Weight loss and my gallbladder

[KentState]

About 10 months ago, I started a weight loss program with a goal of 2 lbs a week. I was successfully able to go from ~240lbs down to 175 as of today. About 6 weeks ago I had a gallbladder attack out of nowhere. Was very surprising since we stopped eating red meat and rarely have anything greasy or fried. I also had what felt like and appeared to be a hernia so I had an ultra sound to figure both out. Now I'm going in for surgery on the 30th to have both the gallbladder removed and hernia repaired. Moral of the story, quick weight loss can aid in the formation of gallstones and it's a pretty common occurrence.

 

[pandemonium]

I'm sorry you've found out some horrible news after an optimistic streak of getting your weight down, that's really incredible the success you've achieved!

If you haven't, I highly recommend visiting a chiropractor. I'm betting the cost of your surgery that your lower lumbar verterbrae are out of whack and getting those back into acceptable position would not only help heal your herniation, but help your body dissolve those stones. Of course, a proper healing regimen along with the chiropractic assistance is needed on your part (drinking TONS of water, getting plenty of rest in proper positions, reducing/ending laborous tasks that are demanding on your back, etc...).

If you do go looking for a chiropractor, look for one that uses the activator technique as opposed to others. It's generally slower to heal, but won't damage your spine in the process (creating more problems than solving them). Spine adjustments need to be made gradually, not forcibly!

If you can't find a good recommendation there in Atlanta, let me know and I can recommend my chiropractor here in Augusta.

I'm not claiming to be a doctor here, but I hope this can help you and your healing goes smoothly!

 

[SociallyChallenged]

I'm sorry you've found out some horrible news after an optimistic streak of getting your weight down, that's really incredible the success you've achieved!

If you haven't, I highly recommend visiting a chiropractor. I'm betting the cost of your surgery that your lower lumbar verterbrae are out of whack and getting those back into acceptable position would not only help heal your herniation, but help your body dissolve those stones. Of course, a proper healing regimen along with the chiropractic assistance is needed on your part (drinking TONS of water, getting plenty of rest in proper positions, reducing/ending laborous tasks that are demanding on your back, etc...).

If you do go looking for a chiropractor, look for one that uses the activator technique as opposed to others. It's generally slower to heal, but won't damage your spine in the process (creating more problems than solving them). Spine adjustments need to be made gradually, not forcibly!

If you can't find a good recommendation there in Atlanta, let me know and I can recommend my chiropractor here in Augusta.

I'm not claiming to be a doctor here, but I hope this can help you and your healing goes smoothly!

While I do believe chiropractic care has its uses, they are mainly musculoskeletal and neurologic. There is no good, randomized controlled trials that show chiropractic care and adjustment of the lumbar spine can resolve stones or herniation (he's not talking about a disc herniation, which they can treat. He's most likely talking about an inguinal hernation, which is only treated surgically). The treatments that have reproducible, consistent results for stones and hernias are medical specific. Chiropractic care doesn't magically fix that. With that same mentality, physical therapy should do the same thing, as PTs fix position and mobility just by different methods.

 

[KentState]

Correct, this is an inguinal hernia and the only recourse is surgery. The gallbladder is causing enough pain that removal at the same time to me is a good option. Why go in twice when both can be fixed in an hour.

 

[SociallyChallenged]

Correct, this is an inguinal hernia and the only recourse is surgery. The gallbladder is causing enough pain that removal at the same time to me is a good option. Why go in twice when both can be fixed in an hour.

Yeah, that's probably the best option, especially considering both are laproscopic. To be perfectly honest, I've never heard of weight loss being related to gallbladder pathology. I don't know why that would be, unless you increased your fat intake significantly while dieting. I'll have to research this a bit more. I'm sorry to hear that you've had to go through this. This may provide a bit more drive for others to be in less of a rush and focus more on 1-1.5lb weight loss per week that's typically suggested by healthcare professionals.

 

[KentState]

Yeah, that's probably the best option, especially considering both are laproscopic. To be perfectly honest, I've never heard of weight loss being related to gallbladder pathology. I don't know why that would be, unless you increased your fat intake significantly while dieting. I'll have to research this a bit more. I'm sorry to hear that you've had to go through this. This may provide a bit more drive for others to be in less of a rush and focus more on 1-1.5lb weight loss per week that's typically suggested by healthcare professionals.

I don't know the exact reasons why they are related, but I saw it mentioned numerous times as a cause. My doctor also stated that it may be the primary cause. My only thought is that when losing weight, you have to digest a lot of stored fat which requires extra bile. I probably dropped at least 40lbs of fat out of the 65lbs lost. That's a lot of cheese burgers.

 

[SociallyChallenged]

I don't know the exact reasons why they are related, but I saw it mentioned numerous times as a cause. My doctor also stated that it may be the primary cause. My only thought is that when losing weight, you have to digest a lot of stored fat which requires extra bile. I probably dropped at least 40lbs of fat out of the 65lbs lost. That's a lot of cheese burgers.

The body actually doesn't have to digest fat stores. They are previously digested and are stored in a way that only requires mobilization for energy. Hormones essentially send messages to your fat cells to release fatty acids. When that happens, they're released directly into the blood stream - no digestion required. So I still don't understand the link. I'm interested in this. Typically, you don't think of responsible weight loss as having negative effects. It's something I've gotta research.

 

[spamsk8r]

I would recommend against having your gallbladder removed if at all possible. It's there for a reason, and people who don't have one have problems later. I'm thinking the reason they've occurred now is that you're eating much *lower* fat, which means the bile salts stored in the gallbladder are not being used as much, thus becoming stones (http://paleodietnews.com/2524/the-paleo-diet-gallbladder-issues/). The solution here, it would seem, would be to start taking some digestive enzymes (something like this: http://www.nowfoods.com/Supplements/Products-by-Category/Digestive-Support/Enzymes/M003112.htm) and reducing refined carbohydrate intake while gradually increasing fat intake. Remember, removing an organ is not something to take lightly, so if I were in your shoes I would try everything I could to fix the root of the problem before taking the surgery route. It's probably a lot cheaper too.

 

[Dee67]

Moral of the story, quick weight loss can aid in the formation of gallstones and it's a pretty common occurrence.

This is correct. had the same thing happen to me. waited through multiple gallbladder attacks before going in to a doctor about it. Never heard of the rapid weight loss thing until after I had the procedure to have it removed.

 

[KentState]

I would recommend against having your gallbladder removed if at all possible. It's there for a reason, and people who don't have one have problems later. I'm thinking the reason they've occurred now is that you're eating much *lower* fat, which means the bile salts stored in the gallbladder are not being used as much, thus becoming stones (http://paleodietnews.com/2524/the-paleo-diet-gallbladder-issues/). The solution here, it would seem, would be to start taking some digestive enzymes (something like this: http://www.nowfoods.com/Supplements/Products-by-Category/Digestive-Support/Enzymes/M003112.htm) and reducing refined carbohydrate intake while gradually increasing fat intake. Remember, removing an organ is not something to take lightly, so if I were in your shoes I would try everything I could to fix the root of the problem before taking the surgery route. It's probably a lot cheaper too.

While I would love to find another way to resolve this, the gallbladder problem is impacting my life negatively. I've been fighting the problem for about two months now and luckily work is letting me telecommute this week and next. I have about a 80 mile round trip to work and having an attack, dizziness or nausea during that time is uncomfortable and scary.

 

[SociallyChallenged]

I would recommend against having your gallbladder removed if at all possible. It's there for a reason, and people who don't have one have problems later. I'm thinking the reason they've occurred now is that you're eating much *lower* fat, which means the bile salts stored in the gallbladder are not being used as much, thus becoming stones (http://paleodietnews.com/2524/the-paleo-diet-gallbladder-issues/). The solution here, it would seem, would be to start taking some digestive enzymes (something like this: http://www.nowfoods.com/Supplements/Products-by-Category/Digestive-Support/Enzymes/M003112.htm) and reducing refined carbohydrate intake while gradually increasing fat intake. Remember, removing an organ is not something to take lightly, so if I were in your shoes I would try everything I could to fix the root of the problem before taking the surgery route. It's probably a lot cheaper too.

While the information is interesting and provides a valid argument against maintaining a high-carb diet, he doesn't cite anything that says a high fat diet is better. Granted the logic works (use the bile to digest fat so the bile doesn't build up), but there isn't any research posted to support that. In addition, a gallbladder procedure is minimally invasive. He acts like bile production is ceased, but instead the liver produces bile which immediately flows into the digestive tract. It's not optimal, but the body is still able to utilize the bile salts for digestion - it's just not as dose dependent.

Also, with any surgery, there are going to be people who aren't satisfied with the results. However, in a surgical journal article (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1421311/), pt satisfaction was reported at roughly 90% (Figure 4). That's what I consistently find with the laparoscopic procedure. I'm always for minimizing surgery, as it's risky by default. But I'm just pointing out some discrepancies between his article and what is found in research. I support his suggestions to have a healthy diet, lower in carbs than is typically suggested. I don't, however, believe someone should have to withstand significant pain while making dietary changes and taking enzymes (which may or may not be broken down prior to ever reaching the desired target) because someone involved with the Paleo diet said it would cure them. The surgery is relatively low risk, has quick recovery, and has few long term issues. I just don't like the fact that he's saying otherwise just to support his theory.

 

[spamsk8r]

I wasn't suggesting that he switch to a high-fat diet. I merely suggested that if he was currently eating a low fat (and thus high-carb) diet that may have been one of the precipitating factors. Hence the "reduce processed carbs and gradually increase fat intake." The point I was trying to make is that while they say "oh it's minimally invasive and not that dangerous" it seems to me that removing one of your organs unnecessarily is a bad idea. Granted, it may be necessary in some cases, but I've seen tons of cases where people have had their gallbladders removed and then had health issues stemming from that later in life. If it were me I would do everything in my power to fix the root cause before considering surgery as a last resort.

 

[SociallyChallenged]

I wasn't suggesting that he switch to a high-fat diet. I merely suggested that if he was currently eating a low fat (and thus high-carb) diet that may have been one of the precipitating factors. Hence the "reduce processed carbs and gradually increase fat intake." The point I was trying to make is that while they say "oh it's minimally invasive and not that dangerous" it seems to me that removing one of your organs unnecessarily is a bad idea. Granted, it may be necessary in some cases, but I've seen tons of cases where people have had their gallbladders removed and then had health issues stemming from that later in life. If it were me I would do everything in my power to fix the root cause before considering surgery as a last resort.

I don't have an issue with what you were saying about increasing fat. Logically, it's fine. I'd just like to see research behind it prior to suggesting it for patients.

The argument that removing anything from your body is bad doesn't stand up though. It's almost like certain peoples that believe taking any sort of blood is hugely negative. Tonsils get removed. Appendices get removed. Kidneys get removed. Gallbladders get removed. And most of these people live the same life everyone else does. I agree that I don't really want to toss my gallbladder out the window, but the best measures that you mention are preventative. They're slow and potentially useless when someone's in the thick of it. With somebody in 7/10 pain, something has to get done. Waiting weeks for an intervention that doesn't have medical research behind it may be too much. It's food for thought and just gives another reason why you shouldn't eat crappy in the first place, but as a primary intervention, it's not plausible. If a doctor did this with a patient, the patient would HATE them, even if it would work in the long term.

 

[KentState]

As SociallyChallenged pointed out, I don't have weeks to wait. I'm the primary bread winner and will be in the family and missing work and not being able to perform is just as good as death. I also eat both a low fat and low carb diet. We eat mostly vegetables, fruits, fat free milk or soy, and lean protien like chicken, turkey, fish and so on. I just ate like crap for so many years and it caught up to me when taking the weight off.

 

[KentState]

Had the surgery on Monday. The doctor said everything went better than expected.

 

[Blintok]

i believe its correct that less fat can bring on the attacks. the gall bladder just stores extra bile and is used when you eat more fat than usual.
one thing you do not want is for the stones to pop out of the gall bladder and get stuck in the bile duct...if that gets plugged up it will lead to pancreatitis and and infection and you pancreas essentially melts. (digests itself)

i went thru all this in 2000. both having the gall bladder removed and the tube down your throat to remove stones from the bottom of the bile duct in the duodenum.

my gall bladder was removed via laparoscopic surgury so wasnt too bad. i went to hospital early on a Friday...surgury at 8am. and i was home that same day at 5pm.

the worst of it was after. when they do the surgury they expand your stomach with nitrogen gas. (gives them room to work) for 2 nites i had to sleep in lazyboy as i couldnt lay flat. felt like i did 60000 situps my stomach muscles so sore. then on monday the gas started to leach out (they warned me about that) makes you have really bad joint pain especially in the shoulders.

good luck. hope it all works out for you

 

[KentState]

i believe its correct that less fat can bring on the attacks. the gall bladder just stores extra bile and is used when you eat more fat than usual.
one thing you do not want is for the stones to pop out of the gall bladder and get stuck in the bile duct...if that gets plugged up it will lead to pancreatitis and and infection and you pancreas essentially melts. (digests itself)

i went thru all this in 2000. both having the gall bladder removed and the tube down your throat to remove stones from the bottom of the bile duct in the duodenum.

my gall bladder was removed via laparoscopic surgury so wasnt too bad. i went to hospital early on a Friday...surgury at 8am. and i was home that same day at 5pm.

the worst of it was after. when they do the surgury they expand your stomach with nitrogen gas. (gives them room to work) for 2 nites i had to sleep in lazyboy as i couldnt lay flat. felt like i did 60000 situps my stomach muscles so sore. then on monday the gas started to leach out (they warned me about that) makes you have really bad joint pain especially in the shoulders.

good luck. hope it all works out for you

Yes, the gas (think they used CO2 for me) was a horrible experience. I slept upright the first two nights in bed. I remember at one point trying to get into a more comfortable position and barely being able to breathe. At about the 40 hour mark, most of the gas was gone, but it did move to my shoulders.

Fortunately, I have the best fiance in the world and she was able to assist me every step of the way. Even put together a spreadsheet so she could track when I take my pills. I don't know how someone can do these things alone.

Anyways, they had to do 5 holes to not risk dumping the gallbladder into the hernia repair. So I feel a little like Swiss cheese and can really tell how much the core muscles are used for simple things. I hope to be back to work by the middle of next week once I can get a full night's sleep.

The one other thing that I got out of all this is a general disgust for greasy food. It no longer excites me to eat crap as it doesn't make me feel good.