We Have Reached The Limit Of Our Technology

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Nov 28, 2010
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Are you following what I'm saying? I'm not talking about press-printing or photocopying, I'm talking about an actual PC printer that can print a full-color 11x8.5 page per second, a home PC printer, not a 250-ft-long industrial newspaper press

I'm happily awaiting from you guys a YouTube video of such a home printer, or a 25 Ghz chip installed on a home PC.
 
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KIAman

Diamond Member
Mar 7, 2001
3,342
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You're basing the end of technology on 4ghz general processor clock? The frequency of a chip is all cock and bull. It is only a metric that the masses of ignorant mules can understand.

It's trivial to make a CPU that runs 100Ghz. It's hard to make it do useful work.

No, we are not at the peak of our technological renaissance. We have just began, imo.
 

Anteaus

Platinum Member
Oct 28, 2010
2,448
4
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I just read we have almost reached the physical reach of our technology, there's a reason why our PC chips don't go higher than 4 ghz processing power, its because you can't cram more layers into them without going bigger in size. Its the same reason why we will never reach near-light speeds, there is no material strong enough to prevent that spaceship from disentigrating from the particle bombardment at that speed.

Discuss your views.

The answer to your processor limit comment is bandwidth. Individually there are limits to what we can do with them, but when you use groups of them those limitations are greatly reduced.

Your light speed description is true only in regards to pure newtonian physics. Throw relativity in there and at those speeds energy is the deciding factor, not friction.

But those are linear speeds. Faster than light (FTL) travel is not the same thing as going faster than the speed of light, so depending on how you approach it can net different responses.
 

airdata

Diamond Member
Jul 11, 2010
4,987
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0
People on ebay list 5,6,12ghz systems all the time.

Or do they just not know how to properly label what they're selling?
 

Anteaus

Platinum Member
Oct 28, 2010
2,448
4
81
People on ebay list 5,6,12ghz systems all the time.

Or do they just not know how to properly label what they're selling?

Can you post some examples? I couldn't find any but I didn't look very hard though.
 

Mr. Pedantic

Diamond Member
Feb 14, 2010
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People on ebay list 5,6,12ghz systems all the time.

Or do they just not know how to properly label what they're selling?
Mostly they don't know how to label what they are selling. For example, that 12GHz system would probably be a quad-core CPU of some kind running at 3GHz - it's just that the person selling doesn't realize adding the cores together doesn't work.

Are you following what I'm saying? I'm not talking about press-printing or photocopying, I'm talking about an actual PC printer that can print a full-color 11x8.5 page per second, a home PC printer, not a 250-ft-long industrial newspaper press

I'm happily awaiting from you guys a YouTube video of such a home printer, or a 25 Ghz chip installed on a home PC.
If you count a home printer as something that can reasonably be expected to fit into someone's house:

http://www.trendhunter.com/trends/the-worlds-fastest-printer-60-pages-colored-a4-per-1-minute
 

spikespiegal

Golden Member
Oct 10, 2005
1,219
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Actually the OP does have a point and the responses do reflect the arrogance I see in views towards science. Because your cell phone can download and display porn due to faster and more power efficient chinese made electronic processors on a psuedo 4G network the human race is obviously on the virge of becoming trancendant. That's what you all are saying, correct?

Computational architectures stopped making significant evolutions about 20 years ago. Currently progress in this field is being driven almost entirely by consumer demands and product life cycle expectations; aka Intel's decision to hold off processor revisions based on profit cycles. It's not driven by science. You won't see true quantum state processors until there is a way for some group of share holders to make a profit or designed by a university science dept where the alumni aren't more concerned about BCS rankings.

When a computer does something that's been done by humans a billion times before, but simply does it faster then I'm not impressed. You guys can believe it, but it simply reflects more brain washing via a culture that masks true technological progress with consumer gadgets. Micro processors are stuck in the stone age because they are unable to process data unless it's in a state of 1, or 0. who cares how fast it can process ones and zeroes, it's still the same data.

I'm talking about an actual PC printer that can print a full-color 11x8.5 page per second, a home PC printer,

Case in point: it's only relevant if it's convenient for Western Consumers. Otherwise, it might as well not exist. If we did find a way to make photo quality ink-jets at a rate of several per second think of all the profit that could be made on ink-jet cartridges.
 
May 11, 2008
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Actually the OP does have a point and the responses do reflect the arrogance I see in views towards science. Because your cell phone can download and display porn due to faster and more power efficient chinese made electronic processors on a psuedo 4G network the human race is obviously on the virge of becoming trancendant. That's what you all are saying, correct?

Computational architectures stopped making significant evolutions about 20 years ago. Currently progress in this field is being driven almost entirely by consumer demands and product life cycle expectations; aka Intel's decision to hold off processor revisions based on profit cycles. It's not driven by science. You won't see true quantum state processors until there is a way for some group of share holders to make a profit or designed by a university science dept where the alumni aren't more concerned about BCS rankings.

When a computer does something that's been done by humans a billion times before, but simply does it faster then I'm not impressed. You guys can believe it, but it simply reflects more brain washing via a culture that masks true technological progress with consumer gadgets. Micro processors are stuck in the stone age because they are unable to process data unless it's in a state of 1, or 0. who cares how fast it can process ones and zeroes, it's still the same data.



Case in point: it's only relevant if it's convenient for Western Consumers. Otherwise, it might as well not exist. If we did find a way to make photo quality ink-jets at a rate of several per second think of all the profit that could be made on ink-jet cartridges.


Finally someone who understands...

A computer may calculate faster then a human brain or any brain for that matter in absolute terms. But the interface between the processing nodes is not efficient at all. The more cores on a supercomputer, the more the software is actually busy providing all cores with information and synchronizing this information and the results of processing this information. While this may not be a problem for internet content as looking up web pages, youtube or twitter. It is a difference for creating or sustaining a self balancing conscience, how simple it may be. A super computer may calculate faster, but when comparing the overall data processing, a "simple" mouse brain beats any super computer available now and the upcoming decades in the future. Only when people will accept that the connection between processing nodes is as important as data storage and processing data, meaning it must all be seen as part of the processing will humanity make another leap. Until then, it is all gimmick indeed.

But then again, honest science improves itself and moves forward. But bad science is eager to stay on one point...
 
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Cogman

Lifer
Sep 19, 2000
10,278
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When a computer does something that's been done by humans a billion times before, but simply does it faster then I'm not impressed. You guys can believe it, but it simply reflects more brain washing via a culture that masks true technological progress with consumer gadgets. Micro processors are stuck in the stone age because they are unable to process data unless it's in a state of 1, or 0. who cares how fast it can process ones and zeroes, it's still the same data.

Doing stuff in a more efficient and faster way is progress. It is nonsense to surmise that dealing with 1's and 0's is the limiting factors of processing power. The fact is, when it comes to doing computations, any numbering system will do. It just so happens that 1s and 0s are the most natural and easiest to deal with when it comes to electricity.

What would impress you?

Now, don't get me wrong, in the consumer market there has been a notable stagnation in the speed of advances. Since about the release of the Core 2 Duo processor, there hasn't been any REALLY significant processor releases. As far as video cards go, the AMDs 4000 series was the last one that really took a great stride over its predecessor.
 

Mr. Pedantic

Diamond Member
Feb 14, 2010
5,039
0
76
When a computer does something that's been done by humans a billion times before, but simply does it faster then I'm not impressed. You guys can believe it, but it simply reflects more brain washing via a culture that masks true technological progress with consumer gadgets. Micro processors are stuck in the stone age because they are unable to process data unless it's in a state of 1, or 0. who cares how fast it can process ones and zeroes, it's still the same data.
If it doesn't impress you, then that's tough. Because that's what computers are designed to do.
 
May 11, 2008
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I think the progress is there, but as the poster spikespiegal mentioned : The financial aspect is more important then the progress itself. And this in my opinion will be the downfall of western society if there is no acceptance that productivity creates products and that holding share meetings does not.

Long ago money was nothing more then an "I owe you".
If person-A had fruit to trade and person-B had carpenter skills, then as long as both needed each other, trading took place. But the problem would arise when the farmer Person-A had no need for the carpenter person-B. And this is where money came to existence. The whole idea of money was to function as a credit means.
In modern civilization, money is traded to make more money. Products are not traded, but money is. This can cause the effect of products becoming more expensive as are the raw materials needed. This is what kills progress.

To return to the technical part.

But to the real issue is similar as when cell just arrived. People where complaining that it is difficult and time consuming to program in a parallel manner. Today it is still mentioned often that there is not enough multi-threaded software to take advantage of homogeneous multi-core processors.
But when multi threaded software really arises, there will be complaints on how to take advantage of heterogeneous-cores on the software level. To much under lying api's can remove the advantage because of trying to hide the differences.
 

sleep

Senior member
Aug 23, 2010
584
0
0
i've seen a video of an intel processor clocked in at 5ghz. some kind of 2.0 or an 2.2 processor. the only thing that kept it from over heating was the liquid nitrogen.
 

Raswan

Senior member
Jan 29, 2010
702
6
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Fine, I'll be the one to say it. You need to read up more on technology.

Also, the reason why we will never travel at the speed of light is because as you approach the speed of light, your mass increases to infinity, requiring infinite power to accelerate.

Yup. Simple answer, but also pretty accurate.
 

Raswan

Senior member
Jan 29, 2010
702
6
81
Actually the OP does have a point and the responses do reflect the arrogance I see in views towards science. Because your cell phone can download and display porn due to faster and more power efficient chinese made electronic processors on a psuedo 4G network the human race is obviously on the virge of becoming trancendant. That's what you all are saying, correct?

Computational architectures stopped making significant evolutions about 20 years ago. Currently progress in this field is being driven almost entirely by consumer demands and product life cycle expectations; aka Intel's decision to hold off processor revisions based on profit cycles. It's not driven by science. You won't see true quantum state processors until there is a way for some group of share holders to make a profit or designed by a university science dept where the alumni aren't more concerned about BCS rankings.

When a computer does something that's been done by humans a billion times before, but simply does it faster then I'm not impressed. You guys can believe it, but it simply reflects more brain washing via a culture that masks true technological progress with consumer gadgets. Micro processors are stuck in the stone age because they are unable to process data unless it's in a state of 1, or 0. who cares how fast it can process ones and zeroes, it's still the same data.

Case in point: it's only relevant if it's convenient for Western Consumers. Otherwise, it might as well not exist. If we did find a way to make photo quality ink-jets at a rate of several per second think of all the profit that could be made on ink-jet cartridges.

Yeah, yeah, capitalism has brainwashed us all, we are all tools of giant corporations, and we will never be able to throw off the chains of servitude unless we rise up against the oppressor. Wait a tick--how are you contributing to this thread? On your COMPUTER? Where was it built? Unless it was in your garage with raw materials dug out of the earth with your bare hands, and soldered using a bicycle (built by you) hooked up to a generator (also homemade), me thinks you need to check your reflection in the mirror and see if hypocrite is written on your forehead. Also, isn't your very involvement in this discussion tacitly supporting the evil design of a western consumer culture that seeks to keep us all occupied with shiny objects whilst emptying our wallets and our brains?

You're naive buddy, if you think "pure" research (not carried out with any kind of reward-benefit system expected by the participants) has ever existed in the world. Not saying the way things are is the best it could be, or that we wouldn't be even further if, for example, NASA didn't have to waste time and money proving to the idiots who comprise the masses that they are producing practical technology in Spinoff, but come on. Wake up and join the real world. If it pisses you off, become a lobbyist or start an independent research firm. I'll be the first to contribute. Just quit whining where it doesn't do anyone any good whatsoever.
 

DrPizza

Administrator Elite Member Goat Whisperer
Mar 5, 2001
49,606
166
111
www.slatebrookfarm.com
Since point one has been thoroughly debunked, I'll take a shot at point two - traveling at (nearly) the speed of light. So, there's a problem with particles (mostly hydrogen atoms) impacting your space craft?
A nose cone that's has a very strong magnetic field. Take a look at CERN. They have electrons, protons, even lead nuclei traveling at close to the speed of light. They seem to do just fine with using magnetic fields to guide those particles around in a circle; keeping them from impacting against the walls.

Of course, as you accelerate those particles, you create a lot of radiation, so you just need some lead walls in your spaceship.
 
May 11, 2008
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Yeah, yeah, capitalism has brainwashed us all, we are all tools of giant corporations, and we will never be able to throw off the chains of servitude unless we rise up against the oppressor. Wait a tick--how are you contributing to this thread? On your COMPUTER? Where was it built? Unless it was in your garage with raw materials dug out of the earth with your bare hands, and soldered using a bicycle (built by you) hooked up to a generator (also homemade), me thinks you need to check your reflection in the mirror and see if hypocrite is written on your forehead. Also, isn't your very involvement in this discussion tacitly supporting the evil design of a western consumer culture that seeks to keep us all occupied with shiny objects whilst emptying our wallets and our brains?

You're naive buddy, if you think "pure" research (not carried out with any kind of reward-benefit system expected by the participants) has ever existed in the world. Not saying the way things are is the best it could be, or that we wouldn't be even further if, for example, NASA didn't have to waste time and money proving to the idiots who comprise the masses that they are producing practical technology in Spinoff, but come on. Wake up and join the real world. If it pisses you off, become a lobbyist or start an independent research firm. I'll be the first to contribute. Just quit whining where it doesn't do anyone any good whatsoever.

There is nothing wrong with capitalism as long as it is controlled.
Runaway capitalism destroys progress. As does a not controlled free market destroys progress.

The free market has it's advantages but sometimes overuse of the free market principle is not an advantage. An real life example where i had to remove the names of the companies and the countries involved :

A certain product and service is needed in a certain country by a certain government. While in other countries this product and service is already developed with success, it is chosen to develop the system from scratch to stimulate the native internal market. There is nothing wrong with this, but the way the whole free market principle is executed here is dead wrong. Why ?

First, there are several companies involved where the biggest player is actually a company from a foreign country. That means less stimulation of the internal market and less profit returning into the local market. These several companies refuse to talk with each other to establish a proper product plan to prevent any technical issues. All refuse to take responsibility because of the government clause and the fines involved.

Second, the whole system is implemented for every part of the country in a different way with less then optimal compatibility because every state has it's own idea's. This raises prices and limit's the functionality for the end user.

Third, since every state delivers contracts to local state companies, there is a lot of overhead where the responsibility for failures or errors is not clear and every company in the chain refuses to take responsibility because of the government fines. Pointing fingers at each other while cooperation could solve the issue within 8 hours.

Fourth, this system is payed for by taxpayers money and cost at least 3 times as much as when 1 system was selected for the entire country and the clause for responsibility was set up properly and only native companies where selected instead of at least 1 overseas company who charges to much money.

Fifth, excessive use of consultancy firms because of backdoor "friends begets friends" politics who charge to much for obvious problems. I have at least 4 great examples which i would die to tell you but for privacy reasons i can not. Suffice it to say that if i would post the situations in writing i expect a lot of "LOL, what an idiots" responses.

But since the tax payers pay the bills, who cares...

Nothing wrong with capitalism or the free market. I mean it stimulates people to be creative and productive. But when the dark path of greed, lies and deceit is opened up, efficiency collapses. And everybody is attacking each other over missing money and small religious problems. While solving real monetary problems and ruling the country is no longer important.

This is a real life example that is happening at this moment.

No capitalism is a tool, as is the free market principle a tool.
And a tool can be used wrong or in the right way.

I can kill you with a hammer, but i can also choose to build you a house with it... Choices and karma...
 

CycloWizard

Lifer
Sep 10, 2001
12,348
1
81
Actually the OP does have a point and the responses do reflect the arrogance I see in views towards science. Because your cell phone can download and display porn due to faster and more power efficient chinese made electronic processors on a psuedo 4G network the human race is obviously on the virge of becoming trancendant. That's what you all are saying, correct?

Computational architectures stopped making significant evolutions about 20 years ago. Currently progress in this field is being driven almost entirely by consumer demands and product life cycle expectations; aka Intel's decision to hold off processor revisions based on profit cycles. It's not driven by science. You won't see true quantum state processors until there is a way for some group of share holders to make a profit or designed by a university science dept where the alumni aren't more concerned about BCS rankings.

When a computer does something that's been done by humans a billion times before, but simply does it faster then I'm not impressed. You guys can believe it, but it simply reflects more brain washing via a culture that masks true technological progress with consumer gadgets. Micro processors are stuck in the stone age because they are unable to process data unless it's in a state of 1, or 0. who cares how fast it can process ones and zeroes, it's still the same data.



Case in point: it's only relevant if it's convenient for Western Consumers. Otherwise, it might as well not exist. If we did find a way to make photo quality ink-jets at a rate of several per second think of all the profit that could be made on ink-jet cartridges.
Lack of ignorance is not the same thing as arrogance. I've seen absolutely no claims even resembling anything in your first paragraph. How would you drive innovation, comrade? We should all simply contribute everything we have to the greater good and expect nothing in return, huh?
 

CycloWizard

Lifer
Sep 10, 2001
12,348
1
81
There is nothing wrong with capitalism as long as it is controlled.
Runaway capitalism destroys progress. As does a not controlled free market destroys progress.
Your entire post indicates only that you have absolutely no idea what a free market is. Your examples are all market manipulation by government, yet you blame it on the free market running amok. In short, your examples actually support the exact opposite of your premise.
 
May 11, 2008
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Your entire post indicates only that you have absolutely no idea what a free market is. Your examples are all market manipulation by government, yet you blame it on the free market running amok. In short, your examples actually support the exact opposite of your premise.

As usual you assume you think you know everything.

But as usual you are like those people who when they hear the words "government" and "control" in one sentence, you as they scream fire and brimstone. While at the same time you hold your own government responsible for everything never looking in the mirror because of your own lifestyle. yawn...

In this particular case that i have mentioned, it is the lack of government control in the right way.
#The free market principle is promoted by the government, a good thing.
#But the principle is being pushed to hard. Meaning that as many companies are involved as the government sees fit. Or that healthy services are split up and rising in cost or are lowering in efficiency.
Now this is not an issue if there is a fundamental guide setup that covers the technical side, the financial side, the way to execute the plans. A set strategy that is tested against practice and is confirmed that it is executable nationwide by local native companies. Then when this strategy is complete, companies can start to offer their services and a selection is made. For example companies should be selected according to the quality of service and geological positions. When the selection is made, again the strategy is being discussed with all players(the companies) in the field to remove errors and set reliability and responsibility.
When implemented and real life problems arise for example, a swift action can be taken because of the latter. And this has the advantage of distributed offices, meaning that jobs are spread nation wide. This is long term planning and actually works. Keeping a lot of jobs and job security around.

If in this particular case the government would control the issue even less then already is the case, numerous 100% not compatible systems from different companies would arise. This in your simple minded view is good for companies who want to earn a buck. But you forget that the money has to come from somewhere. In this particular case from the tax payer. Money that can be spent in a better way. When a country wide single system is used, it may seem to provide less jobs. And yes, some superfluous jobs would not exist but that is because there is no need for it in an efficient system. In the current situation the tco for the government increases and this results in higher taxes, because the money has to come from somewhere. I think it is better to spend taxpayers money on something more useful then keeping boneheads similar like you busy.
It is all about efficiency. Remember the "+costs" debacle in the US ? I am sure you do.
Another example is splitting up a company into separate companies to force the free market principle. While at the same time providing the same service. The increased administration and communication translates in higher costs and lower efficiency for the end user. And yes, still the same company, only higher tco. No rivaling companies to lower the price. Because the market is to small and to risky for another startup. In the end first the entire service must collapse leaving customers or citizens in the cold and with the problems before new players will jump onto a given market segment. And that is what boneheads like you always forget.

I have seen more problems arise from enforcing the free market principle on healthy markets then being solved. That is because there actually are in real life situations where the profits are low but the people depend on it. And when the people depend on it, the economy depends on it. And when the economy hurts, the entire country hurts. Maybe you should see a doctor or start to drink less with that tunnel vision/thinking of yours.
 
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Raswan

Senior member
Jan 29, 2010
702
6
81
Your entire post indicates only that you have absolutely no idea what a free market is. Your examples are all market manipulation by government, yet you blame it on the free market running amok. In short, your examples actually support the exact opposite of your premise.

Agreed. As I sat there reading your post, I couldn't for the life of me figure out how what you were describing wasn't the opposite of a free market. You talk about the product being "chosen" to be developed independently. By whom? Shouldn't that tip you off that someone is trying to direct the economy by developing something internally because it helps the local economy when the free-market makes it cheaper to buy it from a third party...

And anyway, I never endorsed completely a unrestrained free market in my post. Anyone with even a passing familiarity with the rise of Big Business in the late 1800s knows that expecting a free market to solve all of our problems without any kind of government involvement is a pipe dream. Sure, some Milton Freedman extremists will take it to the extreme and argue the gov't caused the Great Depression by tightening the money supply when they shouldn't have and thus the government should completely duck out of the ring, etc etc blah blah blah, and maybe they are right in that particular instance. But you need some kind of gov't participation in the economy. You can't compete production-wise in the world market without techniques of mass production, from which monopoly (almost always) inevitably follows, and the only body strong enough to regulate monopoly (as was the will of the people in the 1890s) is government.
 

Raswan

Senior member
Jan 29, 2010
702
6
81
As usual you assume you think you know everything.

But as usual you are like those people who when they hear the words "government" and "control" in one sentence, you as they scream fire and brimstone. While at the same time you hold your own government responsible for everything never looking in the mirror because of your own lifestyle. yawn...

In this particular case that i have mentioned, it is the lack of government control in the right way.
#The free market principle is promoted by the government, a good thing.
#But the principle is being pushed to hard. Meaning that as many companies are involved as the government sees fit. Or that healthy services are split up and rising in cost or are lowering in efficiency.
Now this is not an issue if there is a fundamental guide setup that covers the technical side, the financial side, the way to execute the plans. A set strategy that is tested against practice and is confirmed that it is executable nationwide by local native companies. Then when this strategy is complete, companies can start to offer there services and a selection is made. For example companies should be selected according to the quality of service and geological positions. When the selection is made, again the strategy is being discussed with all players(the companies) in the field to remove errors and set reliability and responsibility.
When implemented and real life problems arise for example, a swift action can be taken because of the latter. And this has the advantage of distributed offices, meaning that jobs are spread nation wide. This is long term planning and actually works. Keeping a lot of jobs and job security around.

If in this particular the government would control the issue even less then already is the case, numerous 100% not compatible systems from different companies would arise. This in your simple minded view is good for companies who want to earn a buck. But you forget that the money has to come from somewhere. In this particular case from the tax payer. Money that can be spent in a better way. When a country wide single system is used, it may seem to provide less jobs. And yes, some superfluous jobs would not exist but that is because there is no for it need in an efficient system. In the current situation the tco for the government increases and this results in higher taxes, because the money has to come from somewhere. I think it is better to spend taxpayers money on something more useful then keeping boneheads similar like you busy.
It is all about efficiency. Remember the "+costs" debacle in the US ? I am sure you do.
Another example is splitting up a company into separate companies to force the free market principle. While at the same time providing the same service. The increased administration and communication translates in higher costs and lower efficiency for the end user. And yes, still the same company, only higher tco. No rivaling companies to lower the price. Because the market is to small and to risky for another startup. In the end first the entire service must collapse leaving customers or citizens in the cold and with the problems before new players will jump onto a given market segment. And that is what boneheads like you always forget.

I have seen more problems arise from enforcing the free market principle on healthy markets then being solved. That is because there actually are in real life situations where the profits are low but the people depend on it. And when the people depend on it, the economy depends on it. And when the economy hurts, the entire country hurts. Maybe you should see a doctor or start to drink less with that tunnel vision/thinking of yours.

Dude, it's really hard, try as I might, to take anything you say seriously when you write "there" instead of "their" and "then" instead of "than." Just saying.
 
May 11, 2008
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Dude, it's really hard, try as I might, to take anything you say seriously when you write "there" instead of "their" and "then" instead of "than." Just saying.

I thank you for pointing out my typing errors.
But when you invalidate an entire post because of an typing error, this explains more about you then about me.
 
May 11, 2008
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Agreed. As I sat there reading your post, I couldn't for the life of me figure out how what you were describing wasn't the opposite of a free market. You talk about the product being "chosen" to be developed independently. By whom? Shouldn't that tip you off that someone is trying to direct the economy by developing something internally because it helps the local economy when the free-market makes it cheaper to buy it from a third party...

And anyway, I never endorsed completely a unrestrained free market in my post. Anyone with even a passing familiarity with the rise of Big Business in the late 1800s knows that expecting a free market to solve all of our problems without any kind of government involvement is a pipe dream. Sure, some Milton Freedman extremists will take it to the extreme and argue the gov't caused the Great Depression by tightening the money supply when they shouldn't have and thus the government should completely duck out of the ring, etc etc blah blah blah, and maybe they are right in that particular instance. But you need some kind of gov't participation in the economy. You can't compete production-wise in the world market without techniques of mass production, from which monopoly (almost always) inevitably follows, and the only body strong enough to regulate monopoly (as was the will of the people in the 1890s) is government.

I can not go into full detail and i understand this blurs the intention of my writings. But i agree with the point that unrestrained free market and unrestrained capitalism only results into dictatorship by those who live with the least amount of moral and honour. The same thing will happen when communism is chosen. It depends on you how to use a tool.
 

Raswan

Senior member
Jan 29, 2010
702
6
81
I can not go into full detail and i understand this blurs the intention of my writings. But i agree with the point that unrestrained free market and unrestrained capitalism only results into dictatorship by those who live with the least amount of moral and honour. The same thing will happen when communism is chosen. It depends on you how to use a tool.

Nothing here with which I particularly disagree. Real world examples are often less than clear-cut, and it's even harder when you can't explain it the way you want to. Capitalism and communism--in their purest forms--are equally ridiculous pipe dreams in the real world.

Maybe a little hard on you if they were honest typos (since I've done it too), but I will stand by the fact that arguments are always more persuasive when clear syntax and proper spelling are used. It gives the grammar nazis less to bitch about (including me ) and keeps the discussion above a certain level. I mean, we're not animals, are we :sneaky:?
 
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