Vega/Navi Rumors (Updated)

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amenx

Diamond Member
Dec 17, 2004
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Does anyone think Vega will be too expensive as miners snap them up and inflate the price?
 

Face2Face

Diamond Member
Jun 6, 2001
4,100
215
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Does anyone think Vega will be too expensive as miners snap them up and inflate the price?

Depends on their hashrate and how energy efficient they are, but I predict they're going to be very hard to purchase for awhile; regardless of mining.
 

Ancalagon44

Diamond Member
Feb 17, 2010
3,274
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Does anyone think Vega will be too expensive as miners snap them up and inflate the price?

No, miners buy reasonably priced cards that mine well. Even if these mine well, they are too expensive. The return on investment will be too long.

That unless one Vega FE is worth at least 6 RX 480s, but I doubt that.
 
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Atreidin

Senior member
Mar 31, 2011
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No, miners buy reasonably priced cards that mine well. Even if these mine well, they are too expensive. The return on investment will be too long.

That unless one Vega FE is worth at least 6 RX 480s, but I doubt that.

I don't think you've kept up on the RX 480 supply and demand situation. Also, I think most people are concerned about the consumer/gaming cards, not the Frontier Edition. And for that, I fully expect miners to ruin the market for them.
 

nathanddrews

Graphics Cards, CPU Moderator
Aug 9, 2016
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www.youtube.com
A line was forming outside my local Microcenter yesterday morning about an hour before the store opened. They got some 570 and 580 cards in stock and people were lining up to flip them. If this Vega offers a significant advantage to mining, you can bet they'll be snatched up, too.
 

Bouowmx

Golden Member
Nov 13, 2016
1,142
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AMD Radeon Instinct MI25: http://instinct.radeon.com/_downloads/radeon-instinct-mi25-datasheet-15.6.17.pdf (caution: PDF)
4096 cores, ~1501 MHz, 12.3 TFLOPS single-precision, 2/1 half-precision, 1/16 double-precision
16 GB HBM2, 2048-bit, 1890 MT/s, 484 GB/s

The only comparison against NVIDIA given is FLOPS.

Another NVIDIA Pascal product: Tesla P40 (3840 cores, 1531 MHz, 24 GB GDDR5, 346 GB/s, 250 W) can do 11758 GFLOPS (but no meaningful double- or half-precision performance).'

Recently-revealed Volta Tesla V100 PCIe: 14 TFLOPS single-precision, 2/1 half-precision, 1/2 double-precision, 250 W, kind of invalidates the FLOPS-to-power comparison, doesn't it?
 
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Ancalagon44

Diamond Member
Feb 17, 2010
3,274
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I don't think you've kept up on the RX 480 supply and demand situation. Also, I think most people are concerned about the consumer/gaming cards, not the Frontier Edition. And for that, I fully expect miners to ruin the market for them.

I know all about how out of stock most AMD GPUs are. My point is that other GPUs, even Nvidia GPUs, will be a lot more cost effective for miners than these Vega FE GPUs. Miners would rather pay a premium for GTX 1070 cards than pay an even bigger premium for Vega FE.

Once again, we know that Vega FE will perform somewhere between a 1080 and a 1080Ti, but it is priced way above a 1080. Why not just buy two 1080s? Those are not out of stock as far as I know.
 

ozzy702

Golden Member
Nov 1, 2011
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I know all about how out of stock most AMD GPUs are. My point is that other GPUs, even Nvidia GPUs, will be a lot more cost effective for miners than these Vega FE GPUs. Miners would rather pay a premium for GTX 1070 cards than pay an even bigger premium for Vega FE.

Once again, we know that Vega FE will perform somewhere between a 1080 and a 1080Ti, but it is priced way above a 1080. Why not just buy two 1080s? Those are not out of stock as far as I know.

1080's don't mine well and for the cost neither do 1080tis. Vega could potentially hash over double what either of those cards pull.
 

PhonakV30

Senior member
Oct 26, 2009
987
378
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Does anyone think Vega will be too expensive as miners snap them up and inflate the price?

here someone did test on Nvidia Tesla P100

https://www.reddit.com/r/EtherMining/comments/66f2dz/nvidia_tesla_p100sxm2_x4_mining/
p100throwaway said:
Total power usage across 4 cards was ~1KW.

The total hashrate for all 4 cards was ~275 MH/s. When using one card, this number was closer to ~69MH/s.

Datasheet Nvidia Tesla P100 : Link

So Radeon MI25 Probably can do near 60Mh/s or more.Now I think RX Vega maybe get 50Mh/s or more.
 

DDH

Member
May 30, 2015
168
168
111
So Vega FE out 27th June. Will there be a release announcement, event, presser, stream, or anything?

There are a few details that we dont know about Vega yet. Surely AMD will have to release all the goods when FE finally hits the shelves?
 

AK169

Member
Nov 5, 2012
27
1
66
I'm not following the news
is there anything coming from AMD at the $350-$450 range ?
and when it will come ?
 

Karnak

Senior member
Jan 5, 2017
399
767
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I’ve seen the specs of Vega RX. It needs a damn lot of power. We’re working on it, which is a start so launch is coming closer
https://videocardz.com/70465/msi-damn-rx-vega-needs-a-lot-of-power

Keep in mind that the quote showed in the screenshot is missing his follow-up post.

Someone replied:
That aint a positive sign.

To which he replied:
That depends on the level of performance...
https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comments/6it7sv/msi_damn_rx_vega_needs_a_lot_of_power/dj8uvi0/

https://gathering.tweakers.net/forum/list_message/51654713#51654713

MSI marketing director according to videocardz.
 

lobz

Platinum Member
Feb 10, 2017
2,057
2,856
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Recently-revealed Volta Tesla V100 PCIe: 14 TFLOPS single-precision, 2/1 half-precision, 1/2 double-precision, 250 W, kind of invalidates the FLOPS-to-power comparison, doesn't it?
Since it costs an order of magnitude more, I don't think so, they're not direct competitors as of yet.
 

Magic Hate Ball

Senior member
Feb 2, 2017
290
250
96
Right, but no one knows if Vega 11 or cutdown RX Vega 10 is going to be released at the end of July, much less before the end of the year. Most people highly doubt that Vega 11 will be out by the end of Q3, and it seems likely destined for 2018 (meaning, that $350 range--OK, assuming they aren't swamped by miners, where this phase has made the current, real cost to consumer of something like the RX 580 upwards of $700...wtf. ). MSRp of Polaris currently only goes up to $250-270, right? RX580 was never targeted for $350. Unless they plan on some further revision, like a 585, but that seems unreasoable for Polaris, considering how inefficient it was going from 480 to 580. I would think that the "585" line would be a Vega 11 going forward.

The RX580 should have been a RX485 from the beginning.

RX580 as Vega 11 should have been what we received at a later date.
 
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Snarf Snarf

Senior member
Feb 19, 2015
399
327
136
Vega 11 could very well be the RX 590, with release closer to school time (late August or early September). With what they have available financially AMD is doing a good job right now at executing, Epyc and Threadripper look good, platform has become more stable, and are even getting major OEM wins. The staggered launch allows them to focus on one segment at a time before jumping to the next. I'm hoping to start seeing the same Dell EMC systems that are launching with Epyc to have Vega solutions for the datacenter and cloud by the end of this year. Combine this with APU launches at the end of this year for laoptop OEM's and AMD has completed its epic return to the market in all segments.

All Vega needs to achieve right now is performance parity at an improved perf/$, if they beat the 1080ti by more than 15% in DX11 I will wear a dress for a week and pre-order one immediately.
 

Qwertilot

Golden Member
Nov 28, 2013
1,604
257
126
Well even approaching break even would be welcome right now - the real profits/investment they badly need to restart true competition in this market will hopefully come via Zen taking off.
 

Topweasel

Diamond Member
Oct 19, 2000
5,436
1,655
136
They don't need nVidia margins. Just a profit.
Kind of. The reason Fiji disappeared so quickly was do to the fact that as it performance got farther behind Nvidia they couldn't lower the price low enough without losing money per sale.

So it may be good enough to sell for profit now. If it's not competitive enough with Volta then it might leave the market before Navi is ready.
 
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Magic Hate Ball

Senior member
Feb 2, 2017
290
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All Vega needs to achieve right now is performance parity at an improved perf/$, if they beat the 1080ti by more than 15% in DX11 I will wear a dress for a week and pre-order one immediately.

All Vega needs to do for me is be better than a GTX1080. I'm not buying Nvidia with their anti-consumer practices with G-Sync and refusal to work with Freesync.

They could've been making money on the G-Sync licensing/hardware in monitors and had them used by both brands of video card... making money with every monitor purchase.

But no, they had to try to make their own special little playpen.
 

Mercennarius

Senior member
Oct 28, 2015
466
84
91
All Vega needs to do for me is be better than a GTX1080. I'm not buying Nvidia with their anti-consumer practices with G-Sync and refusal to work with Freesync.

They could've been making money on the G-Sync licensing/hardware in monitors and had them used by both brands of video card... making money with every monitor purchase.

But no, they had to try to make their own special little playpen.


Agreed. AMD's more consumer friendly practices are enough for me to support them over Nvidia as long as they have a comparable product.
 

Magic Hate Ball

Senior member
Feb 2, 2017
290
250
96
Right now Nvidia is dominating high end GPU market. Vega will soon have to compete with Volta GV104 and GV102 in Q1/Q2 2018. Nvidia must have already taped out or be very closing to taping out their 7nm GPUs at TSMC. So I don't think AMD can cause too much problems for Nvidia. Nvidia has been pushing GPU generations at 18-24 months. AMD has yet to prove they can even catch up to Nvidia.

That depends if Vega was purely delayed for HBM2 production reasons. The lag time between Vega and Navi doesn't necessarily stay static, so just because Vega was delayed for non-AMD (Hynix) reasons I wouldn't expect Navi to be proportionately delayed as a result.

It could come at the originally expected timeframe of 2H 2018.
 
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