Weapons of Mass destruction found.

[heartsurgeon]

do you honestly believe Saddam made only one sarin shell?

what legitimate civilian use is there for al-samoud2 missile engines?

do you believe the report of the sarin gas shell is faked?

 

[SuperTool]

Originally posted by: heartsurgeon
do you honestly believe Saddam made only one sarin shell?

what legitimate civilian use is there for al-samoud2 missile engines?

do you believe the report of the sarin gas shell is faked?

No, it wasn't faked. It's a 20 year old shell. What legitimate use for a missile engine? How about a missile? Missiles are not necessarily WMDs.

 

[heartsurgeon]

Missiles are not necessarily WMDs.

The question was what legitimate civilian use is there for an al-samoud 2 missile.

 

[SuperTool]

Bottom line is if Saddam had all these WMD's that HS and others would want us to believe, he did not even use them when attacked and fighting for survival. Now if he had WMD's and intent to use them, that would be the time to use them. So the story doesn't wash.
And another rationale was to prevent these weapons from falling into the wrong hands, and now we are finding Iraqi weapons as far away as Netherlands, so who knows what got into what hands.

 

[SuperTool]

Originally posted by: heartsurgeon

Missiles are not necessarily WMDs.

The question was what legitimate civilian use is there for an al-samoud 2 missile.

It's for military use. But that doesn't make it a WMD.

 

[conjur]

Originally posted by: heartsurgeon

Missiles are not necessarily WMDs.

The question was what legitimate civilian use is there for an al-samoud 2 missile.

What legitimate civilian use is there for a Tomahawk cruise missile?

 

[MadRat]

Originally posted by: conjur

Originally posted by: heartsurgeon

Missiles are not necessarily WMDs.

The question was what legitimate civilian use is there for an al-samoud 2 missile.

What legitimate civilian use is there for a Tomahawk cruise missile?

Atmospheric measurements.

 

[heartsurgeon]

It's for military use

we are finding Iraqi weapons as far away as Netherlands

well, we're making some progress...
the missile motors only have military uses
the missile motors represent weapons.

do you believe the DOD when they say the al-samoud 2 was designed to carry chemical weapons?
do you believe Sarin is a chemical weapon?

 

[conjur]

heartsurgeon...more like orthopedic specialist considering the prosthetics you keep throwing at this thread that had no legs after the first page.

 

[leeboy]

Originally posted by: heartsurgeon
U.N. experts find 20 engines used in banned Iraqi missiles in Jordan scrapyards

of course those of you who deny WMD's in Iraq will claim:

20 missile motors, so what?

or

They were in Jordan, so what?

or

They were scrap metal motors..so what?

or maybe just

So what?

Well, they started out as missile motors, in Iraq, to banned Al Samoud 2 missiles. These missiles were made around 1993, and banned by the U.N. in 1994 because they had ranges exceeding 150 kilometers, and were chem/bio warhead capable. These represent WMD components. They were in Iraq. They were very recently sent out of the country.

but i know, nothing but a warehouse full of nukes just about ready to explode will satisy some, if that..

Baaaaaahhhhhh. You never cease to make me laugh. You need a red nose to go along with that clown act of yours. Pftttt.

Nice to see the sand boogy men still got you hiding under your bed.

 

[SuperTool]

Originally posted by: heartsurgeon

It's for military use

we are finding Iraqi weapons as far away as Netherlands

well, we're making some progress...
the missile motors only have military uses
the missile motors represent weapons.

do you believe the DOD when they say the al-samoud 2 was designed to carry chemical weapons?
do you believe Sarin is a chemical weapon?

Sarin is a chemical weapon. Missiles can carry a variety of payloads.

 

[heartsurgeon]

more progress!

missile motors and missiles are military weapons which can carry among other things, sarin, which is a chemical weapon.

is that a fair statement?

would you also agree than sarin is capable of killing thousands of people?

 

[conjur]

Give it up, heartsurgeon.

Even the prosthetic legs are giving out now.

 

[SuperTool]

And an ounce of sperm is capable of impregnating thousands of women.
Sarin used in Tokyo subway kills 11 people. Conventional plastic explosive on Moscow subway kills 40 people. If Sarin is a WMD, then dynamite is armageddon weapon

 

[heartsurgeon]

Sarin used in Tokyo subway kills 11 people

The reports i read about the sarin in the Tokyo subway indicate that it was of very low purity and hence potency. Additionally, the execptionaly brave actions of a few subway police (they picked up the plastic bags containing the sarin liquid and caried out of the subway system..they died) prevented it from causing more deaths. additionally, i think some of the sarin wasn't actually released.

i don't know how many casualities could be expected from a al-samoud 2 missile armed with a binary sarin nerve gas warhead. i don't know the capacity of the warhead (other than it is greater than that of the artillery shell). In fact, the Sarin gas worries me more than the missiles because the best terror weapon wouldn't be a missile loaded with the sarin, but a person with a thermos filled with sarin, releasing it in a enclosed statium filled with tens of thousands of people.

the missile motors just unscore the U.N.'s inability to find all the banned weapons.

but yes, i do believe that a fleet of banned missiles purposely designed to carry sarin nerve agent qualifies as weapons of mass destruction.

i am also quite sure that you do not share this point of view. so be it.

 

[conjur]

Originally posted by: heartsurgeon
the missile motors just unscore the U.N.'s inability to find all the banned weapons.

Give me a break!!

The UN inspectors found those Al Samoud II missiles and had the Iraqis start to destroy them and then Bush yanked the inspectors out of Iraq for his little romp thru the desert.

 

[lozina]

Why stop there?

Many old Russian T-54 tanks were also found in the scrap yard.

They could be used to fire MWD shells from it's cannon. You can also put a 55-gallon drum of Sarin inside of the tank, then roll right into into New York City- CAN YOU IMAGINE WHAT 55 GALLONS OF SARIN COULD DO TO THE INNOCENT PEOPLE OF NEW YORK CITY?!?!

therefore the T-54's tanks themselves are WMDs, because of all the possibilities written above!

guess there's a reason there's no 'L' for logic in heartsurgeon's name... what a joke. This kind of hyperbole and erroneous reasoning really underscores some neocon's desperation for justifying their ill-conceived war. Next thread: AK-47s are WMDs- Iraq's got stockpiles of those!

 

[conjur]

ooooo....Anthrax-tipped bullets!!!


OH NOES!!!11111!!!!1!11!

 

[heartsurgeon]

The UN inspectors found those Al Samoud II missiles

You apparently didn't read the article.

CAN YOU IMAGINE WHAT 55 GALLONS OF SARIN COULD DO TO THE INNOCENT PEOPLE OF NEW YORK CITY?!?!

Actually, i believe the amounts of sarin unaccounted for are in the TONS, and as i stated, the sarin bothers me much more than the missiles do.

Anthrax-tipped bullets!!!

I believe the people who got gravely ill or died from exposure to anthrax sent through the mail will not find any humor in your sarcasm.

 

[conjur]

Originally posted by: heartsurgeon

The UN inspectors found those Al Samoud II missiles

You apparently didn't read the article.

You apparently have forgotten history. I'm referring to the Al Samound II missiles found before the Iraq invasion by the UN inspectors. The missiles that were being destroyed before Bush pulled the inspectors out of Iraq.

 

[lozina]

Originally posted by: conjur

Originally posted by: heartsurgeon

The UN inspectors found those Al Samoud II missiles

You apparently didn't read the article.

You apparently have forgotten history. I'm referring to the Al Samound II missiles found before the Iraq invasion by the UN inspectors. The missiles that were being destroyed before Bush pulled the inspectors out of Iraq.

It is OK to ignore history, if it benefits the neocons

 

[LordMagnusKain]

Originally posted by: heartsurgeon
Do you believe the DOD when they say the al-samoud 2 was designed to carry chemical weapons?

yes or no, if they are designed for use as delivery for WMDs then: even if modifiable for other uses: stockpiling of them shows clear intent to deliver quantities of WMDs.

?they where destroying them?
THEM destroying the missiles wasn?t the deal. The resolution was clear in that the UN was to get all stockpiles of missiles and destroy them themselves.

Not ONCE did Sadam ever turn over his stockpiles, he simply played games with the inspectors by destroying some himself for the show.

Sadam failed to comply with the UN resolution, Franch and Russia and Kofy where happy to ignore this because they where getting fat off of Iraqi oil.

Protesters are right in one thing: We did go to war w/ out all of the UN allies because of Oil. But the ones willing to triad blood for Oil weren?t the Americans but the French and Rusians who?d prefer let the Iraqi people die by the millions than upset their Oil contracts.

 

[syzygy]

Originally posted by: LordMagnusKain

Originally posted by: heartsurgeon
Do you believe the DOD when they say the al-samoud 2 was designed to carry chemical weapons?

yes or no, if they are designed for use as delivery for WMDs then: even if modifiable for other uses: stockpiling of them shows clear intent to deliver quantities of WMDs.

?they where destroying them?
THEM destroying the missiles wasn?t the deal. The resolution was clear in that the UN was to get all stockpiles of missiles and destroy them themselves.
.

i agree with you but resolution 1441 demanded voluntary iraqi disclosure of wmd which implied
that iraq was also responsible for their fate; they were either to be destroyed (if any existed) or to
provide proof that they were destroyed in the recent past. the ba'athists failed miserably on both
counts. remember what the acronym unmovic stood for: united nations monitoring, verification and
inpsection committee.

unmovic demanded of iraq full and immediate compliance, provide full, final, and complete disclosure,
and to meet all their obligations as imposed by the united nations security council.

blix was still 'negotiating' with ba'athists over their 'improving' cooperation as late as march 2003.
blix did manage do reduce the ratio of iraqi minders per inspector from a january high 5:1 to a
march 2003 low 1:1. congratulations hansy. and they say you were worthless . . baah . . .

 

[heartsurgeon]

Saddam was in violation of UN resolutions, he was in violation of the agreements signed to end the first Gulf War (which Saddam started for those of you who seem to have forgotten this). He had over a decade to comply with these obligations, but didn't.

The UNMOVIC was irrelevant. they neither proved nor caused Saddam to comply with anything.

Weapons of mass destruction have been found since the overthrow of Saddam. The Sarin nerve agent and the missile motors qualify in my opinion, and i have absolutely no doubt that many more banned weapons will be found.

Liberals will never be satisfied. That is irrelevant.

The Iraqi goverment has requested the U.S. to stay in iraq. The Iraqi goverment will ask NATO to participate. Every single "talking point" that the liberal use (we're not wanted in Iraq, we don't have international support, we haven't found weapons of mass destruction, we can't possibly win, it's just like Vietnam)...willl/has gradually be rendered irrelevant. You know i'm right..it's happening as we speak..

no jobs? Kerry isn't claiming that anymore.

no international support for our efforts in Iraq...can't claim that anymore

no weapons of mass destruction...you maydeny it, but i'll guarantee you Kerry won'y be talking about it anymore.

heck, kerry has even backpedaled on pulling troops out of iraq.

gas prices, Bush not doing enough to lower them..guess what, they're coming down and will continue to drop.

and the real campaign hasn't even started yet!!

 

[Klixxer]

Originally posted by: LordMagnusKain

Originally posted by: heartsurgeon
Do you believe the DOD when they say the al-samoud 2 was designed to carry chemical weapons?

yes or no, if they are designed for use as delivery for WMDs then: even if modifiable for other uses: stockpiling of them shows clear intent to deliver quantities of WMDs.

?they where destroying them?
THEM destroying the missiles wasn?t the deal. The resolution was clear in that the UN was to get all stockpiles of missiles and destroy them themselves.

Not ONCE did Sadam ever turn over his stockpiles, he simply played games with the inspectors by destroying some himself for the show.

Sadam failed to comply with the UN resolution, Franch and Russia and Kofy where happy to ignore this because they where getting fat off of Iraqi oil.

Protesters are right in one thing: We did go to war w/ out all of the UN allies because of Oil. But the ones willing to triad blood for Oil weren?t the Americans but the French and Rusians who?d prefer let the Iraqi people die by the millions than upset their Oil contracts.

No terrorist links, no WMD's, you have got the wrong schedule, the war is about liberation this week, back to possible WMD's the next, i'll mail you the schedule if you can't get it from your local neocon hideout.

The Al Samoud missiles were being destroyed, not because they could carry WMD's, but because they exceeded the allowed range. The payloads were already in place and none of the missiles carried an ABC payload. Try reading up before you spout your ignorance.

BTW, it is France, Russia and Koffi, try to get it right.