any pertinant information
or in a position to make a decision.

Ignorance is bliss, enjoy your blissful assignment.

 

[Todd33]

Originally posted by: Deptacon

Are you Serious???? That BBC link is over a year old...

and your CSIS report, backed up what I SAID:

PAGE 5

Terrorists and Foreign Fighters. Terrorists and foreign fighters, although far fewer in number than the
Rejectionists or former regime loyalists, conduct most of the highprofile, high-casualty attacks and
kidnappings. Many foreign fighters continue to arrive in Iraq via Syria? Al-Qaida in Iraq (AQI) is
currently the dominant terrorist group in Iraq. They continue efforts to spark a self-sustaining cycle of
ethno-sectarian violence in Iraq? AQI pursues four broad lines of operation: anti-MNF-I, antigovernment,
anti-Shi?a, and external operations.

As a soldier going over there to conduct my mission, rebuild a contury and continue to pass off control to Iraqis, I dont care about people with rocks...I care about the ones with bombs..... I consider them the insurgency, not the "Unhappy Locals". Everyone isnt going to be happy during a transition, but we are still going to do our job over there, and deal insurgents, and thier leaders, but its kind of hard to cut off the head when thier orders come from theran and syria.

90% of suicide attacks are carried
out by AQI?The current positive effects of intolerance for Al-Qaida in Iraq (AQI) among Sunni Arabs
may be limited if Sunnis perceive a lack of progress in reconciliation and government participation or if
increased sectarian violence draws various Sunni insurgency elements closer. Local

In respose to this:

* 70-80% of the insurgents are from countries other than Iraq?

you said:

#1, Yes, the vast majority of gurellies that soldiers come into contact in Iraq, and not Iraqi

Now you are changing your story to suicide bombers?

And I doubt that the number went from <10% to over 50% in a year, if anything it's smaller. The number of Iraqis involved in violence is way up, we have over 3,000 a month dying.

 

[piasabird]

You might be able to conquer with less people, but you can not police with less people if a large percentage of the population wants to do harm. It is obvious that in Iraq, the border needs to be secured. That takes a lot of people.

 

[CaptnKirk]

Originally posted by: piasabird
You might be able to conquer with less people, but you can not police with less people if a large percentage of the population wants to do harm. It is obvious that in Iraq, the border needs to be secured. That takes a lot of people.

and what border is that - the Baghdad border?

 

[episodic]

The question is how long will they continue to FORCE people to stay in? How long can they legally?

 

[Deptacon]

Originally posted by: CaptnKirk

Originally posted by: Deptacon

Originally posted by: CaptnKirk

Originally posted by: Deptacon
I have no problem admiting there are mistakes, but I have a problem when peopl cant admit they dont have a better idea besudes cut tail and run.

'cut and run' is nothing more than a bullshit bumper slogan statement.
it means nothing, and nobody has proposed that at all.

Just a mindless statment ment to group and incite the weakminded.

What? its suggested in every thread o nthis forum, and if its not being suggested, WAHT IS? everyone says Iraq is bad, poor planning, poor orgainization, etc etc, but no good plausable solutions, to actually fixing the situation, BESIDES bringing the troops home...

For your being an 'alledged' member of the military, you absolutely don't know sh|t, do you.

You sure as hell aren't high enough up the food chain to be privey to any pertinant information
or in a position to make a decision.

Ignorance is bliss, enjoy your blissful assignment.

wow, what a useless post.... and what makes you "know sh1T???" huh? what makes you an expert? cause you read something in paper? what do you do for a living, Whateve rit is, I wouldnt start asserting that i know everything about your job, and that you don't know anything about it...cause that would just be stupid....

Im in the Army, and Im an Officer, that puts me in the postion to have access to pertinant information, AND makes decisions, now what do you do for a living, besides make broad meaningless statements like "you dont know anything"

 

[Deptacon]

Originally posted by: CaptnKirk

Originally posted by: piasabird
You might be able to conquer with less people, but you can not police with less people if a large percentage of the population wants to do harm. It is obvious that in Iraq, the border needs to be secured. That takes a lot of people.

and what border is that - the Baghdad border?

look another....useless post... how about some real info or arguments, besides just broad "your ignorant" statements....

 

[Deptacon]

Originally posted by: episodic
The question is how long will they continue to FORCE people to stay in? How long can they legally?

No current Stop Loss actions are in place, no one is being forced to stay in.... some are being called in from the IRR, which is part of there total 8 year military contract everyone signs, but if they are complaining they probably didnt read it.

Some contracts go 4 active, 2 reserve, 2 IRR,

or

2 active 4 reserve, 4 IRR

a lot of people ignore the IRR part of the contract becuase for years that meant you dont have to do anything for those years, but it still makes you eligibal for call up. Now, with priority MOS needs, and trying to avoid back to back deployments for those returning, small numbers of IRR people are being activiated, first by voulnteers, then by order.

 

[Deptacon]

Originally posted by: Todd33

Originally posted by: Deptacon

Are you Serious???? That BBC link is over a year old...

and your CSIS report, backed up what I SAID:

PAGE 5

Terrorists and Foreign Fighters. Terrorists and foreign fighters, although far fewer in number than the
Rejectionists or former regime loyalists, conduct most of the highprofile, high-casualty attacks and
kidnappings. Many foreign fighters continue to arrive in Iraq via Syria? Al-Qaida in Iraq (AQI) is
currently the dominant terrorist group in Iraq. They continue efforts to spark a self-sustaining cycle of
ethno-sectarian violence in Iraq? AQI pursues four broad lines of operation: anti-MNF-I, antigovernment,
anti-Shi?a, and external operations.

As a soldier going over there to conduct my mission, rebuild a contury and continue to pass off control to Iraqis, I dont care about people with rocks...I care about the ones with bombs..... I consider them the insurgency, not the "Unhappy Locals". Everyone isnt going to be happy during a transition, but we are still going to do our job over there, and deal insurgents, and thier leaders, but its kind of hard to cut off the head when thier orders come from theran and syria.

90% of suicide attacks are carried
out by AQI?The current positive effects of intolerance for Al-Qaida in Iraq (AQI) among Sunni Arabs
may be limited if Sunnis perceive a lack of progress in reconciliation and government participation or if
increased sectarian violence draws various Sunni insurgency elements closer. Local

In respose to this:

* 70-80% of the insurgents are from countries other than Iraq?

you said:

#1, Yes, the vast majority of gurellies that soldiers come into contact in Iraq, and not Iraqi

Now you are changing your story to suicide bombers?

And I doubt that the number went from <10% to over 50% in a year, if anything it's smaller. The number of Iraqis involved in violence is way up, we have over 3,000 a month dying.

do you need the answer to WACK YOU in the HEAD!!! Its i nthe damn report! read it!

 

[episodic]

Originally posted by: Deptacon

Originally posted by: episodic
The question is how long will they continue to FORCE people to stay in? How long can they legally?

No current Stop Loss actions are in place, no one is being forced to stay in.... some are being called in from the IRR, which is part of there total 8 year military contract everyone signs, but if they are complaining they probably didnt read it.

Some contracts go 4 active, 2 reserve, 2 IRR,

or

2 active 4 reserve, 4 IRR

a lot of people ignore the IRR part of the contract becuase for years that meant you dont have to do anything for those years, but it still makes you eligibal for call up. Now, with priority MOS needs, and trying to avoid back to back deployments for those returning, small numbers of IRR people are being activiated, first by voulnteers, then by order.

So. . .after 8 years - a soldier that signed up with 4 can go home? Or can they hold them longer?

 

[Todd33]

Originally posted by: Deptacon

do you need the answer to WACK YOU in the HEAD!!! Its i nthe damn report! read it!

The report quotes the 10% CENTCOM number, maybe you should explain yourself.

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: Deptacon

Originally posted by: CaptnKirk

Originally posted by: Deptacon
I have no problem admiting there are mistakes, but I have a problem when peopl cant admit they dont have a better idea besudes cut tail and run.

'cut and run' is nothing more than a bullshit bumper slogan statement.
it means nothing, and nobody has proposed that at all.

Just a mindless statment ment to group and incite the weakminded.

What? its suggested in every thread o nthis forum, and if its not being suggested, WAHT IS? everyone says Iraq is bad, poor planning, poor orgainization, etc etc, but no good plausable solutions, to actually fixing the situation, BESIDES bringing the troops home...

Maybe if things were improvong over there instead of getting worse Americans wouldn't be so pessimistic. Continuing with a horrble plan in light of a better plan is no solution so withdrawing from Iraq seems to be the best idea. Maybe rearm the Sunni's and work covertly with them likw we did with Sadam. It might not be the best for the Iraqi's but having a strongman/dictator in power that is allied with the US likw we have in Pakistan would be best for us.