WaPo: Roy Moore underage sex allegations. 12/4 update: Trump endorses. Jones wins

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K1052

Elite Member
Aug 21, 2003
46,880
34,834
136
So the uniform response from just about every GOP rep/Senator has carried the qualifier "if this is true". Why not just say if he's dumb enough to admit he did it then he should step down but otherwise, rock on!

McCain didn't qualify his statement that way, FWIW.

Reality is that Moore will not withdraw no matter what anybody in Congress says. They only real remedy they have now is to get a write in campaign going to deny him the votes to win the election. That means Jones comes to the senate but given the alternatives politically I don't see much choice.
 

woolfe9998

Lifer
Apr 8, 2013
16,189
14,102
136
Moore is denying it. Says it's a conspiracy of the liberal Washington Post and the DNC. Never saw that coming. Shocked!
 
Reactions: DarthKyrie
Mar 11, 2004
23,181
5,645
146
I'm actually getting irritated that so far only Cosby has gone to trial, and that fell apart with a hung jury.

We need closure on all this shit.

Look, I've been harsh on you, and I'll be up front, I think this this post might actually be the worst of them. But I'll try to be less abrasive, in attempt to not just be a dick and hopefully you can understand why I feel that way.

I think this is the wrong attitude to have. For a variety of reasons. First, we aren't the ones that need closure as we're not the ones affected by their heinous acts. Plus, as we're finding out, this is just the start of the floodgates opening, so you shouldn't be looking for closure anyway, you should be going "WTF, we need to make a strong point of making sure that this shit stops - or, knowing that it will continue as it seems, sadly, inherent to some human nature - isn't allowed to get to this level again" and look to root this behavior and the people perpetrating and enabling it (with emphasis that the former are the ones that really need to be held accountable, but the latter will hopefully self-reflect and go "I need to change" too). Lastly, you want closure over like a year or less of actual allegations for shit that people were doing for decades to what seems to be ballooning into hundreds to thousands, and when we take into account the full amount likely millions? No, we need to make sure that due process is followed, and give it time so that the victims can be heard (and not dismissed, or even attacked like was the status quo in the past), but that we also actually investigate this stuff properly. Don't let it get into a frenzy where we actually take into account the situations, and it doesn't turn into free for all, where the worst monsters get lost in the overall fury and people just saying kinda shitty stuff don't get lumped in with them equally.

McCain didn't qualify his statement that way, FWIW.

Reality is that Moore will not withdraw no matter what anybody in Congress says. They only real remedy they have now is to get a write in campaign going to deny him the votes to win the election. That means Jones comes to the senate but given the alternatives politically I don't see much choice.

I've been harsh on McCain, but he finally seems to be realizing that if he keeps towing the party line that his legacy will be completely trashed once society really starts to turn on the Republican party post Nixon (the Republican party of the last 20 years is going to overshadow Nixon and Reagan for how unfondly their legacy is looked upon). Unfortunately he's still trying to keep his legacy as a typical conservative intact as well, which means he's not breaking from them that much. I mean, its sad that we're lauding him for not couching his statement of condemnation for such horrible allegations, but that's the state of the modern Republican party.
 

woolfe9998

Lifer
Apr 8, 2013
16,189
14,102
136
The religious argument for a pro-pedophile plank in a future GOP party platform coming together:


Per the Bible, IIRC Joseph and Mary actually never had sex. Moore fondled this 14 year old. Maybe Joseph groped Mary a little after she gave him blue balls one too many times.
 
Reactions: DarthKyrie
Mar 11, 2004
23,181
5,645
146
The religious argument for a pro-pedophile plank in a future GOP party platform coming together:


And people wonder why religion has become the dividing line. Its because it is what fuels their other bullshit, their willingness to believe whatever they want facts be damned, and their gross incompetency and hypocrisy.

Its why they're miserable though too, as its becoming harder and harder for them to maintain their bubble of delusion, so they have to resort to more and more nonsensical (and atrocious) mangling of logic to sustain it. Which is becoming more and more at odds with the world as their lack of reason is exposed and they have to actually answer for it. And their echo chambers are not as cavernous, nor are they as protective as they once thought.
 
Reactions: DarthKyrie
Mar 11, 2004
23,181
5,645
146
Per the Bible, IIRC Joseph and Mary actually never had sex. Moore fondled this 14 year old. Maybe Joseph groped Mary a little after she gave him blue balls one too many times.

I'm not sure they're implying anything about sex, although that does highlight how stupid their reasoning is. They're either implying its fine or that somehow Moore is more Godly for being that way. Both of which, is straight fucked.
 

K1052

Elite Member
Aug 21, 2003
46,880
34,834
136
I'm honestly wondering at this point if there is anything, at all, evangelical christians won't countenance in the pursuit of their political aims. Doesn't seem to be.
 
Reactions: DarthKyrie
Jan 25, 2011
16,634
8,778
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Another gem fro Zeigler

Alabama State Auditor Jim Ziegler: “There is nothing to see here. The allegations are that a man in his early 30s dated teenage girls. Even the Washington Post report says that he never had sexual intercourse with any of the girls.”
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
84,818
49,514
136
Per the Bible, IIRC Joseph and Mary actually never had sex. Moore fondled this 14 year old. Maybe Joseph groped Mary a little after she gave him blue balls one too many times.

This might only be a handful of people saying repugnant things like this but my first guess is that most Republicans will stand behind Moore anyway if he stays in the race. I hope I'm wrong because if I'm not that means the sickness on the extreme right has gotten so bad that the same people who so boldly (and endlessly) declared they were for moral values are basically defending a child molester at this point. (yes I know the technical act is generally for children under 14 but close enough)
 
Reactions: DarthKyrie

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
110,810
29,564
146
The religious argument for a pro-pedophile plank in a future GOP party platform coming together:


So Mary got her immaculate conception by being rubbed on by creepy older Jospeh?

Is that what they are going with, to justify this fuckstain Roy Moore?
 
Reactions: DarthKyrie

woolfe9998

Lifer
Apr 8, 2013
16,189
14,102
136
This might only be a handful of people saying repugnant things like this but my first guess is that most Republicans will stand behind Moore anyway if he stays in the race. I hope I'm wrong because if I'm not that means the sickness on the extreme right has gotten so bad that the same people who so boldly (and endlessly) declared they were for moral values are basically defending a child molester at this point. (yes I know the technical act is generally for children under 14 but close enough)

Nah, there's no way you're wrong. If he chooses to run he'll do just as well with conservative voters as he would have without this story. Not a one of them will ever believe any allegation of wrongdoing against any fellow conservative. Allegations against Hollywood types are of course treated as undisputed fact.
 
Reactions: DarthKyrie

K1052

Elite Member
Aug 21, 2003
46,880
34,834
136
This might only be a handful of people saying repugnant things like this but my first guess is that most Republicans will stand behind Moore anyway if he stays in the race. I hope I'm wrong because if I'm not that means the sickness on the extreme right has gotten so bad that the same people who so boldly (and endlessly) declared they were for moral values are basically defending a child molester at this point. (yes I know the technical act is generally for children under 14 but close enough)

Moore isn't going to leave the race. His history should be sufficient proof that no matter what gets uncovered he isn't going anywhere unless forced.

Reportedly there is more stuff expected to come out.
 

woolfe9998

Lifer
Apr 8, 2013
16,189
14,102
136
I'm not sure they're implying anything about sex, although that does highlight how stupid their reasoning is. They're either implying its fine or that somehow Moore is more Godly for being that way. Both of which, is straight fucked.

It doesn't make any sense precisely because Moore is accused of groping a 14 year old, not being in a sexless marriage with a 14 year old.
 

UNCjigga

Lifer
Dec 12, 2000
24,843
9,092
136
Nothing about these allegations sounds "made up". Seems at least one girl remembers details of the cabin he drove her to, unpaved driveway etc. Also, it doesn't seem any of the girls are saying that Moore forced himself on them--he merely pursued and guided them along and when they got uncomfortable he stopped and drove them home. I guess for the South in the late 70s, he was practically a gentleman. Hell, if he'd been 21 and she 14, they could have legally been married.

I don't understand why Moore went straight to denial rather than "that was a different time, and I was a gentleman". I bet his base would eat it up.
 

bshole

Diamond Member
Mar 12, 2013
8,315
1,215
126
Moore isn't going to leave the race. His history should be sufficient proof that no matter what gets uncovered he isn't going anywhere unless forced.

Reportedly there is more stuff expected to come out.

This is kind of funny because there is a Democrat Senator (Menendez) on trial right now who the Republicans claim will never leave even if convicted.
 

woolfe9998

Lifer
Apr 8, 2013
16,189
14,102
136
Nothing about these allegations sounds "made up". Seems at least one girl remembers details of the cabin he drove her to, unpaved driveway etc. Also, it doesn't seem any of the girls are saying that Moore forced himself on them--he merely pursued and guided them along and when they got uncomfortable he stopped and drove them home. I guess for the South in the late 70s, he was practically a gentleman. Hell, if he'd been 21 and she 14, they could have legally been married.

I don't understand why Moore went straight to denial rather than "that was a different time, and I was a gentleman". I bet his base would eat it up.

He had to deny it because he was 32 and she was 14. I don't think any amount of "that was a different time" is going to hold up in today's climate, not with this sort of accusation.

I agree the fact that they are not accusing him of physically forcing himself on them lends credibility to their accounts.
 

OutHouse

Lifer
Jun 5, 2000
36,413
616
126
Well that's fucked up.

What's even more fucked up? The right will dismiss this as obviously made up in an attempt to smear him and nothing more.

I'm sure the usual suspects already have a thread attacking her.

And the left will hang him without any evidence.

See I can play your stupid game as well
 

K1052

Elite Member
Aug 21, 2003
46,880
34,834
136
This is kind of funny because there is a Democrat Senator (Menendez) on trial right now who the Republicans claim will never leave even if convicted.

Won't know until he is or isn't convicted. That jury appears to be hung at the moment.
 

vi edit

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Oct 28, 1999
62,403
8,199
126
I'm sure there is no small part of McConnell that is secretly smiling ear to ear on this. Bannon played with fire and is starting to feel the burn.
 

UNCjigga

Lifer
Dec 12, 2000
24,843
9,092
136
And the left will hang him without any evidence.

See I can play your stupid game as well

Speaking for myself (not lefty enough perhaps?) I wouldn't hang him for acts committed nearly 40 years ago... especially if it was statutory in nature and not physical assault. Sure it's still wrong, but what's worse is if he lies about it and blames the accusers and the press.

Lying about it is what would make him unfit for office. Unfortunately, I'm one of those old fashioned folks who stills sees sexual assault as a spectrum and not black and white. Moore's actions (based on what we know so far) pale in comparison to Weinstein, Cosby and Spacey.
 
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