WARM: General Motors Ups Warranty Coverage

[ClockerXP]

OTOTOTOTOTOTOTOTOTO

 

[cparent]

Originally posted by: MrX8503

Originally posted by: cparent

Originally posted by: vadp
FACT: for year 2005
GM losses - $10.6 billion
Toyota profits - $12.1 billion

Explain that!!!

Sure. GM puts more quality and expense into it's cars than Toyota which is why GM has 2 of the 5 spots in quality. Therefore causing a loss instead of a profit for the year 2005.

Why do people just make up these assumptions? How do you know that GM is at a loss because they put more quality parts into their cars? You dont even know if that is true, do you work for GM?

I'm proud to be an American as i'm sure everyone in this thread are too, but the fact is that foreign cars are more reliable. I searched "most reliable car" through google and all I get are raves about foreign cars, honda this, honda that. Here are some links that came up.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7119221/
http://www.gizmag.com/go/5657/
http://www.forbes.com/2006/04/20/reliable-vehicles-japanese_cx_dl_0424feat.html
http://72.14.203.104/search?q=cache:1bW...n&gl=us&ct=clnk&cd=13&client=firefox-a
http://autoreview.belproject.com/item/200

I'm not saying that American cars are bad, but people who say they are much superior to foreign cars need to wake up.

You quoted out of context, missed the "/sarcasm off" part to answer a stupid question, link ed reports from broken links and sources noone has heard of, and missed the points. let me help you understand.

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/08/13/autom...2bc0b98&ei=5088&partner=rssnyt&emc=rss

NYTimes. Semi reliable source. One people have heard of for sure. 2006 data. not years old. Current. This year as a matter of fact.

Aside from lexus, american companies are leading the way, as I had already stated. Please do not muddy this and make stuff up with broken links and sources noone has heard of. If you want to sum up all of the companies, you can say that Mitsubishi of America, Volkswagen, Nissan of America, Kia, Suzuki, and Porche are the worst car companies for quality. How many of those are japanese and how many are american? How many of those are foreign and how many are american?

http://www.caranddriver.com/dailyautoin...rean-cars-rise-in-quality-ratings.html

and you still think we need to wake up?

What's important is this. You will notice if you look at todays figures (again please don't muddy this with data from the 80's/90's or years ago as I'll show data from th 60's and 70's where foreign cars didnt last a year) is that almost all American car makers, a few of the top end Japanese car makers, and BMW are all neck and neck in being top in quality. There's not much spread at the top. But the bottom of the pack is a different story. Again, of the top 5 for 2006 in quality, 3 are American car companies; 2 are japanese.


And we suck in quality? are you argueing me or the data provided by JD power and NY Times? Fine if you want to argue with me, but if you want to argue JD powers data and NY times data, save us both time and email them. I can't change their data.

/boggle.

 

[njcoig]

Originally posted by: lbhskier37

Originally posted by: njcoig
It's common knowledge that as a rule of thumb, the longer the warranty a company offers, the shoddier the quality of their products.

Not sure who taught that, but they don't really understand manufacturing much. You can't have a longer warrantee without having a part that lasts longer, unless you don't like making money.

I disagree with your assertion. If you build a crappy product that cost nothing to build, it costs similarly nothing to replace. You bank on the chance of the warranty by extrapolating the number of likely failures, the number of likely repairs, and the overall life of the product, the consumer's behavior, etc. e.g., if you can either spend the money on a good quality product to offer or take the CHANCE that you can half-ass it and not get tagged with a warranty claim, you go with the crappy product, because, like rebates, lots of people won't bother. It 's all marketing strategies. Further, if you can make a REALLY shoddy product, you can build in the price of one replacement to the cost, and provide a long warranty to build consumer confidence in a product that merits none.

-N

 

[njcoig]

Originally posted by: zephyrprime
-N

I don't seem to recall any situation where that was true.
[/quote]

Computer memory, Rolex watches vs. Casio or Timex, CARS (Kia vs. Rolls/BMW/Audi), the list goes on.

-N

 

[vadp]

Originally posted by: cparent
And we suck in quality? are you argueing me or the data provided by JD power and NY Times? Fine if you want to argue with me, but if you want to argue JD powers data and NY times data, save us both time and email them. I can't change their data.

Why are you so stuck up on JD Power and its initial qualitiy survey?
GM can barely keep up on quality with the Japanese by extending its product cycles and staying away from the new technologies as long as the market can bear.
Are you proud of that? Crappy outdated product won't gain market share, doesn't matter how reliable it is.
An average quality product is the norm of the day.
GM and Ford are falling farther and farther behind their japanese competition in technological innovations.
Quality being equal, the public will go for the most advanced and up to date product based on the modern technologies.
Isn't why the Japanese continue to expand their market share while the domestic's are receding?

 

[Gilby]

Originally posted by: cparent
Tell me where your car is made again? Tell me where your money goes when you buy cars again? Explain to me how your honda is better for America than a GM or Ford. Explain to me why GM has 2 cars in the top 5 for vehicle dependability and honda has 0.

You really are a dumbass.

 

[ClockerXP]

Don't feed the trolls and stay On Topic.

 

[GTFan]

ClockerXP, you're trying hard (admirably) to keep this on topic, but you had to know where it was going to go. Give it up man, it's ready for a lock.

 

[chucky2]

I just want to say (before this thread gets locked ), that I worked a few years ago at the Ford/Mercury Chicago Assembly Plant that built Ford Taurus's and Mercury Sable's.

I've read through a lot of this thread and see the posts about quality, and I can tell you that the folks (99% of them) who are busting their @sses on the line/wherever there are very concerned about quality. Their definitely blue collar, but they care. The problem is not the "grunts" in the plant, it's management.

Management purely cares about cars rolling off the end of the line, that's it. I personally told them about seats popping staples out the back when I was on rear seat load, and nothing happened. Got loaned out to the end of the line one day and asked about trunks that didn't look right on one corner and got told to "don't even F'ing look at that". Turns out a bunch got stamped wrong, so they just kept running them through...

The people who work their behinds off there deserve respect...they have good pay and benefits (possible only because of unions, please don't even tell me management would give what their giving if we didn't have unions...go read The Jungle to see management mentality) but they do darn hard work in tough conditions and produce as fine product as possible.

The common thread when you talk to someone on the line is that they only put on the cr@p that management gives them...don't blame poor engineering and cost cutting on the factory workers, it ain't their fault.

Chuck

P.S. Coming from a family that has driven many x hundred thousand mile Ford's and other Domestic's, and having recently driven a very low milage like new condition '05 Accord, I can say I'm not really impressed...was expecting to be blown away...was very anticlimatic.

 

[kaxx]

Hey guys, had to get in on this. I've owned a Toyota Tacoma, A nissan Frontier (still own), and a Chevy S10.

From my point of view, as far as reliability goes the Tacoma absolutely killed the rest, next is my Frontier, and last but far behind is the S10. As far as ride comfort and features go, The S10 was the most comfortable, then the Nissan, Then far behind is the Tacoma.

In all reality, what good is a warranty on a junk car that may end up in a shop all the time anyway?? Sure, Chevy may have 2 of the top 5 cars out there according to the JD report, but without me looking I'd almost bet that most of the rest are far below par. I've got a 1 or 2 year old consumer reports book that lists almost all of the Toyota's as recommended buys, while Chevy only had maybe 3 or 4....

My father had a Trailblazer he bought brand new, but he traded it in for a Toyota Tacoma because it was needing all sorts of repairs.....at only 70K miles!! He's still driving the Tacoma, approaching 40K miles without a single problem. I won't even start to compare resale/trade in values!!

Bottom line is Toyota's are more dependable in my experience, but a far worse ride. But my trade in value was a lot higher than my S10. So, unless Chevy can do more than a 100K warranty, I'll stick with Toyota or Nissan since reliability is more important to me than ride comfort, but I'm young as well and can deal with a jostling ride.

 

[LuckyStrike]

Why start something like this in Hot Deals?

OTOTOTOTOT

Hey Joe here bout the hot warranty deal I got, yea paid 35000 fo a 25000 car but hey this sucker is covered almost till she is paid for huh?

 

[kaxx]

Originally posted by: LuckyStrike
Why start something like this in Hot Deals?

OTOTOTOTOT

Hey Joe here bout the hot warranty deal I got, yea paid 35000 fo a 25000 car but hey this sucker is covered almost till she is paid for huh?

It actually was supposed to be a hot deal, then turned into a hot debate.....

 

[MrX8503]

You quoted out of context, missed the "/sarcasm off" part to answer a stupid question, link ed reports from broken links and sources noone has heard of, and missed the points. let me help you understand.

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/08/13/autom...2bc0b98&ei=5088&partner=rssnyt&emc=rss

NYTimes. Semi reliable source. One people have heard of for sure. 2006 data. not years old. Current. This year as a matter of fact.

Aside from lexus, american companies are leading the way, as I had already stated. Please do not muddy this and make stuff up with broken links and sources noone has heard of. If you want to sum up all of the companies, you can say that Mitsubishi of America, Volkswagen, Nissan of America, Kia, Suzuki, and Porche are the worst car companies for quality. How many of those are japanese and how many are american? How many of those are foreign and how many are american?

http://www.caranddriver.com/dailyautoin...rean-cars-rise-in-quality-ratings.html

and you still think we need to wake up?

What's important is this. You will notice if you look at todays figures (again please don't muddy this with data from the 80's/90's or years ago as I'll show data from th 60's and 70's where foreign cars didnt last a year) is that almost all American car makers, a few of the top end Japanese car makers, and BMW are all neck and neck in being top in quality. There's not much spread at the top. But the bottom of the pack is a different story. Again, of the top 5 for 2006 in quality, 3 are American car companies; 2 are japanese.


And we suck in quality? are you argueing me or the data provided by JD power and NY Times? Fine if you want to argue with me, but if you want to argue JD powers data and NY times data, save us both time and email them. I can't change their data.

/boggle.

oh my gosh, stop the train, ONE article was out of date by ~2years, somehow miracously GM has released their magic fairies and has increased their car quality in just 2 years. Nevermind the fact that all the other articles were 2006. Forbes was a broken link because it didnt allow direct linking.

Somehow ~2year old articles are articles from the 80's/90's? lol

My point was with those links was that when i searched "most reliable car" I had a very hard time finding any site mentioning domestic cars. Almost every consecutive link said "foreign, foriegn, foriegn". I could of searched more to find more reputable sites, but when I couldnt find an article about how reliable domestic cars are, what does that say?

 

[snowdogg187]

Originally posted by: vadp
It's an act of desperation.
The competition is killing them.
Very few people will be swinged by the powertrain warranty gimmick.

Ford is in the same boat.

 

[Zap]

Originally posted by: Calgar99
(Still probably the only one laughing about Duramax, Cummins, Power Stroke...)

It's not just you.

Originally posted by: nealh
The real problem with cars is trusting them(dealers and repair shops) to fix things right, honestly...my personal feeling is many dealers are just not top notch on the Repair side..I really feel duped every time something needs to be fixed

Out of three dealers that I've visited in the past few years for repairs, I would not go back to two of them. The third one is over 1000 miles away. Most recent visit to a local Ford dealer? It was for a rough idling problem that they tried fixing twice and failed, plus my fuel guage doesn't work properly and they basically told me to "live with it" in about those words. The "good" dealer service center was in California (I'm now in WI). They'd even occasionally phone me the week after repairs to make sure that I was satisfied. :shocked:

I've now found two local shops that seem to be run well and the owners of both are also mechanics there. So far so good on the repair work - too bad my Ford Contour needs so many repairs. :| My mother's two Mercury Sables (1989, 1998) were actually sorta trouble-free for the most part. The newer one made a really strange and annoying noise from the engine area on a cold start since it was new but that hasn't caused any problems. Of course the dealer basically said "oh they all do that" when that was BS. My father's 1994 Ford F150 truck was NOT trouble-free. Just out of the 3 year warranty it developed annoying electrical problems that would come and go, affecting transmission shifting, A/C, odometer, etc., as in it all goes to crap and then magically starts working again after a while. Of course the dealer couldn't find anything wrong with it.

Regardless of anything else, I probably won't be buying a Ford for my next vehicle because they have nothing that I envision myself driving. I don't need or want an SUV or truck which is half of what they're selling. I want a sleek looking sporty sedan. My Contour (SVT BTW) fit that bill. Nothing else they make at this time does.

 

[Bekker]

IMHO Ford may be on the right track with their new Merc Milan and Ford version of same car, especially if they decide to offer beefed up versions, All 3 domestic are moving more in the right direction with new Mustang, Camaro, and Challenger as examples. The Solstice and Vue are big improvements too.

One of my ex-students is or was with the Caddy division and gave a presentation to some of my classes in which he indicated to watch for the Caddy and Saturn lines to be dramatically changed not long before the resurgence of Caddy and what looks great for Saturn.

Getting back to the thread topic, the longer warranty should offer more assurance we are at least going to be taken care of if problems arise. Personally, I prefer buying extended warranties from outside suppliers and getting rebates or other price incentives from producers. If you check quotes on extended warranties from outside vendors you will find that it is relatively inexpensive to get a 100k warranty that covers more for a few grand or so, since the manufacturer's wrrnty covers the first years and miles. That is less than the amount of discounts being given by other auto producers.

 

[FranksAndBeans]

I think the warranty is great, and this is a very useful post for someone teetering on buying a 2006 model.

People who think this warranty change is "worthless" or a "gimmick" are either just plain retarded or don't understand modern manufacturing variation. Everyone makes a few lemons.

 

[e b h]

Originally posted by: tealk
Kia sucks a$$...that's my contribution!

We own a 1999 GMC Diesel Suburban that had to have the engine replace at 110,000 miles (10,000 miles after the warranty ended)(Diesel has always had the 100,000 mile powertrain warranty). By the way, in North Carolina a Chevy dealer will not work on a GMC Suburban (was told this by the 6 different Chevy dealers accross the state (doesn't seem to be an issue in Virgina). The replacement engine cost just over $10,000 and I couldn't get financing for it so ended up having to buy a new car te get from point A to point B. The car I got was a KIA. The GMC blew up while out looking for a car for my wife who's Neon lost it's transmision at just over 100,000 miles (fair enough, that's what I expect from a domestic car)(expected a lot more from a Diesel engine however). Anyway, we got her a KIA also.

No problems out of either KIA, they get from point A to point B. I don't like the size of the gas tank and I like the size of my truck much better (which I have now paid the engine off on and can drive again). My wife however hates the truck because of the cost of the engine, the fact that one window doesn't work, and the power locks work less than half the time. She likes the Kia and thinks GM sucks.

 

[Ktulu]

Seriously you guys there is a thread in Off Topic about this.

 

[Ktulu]

Originally posted by: FranksAndBeans
I think the warranty is great, and this is a very useful post for someone teetering on buying a 2006 model.

People who think this warranty change is "worthless" or a "gimmick" are either just plain retarded or don't understand modern manufacturing variation. Everyone makes a few lemons.

Exactly, for all those GM bashers/import lovers, please google Toyota and Recall i'm sure you will be shocked.