Vegan Low Carb options? Update: Fresh fruit, Veg, and Beans solved the problem!

Dr. Zaus

Lifer
Oct 16, 2008
11,770
347
126
Hi,

I'm looking for some Vegan Low Carb options. The google machine tells me you can't do a sub-50 diet and still go Vegan, but I've been doing it for a week now.

Right now I've been eating fresh broccoli, asparagus, green-beans, tomatoes, Cauliflower, Hummus, Almond Butter, and Avocados. I make an unsweetened coconut milk late at breakfast and a 100% coco powder almond milk late for my late night snack. It's been great for lowering my blood sugar, but right now I feel like vomiting and my guess is it's too damned much of the same thing.

If i'm running head-long into killing myself I'd like to know that too.

Any ideas?

UPDATE

Eating Fresh Fruit, Veg, Nuts, and Beans (+B12 & D) have lead me to lose 3 lbs a week averaged over the last 11 weeks!
 
Last edited:

FalconHorse

Member
Jul 22, 2011
169
0
76
You should eat more fat. Try some vegan fat bombs. Or try not being a vegan, ha. Anyway you need an energy source, and if you are low carb, you shouldn't also be low fat unless you want to wither and die slowly.
 

vi edit

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Oct 28, 1999
62,424
8,228
126
Can I just ask the reason you are going vegan? Is it under the assumption of health, or is it for social/religious/ect reasons?

I think you feel sick because you are starving. There's not enough calories in that list to keep a normal sized male going for a day.
 

Dr. Zaus

Lifer
Oct 16, 2008
11,770
347
126
Can I just ask the reason you are going vegan? Is it under the assumption of health, or is it for social/religious/ect reasons?

I think you feel sick because you are starving. There's not enough calories in that list to keep a normal sized male going for a day.

My dad just died of cancer (diagnosed stage 4 at 58), the research is strongly in favor of avoiding animals and animal products as food as a way to avoid cancer.

I'm also pre-diabetic. So restricting carbohydrates has done a great job of limiting my high blood sugar.

I'm I'm using a food-scale to make sure I consume 1500 calories a day and doing cardio, 1 hour a day, 600 calories, except Wednesdays when I stand up at work for 6 hours.

But that means a LOT of almond butter and avocados. I'm losing weight quickly too... and i'm not all that hungry: But the nausea is obnoxious.
 

hightree

Member
Jan 4, 2016
59
1
11
DixyCrat, from what I personally strongly believe is that study research cannot give you all answers about the optimal diet for you personally.

I believe your body response will tell you something about what is good for you. Nausea can tel you something.

By reducing carbs a lot you may be at risk to get too little iron and potassium, for example.

Carbs are no evil, not even for diabetics. Search for "slow carbs." Whole-grain bread and such.

Low-carb vegan foods that contain some calories are nuts, seeds, oils, margarine, dark chocolate...but I would listen my stomach after eating this repeatedly...
 

Kaido

Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
Feb 14, 2004
48,523
5,343
136
My dad just died of cancer (diagnosed stage 4 at 58), the research is strongly in favor of avoiding animals and animal products as food as a way to avoid cancer.

I'm also pre-diabetic. So restricting carbohydrates has done a great job of limiting my high blood sugar.

I'm I'm using a food-scale to make sure I consume 1500 calories a day and doing cardio, 1 hour a day, 600 calories, except Wednesdays when I stand up at work for 6 hours.

But that means a LOT of almond butter and avocados. I'm losing weight quickly too... and i'm not all that hungry: But the nausea is obnoxious.

Sorry to hear that man

If you haven't seen it already, check out the video "Forks over Knives":

http://www.forksoverknives.com/

Also watch "Fat, Sick, and Nearly Dead":

http://www.forksoverknives.com/

While I don't agree with everything in those videos, I do think that adding more veggies into your diet is a Good Thing. I've tried out a variety of diets over the years: paleo, vegetarian, vegan, raw vegan, fruitarian, IIFYM, etc. They all work pretty well if you do them right (like with 100% vegan, you need to add B12, and it's not something you can absorb via a pill, unfortunately).

If you're open to suggestions, I would recommend a couple of things: for starters, IIFYM (if it fits your macros) is the best food-power calculator I've worked with to give you an idea of how many calories & how much protein, carbs, and fat grams you should be eating per day. I'd suggest running through a free online calculator to see where you should be for your macro & calorie numbers, especially with all of the fat you're eating (even though it's healthy fat, eating a lot of almond butter & avocados is going to give you an enormous load of fat in your diet). Second, rather than just zeroing out your carbs, look into fiber in relation to diabetes (both high-fiber diets as a risk-reduction method & in terms of how fiber affects your daily carb intake numbers).

Third, you mentioned losing weight - simply being overweight puts you at risk for diabetes, so not only do you want to lose weight, but you're also going to want to build a new lifestyle in terms of eating that is sustainable long-term so that you don't gain the weight back & also manage your pre-diabetes. Going vegan is one way to do it, but keep in mind that it requires a lot more thought, prep, and planning to do it properly, and also limits you in a lot of social situations. It's totally doable, but if you're still open to being an omnivore, I'd suggest simply reducing your animal protein intake rather than totally eliminating it. For example, instead of a double-bacon cheeseburger, go with a single-patty burger with lettuce, tomatoes, pickles, etc. to kind of balance the meat out. Basically, put it in more of a minor role than a major role. If you are set on going vegan, or at least want to include more delicious vegan recipes, let me know as I have a truckload of them. You can make some amazingly delicious food without meat!

It sounds like you've gotten a wake-up call in terms of health & are actively working on losing weight, improving your diet, and managing your healthy to avoid diabetics, so congrats on being proactive about that! I would definitely look into stuff like IIFYM, fiber intake, and even re-introducing meat into your diet as part of your long-term health strategy. There's a lot of confusing information out there & it's easy to get overly-excited and go down a path that isn't going to give you the best results. There are people here who can give better advice than I can, but definitely check out some of things things listed above to help refine the path you're going down.
 

vi edit

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Oct 28, 1999
62,424
8,228
126
My dad just died of cancer (diagnosed stage 4 at 58), the research is strongly in favor of avoiding animals and animal products as food as a way to avoid cancer.

I'm also pre-diabetic. So restricting carbohydrates has done a great job of limiting my high blood sugar.

I'm I'm using a food-scale to make sure I consume 1500 calories a day and doing cardio, 1 hour a day, 600 calories, except Wednesdays when I stand up at work for 6 hours.

But that means a LOT of almond butter and avocados. I'm losing weight quickly too... and i'm not all that hungry: But the nausea is obnoxious.

You are starving yourself. That's a net of 900 calories. Almost half what your body needs at an absolute minimum. Plus I'm certain you are missing a good number of macro-nutrients in your day. No dietitian would ever approve of that plan. You are actually doing your metabolism a disservice.

I won't argue the merits of a vegan diet, but overall your plan is not a sound one nor one you can sustain.
 

Dr. Zaus

Lifer
Oct 16, 2008
11,770
347
126
Kaito: Thank you for the ideas. Being a geek I think i'm going to geek out and create my own tabulations for IFFYMicros, so i hit all the basic vitamins and proper kinds of proteans. Then I'll add or subtract things intentionally until my body says "this is good".

You are starving yourself. That's a net of 900 calories. Almost half what your body needs at an absolute minimum. Plus I'm certain you are missing a good number of macro-nutrients in your day. No dietitian would ever approve of that plan. You are actually doing your metabolism a disservice.

I won't argue the merits of a vegan diet, but overall your plan is not a sound one nor one you can sustain.
I didn't realize I was going sub 1200 until you mentioned this. I'm going to find a way to tack on another 300 calories.

I just wasn't noticing because I wasn't hungry.

Looking at health issues right now I'm thinking of adding back Salmon. I love it, it loves me, and it's got some micro-nutrients that I just won't get from my present diet, which is about 2/3rds nut-fats (in terms of calories; volumetrically it's like 90% veg).

I'm also thinking this doesn't need to be a 7 day a week diet. I would be very happy with life if I could eat a very nice meal of anything I like on Friday when I go out with my wife, and stick to a very regimented and smart diet the rest of the week.


I really appreciate the thoughtful guidance.
 

Dr. Zaus

Lifer
Oct 16, 2008
11,770
347
126
"My dad just died of cancer (diagnosed stage 4 at 58), the research is strongly in favor of avoiding animals and animal products as food as a way to avoid cancer.

I'm also pre-diabetic. So restricting carbohydrates has done a great job of limiting my high blood sugar."
 
Last edited:

magomago

Lifer
Sep 28, 2002
10,973
14
76
Sorry dude, while a Vegan Diet is great, HFLC (High Fat Low Carb) Vegan is a terrible diet choice and is going to be difficult to sustain long term.

Go the reverse, HCLF (High Carb Low Fat) and you'll find yourself doing amazing, as well as watch your pre diabetes reverse.

Diabetes is a disease of fat toxicity.
 

Dr. Zaus

Lifer
Oct 16, 2008
11,770
347
126
Could you follow up on the last point? It seems like my blood sugar score is much better with the hflc than hclf.
 

magomago

Lifer
Sep 28, 2002
10,973
14
76
Could you follow up on the last point? It seems like my blood sugar score is much better with the hflc than hclf.

Its scientific fact - nothing controversial here:

http://nutritionfacts.org/video/what-causes-insulin-resistance/
http://nutritionfacts.org/video/lipotoxicity-how-saturated-fat-raises-blood-sugar/
http://nutritionfacts.org/video/Diabetes-as-a-Disease-of-Fat-Toxicity/

You can check out lots of other related videos in Doctor's Note, or even look at the references and go the literature yourself.
 

Dr. Zaus

Lifer
Oct 16, 2008
11,770
347
126
Its scientific fact - nothing controversial here:

http://nutritionfacts.org/video/what-causes-insulin-resistance/
http://nutritionfacts.org/video/lipotoxicity-how-saturated-fat-raises-blood-sugar/
http://nutritionfacts.org/video/Diabetes-as-a-Disease-of-Fat-Toxicity/

You can check out lots of other related videos in Doctor's Note, or even look at the references and go the literature yourself.

This is fucking insane... how did I not know this?!

That said, i'm eating only vegetable, nuts, olive, and avocados. I guess I'll be on animal-fat-free diet until they make low-saturated fat cheese.
 
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magomago

Lifer
Sep 28, 2002
10,973
14
76
Yeah its no joke - its all legit. They have a team that just focuses on putting together puzzles of nutrition research. I am pretty addicted to it.
The best part is they synthesis the epidemiological research, with the clinical research, with the mechanistic lab-bench research. Its quite compelling when all three can line up.

You can also look into Dr Neal Barnard's book on Reversing Diabetes. Long story short: eat like a high carb vegan.
 

Dr. Zaus

Lifer
Oct 16, 2008
11,770
347
126
Yeah its no joke - its all legit. They have a team that just focuses on putting together puzzles of nutrition research. I am pretty addicted to it.
The best part is they synthesis the epidemiological research, with the clinical research, with the mechanistic lab-bench research. Its quite compelling when all three can line up.

You can also look into Dr Neal Barnard's book on Reversing Diabetes. Long story short: eat like a high carb vegan.

I've been addicted to these videos: I haven't seen them all but I'm still not sold on noodles for someone with (pre)diabetes.

I have switched to fresh fruit and veg, nuts and mushrooms.
 

purbeast0

No Lifer
Sep 13, 2001
52,942
5,819
126
is protein powder vegan? i am not vegan but i drink 3 protein shakes a day with almond milk, 2 scoops of powder, and it's like 7 or so carbs per shake and like 50g of protein.

and only eating 1500 calories but doing an hour of cardio is hurting your body more than helping. and btw those "calorie calculators" that the machines tell you that you are burning are just a guideline and could be completely off as to what you're burning. there's a lot more to the equation than just weight + distance ran.
 

Kaido

Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
Feb 14, 2004
48,523
5,343
136
is protein powder vegan? i am not vegan but i drink 3 protein shakes a day with almond milk, 2 scoops of powder, and it's like 7 or so carbs per shake and like 50g of protein.

and only eating 1500 calories but doing an hour of cardio is hurting your body more than helping. and btw those "calorie calculators" that the machines tell you that you are burning are just a guideline and could be completely off as to what you're burning. there's a lot more to the equation than just weight + distance ran.

If it's an animal-free product, then yes:

* Hemp protein powder
* Brown rice protein powder
* Yellow pea protein powder
* Soy protein powder

Otherwise, no:

* Whey protein powder
* Casein protein powder
* Beef isolate protein powder
 

magomago

Lifer
Sep 28, 2002
10,973
14
76
I've been addicted to these videos: I haven't seen them all but I'm still not sold on noodles for someone with (pre)diabetes.

I have switched to fresh fruit and veg, nuts and mushrooms.

Just focus on whole plant starches - rices, potatoes, grains...you ultimately need a source of starches to be the foundation of a diet, else you'll fall off the vegan bandwagon.

Fruit is great, but its not available to some year round, and while I love fruit and its simple sugars, it doesn't have the same satiation as complex carbs for me.
 

Dr. Zaus

Lifer
Oct 16, 2008
11,770
347
126
Just focus on whole plant starches - rices, potatoes, grains...you ultimately need a source of starches to be the foundation of a diet, else you'll fall off the vegan bandwagon.

Fruit is great, but its not available to some year round, and while I love fruit and its simple sugars, it doesn't have the same satiation as complex carbs for me.

Flax Seeds.. I'm just concerned about pushing up against my blood sugar with complex carbs... Also i'm losing a ton of weight, very encouraging.
 

magomago

Lifer
Sep 28, 2002
10,973
14
76
Flax Seeds.. I'm just concerned about pushing up against my blood sugar with complex carbs... Also i'm losing a ton of weight, very encouraging.

*shrugs* research, clinical studies, and epidemiology doesn't support what you think. cut the animal products (which are mostly fat) and fat, and one will naturally reverse type 2 diabetes or prediabetes.
Ultimately unless you have that staple starch, you will fail and go back. Long term its just not possible. But I get that perceptions are super hard to change, so I respect your approach - I'm just trying to caution as much as I can.

Carbs doesn't make you fat, fat makes you fat. Look at this guy, since Jan 1st he lost over 80 lbs and counting on just potatoes (i.e. carbs and protein with tinnny amount of fat); he eats over 8 lbs of potatoes a day... Not saying to do it, but its ancedotal evidence that aligns with research showing that starches aren't making us fat Check out the last set of images.

https://www.facebook.com/spudfit/
http://www.spudfit.com/
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...g-potato-diet-lost-32kg-starting-January.html
 

Kaido

Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
Feb 14, 2004
48,523
5,343
136
Flax Seeds.. I'm just concerned about pushing up against my blood sugar with complex carbs... Also i'm losing a ton of weight, very encouraging.

Just make sure you grind up the flax seeds...your body has a hard time digesting the whole seed.
 

Dr. Zaus

Lifer
Oct 16, 2008
11,770
347
126
*shrugs* research, clinical studies, and epidemiology doesn't support what you think. cut the animal products (which are mostly fat) and fat, and one will naturally reverse type 2 diabetes or prediabetes.
Ultimately unless you have that staple starch, you will fail and go back. Long term its just not possible. But I get that perceptions are super hard to change, so I respect your approach - I'm just trying to caution as much as I can.

Carbs doesn't make you fat, fat makes you fat. Look at this guy, since Jan 1st he lost over 80 lbs and counting on just potatoes (i.e. carbs and protein with tinnny amount of fat); he eats over 8 lbs of potatoes a day... Not saying to do it, but its ancedotal evidence that aligns with research showing that starches aren't making us fat Check out the last set of images.

https://www.facebook.com/spudfit/
http://www.spudfit.com/
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...g-potato-diet-lost-32kg-starting-January.html

I appreciate that. When I've got a good fasting blood sugar and 2 hour blood sugar after breakfast that's inline with healthfulness i'll start experimenting beyond my "fresh fruit, veg, nuts and mushrooms" only diet.

I'm thinking colorful rices, black beans, and lentils.
 
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