Vega/Navi Rumors (Updated)

[jpiniero]

Vega was almost certainly 'delayed' because Zen took priority.

It could come at the originally expected timeframe of 2H 2018.

2H 2018 would be rather aggressive if it is indeed using GF 7 nm, even with scalable die.

 

[zinfamous]

Vega was almost certainly 'delayed' because Zen took priority.



2H 2018 would be rather aggressive if it is indeed using GF 7 nm, even with scalable die.

Didn't GloFo just announce production capability--whatever that means--of 7nm? Say they are able to essentially start making wafers within the next month on that new process, what is the ave time from new process going on line to see new product coming out? (hypothetically--let's just say that Navi has been/is ready to "sent off to print").

please excuse my lack of proper trade terms.

 

[Snarf Snarf]

Vega was almost certainly 'delayed' because Zen took priority.



2H 2018 would be rather aggressive if it is indeed using GF 7 nm, even with scalable die.

The Anandtech article posted today about GF 7nm is saying its a 2H for production ramp up, it would be possible considering AMD's relationship with them. Early risk production starts 1H 2018 and it's to be expected as their biggest customer AMD will be already getting wafers out on risk to see what to expect out of the process. Navi late 2H 2018 is pretty reasonable assuming that the delays of Vega are supply or man power limited.

 

[jpiniero]

what is the ave time from new process going on line to see new product coming out? (hypothetically--let's just say that Navi has been/is ready to "sent off to print").

Several months I imagine from the point they start HVM. And this is all assuming they are using multiple tiny dies because you can presume that yields will be super crappy.

 

[raghu78]

The best case scenario for GF 7LP is late Q1 2018 / early Q2 2018 risk production and volume production in Q4 2018. The earliest we can expect Navi would be Dec 2018 or Jan 2019. The realistic timeline would be late Q1 2019 for actual Navi launch.

 

[Bacon1]

https://twitter.com/GChip/status/877977292688863232

Four Radeon Instinct MI25 server accelerators paired with @AMDServer #EPYC for 100TFLOPs of computing power, created by partners Inventec.

https://twitter.com/RadeonInstinct/status/877297785112068097

 

[Borf]

The blue looks nice. It's a surprisingly big board for something with HBM. I wonder what the rest of the junk in the trunk is.

 

[Malogeek]

The blue looks nice. It's a surprisingly big board for something with HBM. I wonder what the rest of the junk in the trunk is.

The rear 1/3 of the card is the blower.

 

[Face2Face]

Love that color combination

 

[Borf]

Looks PCB all the way down on both models.

 

[guskline]

I sure hope I can custom water cool the Big Vega.

 

[stahlhart]

Thread cleaned. Stick to discussing Vega/Navi, which will be easier now that the pestilence has been removed.
-- stahlhart

 

[3DVagabond]

Kind of. The reason Fiji disappeared so quickly was do to the fact that as it performance got farther behind Nvidia they couldn't lower the price low enough without losing money per sale.

So it may be good enough to sell for profit now. If it's not competitive enough with Volta then it might leave the market before Navi is ready.

Do you know this as fact or have some source? Or is it just your assumption? Because without any source of my own I assumed they either A; didn't want to have a lot of Fiji cards clogging things up delaying the release of Vega, like with Hawaii, or B; HBM1 dried up.

 

[raghu78]

The blue looks nice. It's a surprisingly big board for something with HBM. I wonder what the rest of the junk in the trunk is.

These cards are cooled by the server chassis fans blowing cool air through the large heatsink on the Radeon Instinct cards as there is no fan or moving components on the Radeon Instinct cards. This is a common feature of GPUs in servers. We could see more compact designs for RX Vega which are going to have air and liquid cooled versions.

 

[Malogeek]

These cards are cooled by the server chassis fans blowing cool air through the large heatsink on the Radeon Instinct cards as there is no fan or moving components on the Radeon Instinct cards. This is a common feature of GPUs in servers. We could see more compact designs for RX Vega which are going to have air and liquid cooled versions.

I believe he's referring to the Vega FE, referencing the blue one.

 

[NewFatMike]

AMD Radeon Instinct MI25: http://instinct.radeon.com/_downloads/radeon-instinct-mi25-datasheet-15.6.17.pdf (caution: PDF)
4096 cores, ~1501 MHz, 12.3 TFLOPS single-precision, 2/1 half-precision, 1/16 double-precision
16 GB HBM2, 2048-bit, 1890 MT/s, 484 GB/s

The only comparison against NVIDIA given is FLOPS.

Another NVIDIA Pascal product: Tesla P40 (3840 cores, 1531 MHz, 24 GB GDDR5, 346 GB/s, 250 W) can do 11758 GFLOPS (but no meaningful double- or half-precision performance).'

Recently-revealed Volta Tesla V100 PCIe: 14 TFLOPS single-precision, 2/1 half-precision, 1/2 double-precision, 250 W, kind of invalidates the FLOPS-to-power comparison, doesn't it?

I know this is a little bit back, but I'm curious what the die area on Instinct MI25 is vs V100. V100 is so so big that a die size advantage might be a big deal for AMD.

 

[Bouowmx]

Vega 10 has area in the 500s mm^2, noting that it does not include Tensor cores, and meaningful 64-bit floating-point.

 

[NewFatMike]

Ahh that makes sense, I had forgotten about the specialized hardware in V100.

Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk

 

[Malogeek]

Also keep in kind that a DXG-1 with 4 V100 Tesla cores is $70,000

 

[railven]

Saw two interesting posts over at NeoGaf:
https://videocardz.com/70465/msi-damn-rx-vega-needs-a-lot-of-power

https://www.forum-3dcenter.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=11408206#post11408206

Dunno if they were already mentioned. Chances are Vega is going to be a power hog, but they're claiming great performance / dollar value. WTB more leaks!

 

[Paratus]

Saw two interesting posts over at NeoGaf:
https://videocardz.com/70465/msi-damn-rx-vega-needs-a-lot-of-power

https://www.forum-3dcenter.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=11408206#post11408206

Dunno if they were already mentioned. Chances are Vega is going to be a power hog, but they're claiming great performance / dollar value. WTB more leaks!

If you aren't pushing 300+ watts and running up to the reticule limit you're leaving performance on the table.

(Of course if you are going to be stuck on a process node for 3 generations like 28nm then you save the max for the third gen a la Fury X)

 

[Cloudfire777]

I dont know.

The only reason why Vega should be a hit is if the biggest one match or beat GTX 1080Ti.

In August when RX Vega is available, it will be 15 months after GTX 1080 was released to the market. If RX Vega barely beats that, then whats the point?

[deleted]

Which brings the question:
Whats the point of even launching Vega if they have spent so much money on it, delayed it so much that it will end up barely paying for the engineering and manufacturing cost of Vega when all is said and done?

But the fact that TDP of RX Vega is so high and that MSI say its a powerhog, makes me believe that the delay was because AMD wanted to squeeze out as high clocks as possible to make it as fast as possible vs the competition, before finalizing the specs and launching the card, that Im hopeful it will give GTX 1080Ti a run for its money.

It will be interesting to see how it pans out for AMD.

Stop derailing this discussion with inflammatory trolling.
-- stahlhart

 

[OTG]

I dont know.

The only reason why Vega should be a hit is if the biggest one match or beat GTX 1080Ti.

In August when RX Vega is available, it will be 15 months after GTX 1080 was released to the market. If RX Vega barely beats that, then whats the point?
The only audience excited or wanting to buy that would be die hard AMD fanboys ditching the idea of buying Pascal because "it wasnt AMD".
And these are not many.

Which brings the question:
Whats the point of even launching Vega if they have spent so much money on it, delayed it so much that it will end up barely paying for the engineering and manufacturing cost of Vega when all is said and done?

What should Ford do if, after years in development, the new Mustang only barely beats the old Camaro, and loses handily to the new one?
They price it lower, and sell it as "performance for the working man" or some such.
Most of the people who buy it aren't taking it to the drag strip or track, or street racing, they just want a big, loud, powerful V8 that will smoke the tires and look great in the driveway. Not many of them will really care if it gets worse gas mileage or depreciates faster, because that's not why they bought it.
Plus some people buy Ford and some buy Chevy, and that's just how it is.

So if Vega only just matches the 1080ti, it'll be priced better, and people who buy it to play games without staring at the frame counter won't care if Nvidia has something slightly more efficient or faster coming out in a few months. It'll make AMD plenty of money, because what matters to most buyers isn't which company is at the top of the pile, but if it does what they bought it to do.

 

[T1beriu]

Which brings the question:
Whats the point of even launching Vega if they have spent so much money on it, delayed it so much that it will end up barely paying for the engineering and manufacturing cost of Vega when all is said and done?

You answered your own question.

 

[Glo.]

What part of "stick to discussing Vega/Navi" are you incapable of understanding? Go be a drama queen somewhere else.
-- stahlhart