What about washing a laptop, or its insides?

[sonoferu]

My wife spilled a home-made health drink, fruit and juice and veggies and greens whirred up in a blender, very tasty and healthy actually, on the laptop. Dell Latitude D830, XP Home.

I wasnt home, she said she did what she could to wipe it up, but then it started acting badly, did an automatic restart once or twice [just rebooted itself] and now the screen is black. It took a while to realize that it's the screen that's bad now. I can plug it into my desktop monitor and use it just fine.

I got the Service Manual and got my nerve, and opened it up. Took it apart down to removing the palm rest [never heard the term before, I would have called it the keyboard deck or something] so I could look down into the motherboard and I saw nothing in there that looked like dried gick of any kind.

The touchpad keys felt kind of gicky so I removed that unit but couldnt get inside it. I dont see what that would do to the motherboard or the display anyway.

So basically I pulled things apart and put them together, most of the cables got pulled and re-plugged, but it still is showing nothing.

I am tempted to wash the thing. Plainly the spill did something, and maybe washing will do it. I had the idea and looked on the web and there are lots of places where people said they do it, and lots of people say NO WAY, never do that!!!!

So do the folks here on good old Anandtech have any input?

I know it would have to be dried well afterward. I have time, I was able to get her files off while I had it on my monitor, and she can do her work using her old laptop that we still have.

thanks!

 

[Emulex]

thank god for accidental damage plan!

 

[sonoferu]

alas, no such plan here

 

[Cogman]

Do NOT wash it in water. That will likely screw things up more than they are. Alas, you may have already done permanent damage to the laptop by turning it on.

If there is any hope of clean it, get some 90 proof isopropyl alcohol and go to town trying to clean it. There are a lot of sharp edges and points that just stick up, so you'll want something that won't tear easy to clean it up.

It is worth a shot to try and clean it, but I wouldn't get my hopes up if I where you.

 

[sonoferu]

Interested in your mention of alcolhol. One [and only one] of the postings I found on another site said to use denatured alcohol, and NOT isopropyl.

Please understand, I have NO prior knowledge of any of this, so anything anyone says, I listen carefully

thanks

 

[Cogman]

Interested in your mention of alcolhol. One [and only one] of the postings I found on another site said to use denatured alcohol, and NOT isopropyl.

Please understand, I have NO prior knowledge of any of this, so anything anyone says, I listen carefully

thanks

The fear is that the water will screw things up. (for isopropyl alcohol) While using 70% might be too risky. 90% really isn't going to hurt much (electronics can stand a LITTLE water) just make sure that things are completely dry before turning it on and you should be fine.

The problem with denatured alcohol is the denaturing agent. It can be denatured with anything from isoproppyl alcohol to ipecac syrup. Some of that stuff might be damaging to the electronics. With isopropyl alcohol you know that you only have alcohol and water. (pretty clean water as well.)

Toms hardware once started filling a running machine with de-ionized water (I believe). While the machine eventually crashed (making the folks at toms go "oh crap!", they drained the water, dried it off, and there was no damage done. A little water won't destroy things. But a lot of tap water will screw things up.

 

[sonoferu]

I do believe my water here is pretty clean - deep artesian well drilled in New Hampshire granite, and there is a softening filter it goes through too, to take out minerals that can deposit on the plumbing surfaces.

So it's sounding like going at it with alcohol is the thing. I presume I would brush it on or something, and then rinse off, that's when the water would hit it.

And yeah, the damage may already be done. Everywhere I look I see the advice to shut down and pull the battery right away when there is a spill, before any cleanup steps even get started. Get the electricity out of the way pronto. She didnt do that, she kept on using it. After one or two reboots the screen went black, which is what we have now.

Anyway, I think it's worth a try.

Otherwhere, folks have seemed to think it's going to be either a new display or a new motherboard. I dont think the display itself was touched by the spill, so it would logically seem more likely the board, but first things first.

thanks

 

[Cogman]

Your water is NOT clean enough. Do NOT use tap water. This can't be stressed enough. Not only that, but you said you spilt food stuff on your computer. Mixing any water with the food stuff will result in impure water that will conduct electricity and possibly ruin things.

Now don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to insult your water source . I'm just saying, for electronic equipment, if you haven't specifically processed and cleaned the water, you shouldn't use it for electronics.

It doesn't mater so much with the isopropyl alcohol because the water is in very dilute amounts that are dried very quickly be the alcohol.


Anyways, good luck.

 

[sonoferu]

OK, got it

But back to something I said earlier

I dont think the display itself was touched by the spill, so it would logically seem more likely the board, but first things first.

Now that I think more, what about the fact that the laptop can work using my monitor [cable from the D-sub port]?

Would that not indicate that the video per se is not bad, but the video display through the laptop screen is gone? Or is the output to the D-sub independent of the output to the onboard screen?

 

[sonoferu]

And further - what about technique? Should I put it in a bath of alcohol or brush it on and rinse [with alcohol]. I have some small soft-bristle artist brushes, they would be very gentle. I presume we're not talking about scrubbing here, just applying and putting enough into the brushing to get things moving

 

[C1]

Some people have found that after a few days their machines effectively recover. The best bet is to have a shop disassemble, inspect & clean the parts which appear to need cleaning. If you decide to try this yourself, then use a non-residue electrical contact cleaner. Some of the problems with water & alcohols are oxidation and in particularly, film residue.

 

[CurseTheSky]

Just for future reference, any time you have any spill on any piece of electronic (or electrical for that matter) equipment, you need to cut power IMMEDIATELY. Damage is done because the spill can conduct electricity, and allow it to flow in areas that it shouldn't. This can overload components and cause them to blow (or worse, catch fire / cause electrical shock), necessitating you to replace the damaged areas. In the worst case, the entire laptop may now be junk. In the best case, there are still things contaminating some components or traces, causing shorts and whatnot.

First, you need to take the battery out if you haven't already. It should have a couple of latches that hold it in to the back / bottom of the laptop. Take that, and set it aside with the AC adapter. Absolutely DO NOT plug in the laptop at any time during the cleaning process.

Second, you'll need to disassemble as much as you can. Look up a guide online on how to take out things like the keyboard, screen, etc. Make sure to save all screws and label them according to what they held in. You shouldn't have to remove the motherboard or processor, but you need to at least have them exposed.

Third, you'll want a plastic tub just big enough to fit the laptop in. You'll need to buy some 90%+ isopropyl alcohol (the higher then % the better, don't go below 90% though). I'd guess at least a liter or so. You'll need to put the laptop in the tub, then wash everything down with the alcohol. You can use your fingers to help GENTLY scrub off some of the junk while you rinse with alcohol, but absolutely do not use a cloth, sponge, or paper towel as they may leave deposits. If you do choose to use your fingers, it would be a good idea to buy a anti-static (grounding) wrist-strap and attach it to something large and metal nearby, just to avoid static damage in this dry winter weather (try not to wear fleece, try not to work on a carpet, etc.)

Once you've rinsed the entire laptop out, you'll need to let it sit for several days to dry completely. Don't get antsy and reassemble or try to turn it on after several hours - some of the alcohol in dark nooks and crannies may take days to dry out. You can seal it in a dry container with some rice to help speed up the process.

Good luck.

 

[sonoferu]

Hi all

At some point folks will probably get tired of me coming back with questions from your answers, but I am looking for explanations of discrepancies. Like the explanation from Cogman, of why to go with isopropyl alcohol, rather than denatured alcohol [I saw a website where someone said go with denatured alcohol, not isopropyl]

This time it's the comment above

You shouldn't have to remove the motherboard or processor, but you need to at least have them exposed.

I was expecting to remove and wash the motherboard by itself, and at least remove the CPU [other sites specified that] and several have said you have to remove the little round battery - CMOS battery, is that the term?

But CurseTheSky, you are saying no need for that?

thanks

 

[SooperDave]

Before you wash anything take a close look at the switch that turns the display off/on when the lid is opened and closed. Also, they make spray can electronics cleaners that dry fast with no residue. You might look in to that. I've bought a laptop with a spill issue that only caused a keyboard problem. I was planning on replacing the keyboard anyway so I tried rinsing it with hot water. Four days later many keys started working but not all. My water is well water with a softener, filtered to 3 microns, and reverse osmosis so YMMV.

 

[sonoferu]

good idea - but it looks like there IS no on/off switch on this one. Her older laptop and mine at work have a little stubby spring-loaded thing sticking up at the back of the deck, just under the hinge. Push it down and it goes to sleep, or some other defined action

But on this one there is no such switch.

At the point where the switch is on the others, there IS a hole, but under it, when you pull the first button-cover thing off, it says MIC next to the hole, and when you remove the entire deck [palm rest they call it] there is a little cylinder there with a rubber cover over it. Could well be a microphone but it is not a switch

If I could find the switch, maybe it's gunked up with dried drink stuff and stuck in the off position.

But even looking down at the motherboard now, along that top edge, I see no kind of push-down switch mechanism.

????

I did finally find some inside, but only in the 2 holes at the front where the latch prongs go into them. One had some dried out caked green drink residue, but if that is what it is like, then really there's none inside on the board, that I can see.

 

[sonoferu]

Here's a curiosity question - in looking around for an on/off switch, I notice there is something on the bottom of the cover on the inside, just to the right of the left-side hinge, that looks like maybe a little light. A plastic cover on it, translucent, and some kind of little device inside, the whole little thing is about a quarter-inch square. First thought is that it would be a light. But for what? If it's to shine a light on the keyboard for work, the display itself would probably shine more than this thing

In any case, it is not lit up. My thought was - is it supposed to light up, and if so is that a simple indication that the whole LCD display is not working?

 

[sonoferu]

Getting closer, I really do think so

I found strong evidence that the on/off switch is a "magnetic reed switch". There is a magnet inside the top edge of the lid, right below the latch as you look at the screen. I can put a paper clip there and there is definitely a magnet.

When it closes, it is right over the edge of the touchpad and when I take the touchpad out, there is a super-tiny circuit board, I guess you would have to call it. Just 2 leads with a tiny black bar laid across them. And a lead back around and under the touchpad keys

So I hope that is the reed switch, and if I can clean it up it will start working. As I read the docs on it, when the lid closes, the magnet pulls contacts together and kills the display. I wonder if it's just stuck in the off position, and cleaning it might get it to "let go" when it should.

The touchpad DOES have residue inside the keys and all, and it does look like some is across the gold leads.

So I gotta go find some alcohol

 

[CurseTheSky]

The reason I don't recommend removing the processor is due to the huge possibility of getting crud in the CPU socket. Generally speaking, nothing should have leaked in there unless you were forcing it to, making the need to remove the CPU null and void.

It'll probably cause more potential harm to remove it than it will just to leave it alone. Removing the CMOS battery, on the other hand, wouldn't be a bad idea. That one doesn't have a ton of tiny little pins and sockets that can get filled with junk - just two contacts which are relatively large and easy to clean.

 

[sonoferu]

Well, I cleaned the touchpad nicely, I think, but it did not make the display work. Still I can see everything on a separate monitor.

So I think now I will just get a new touchpad, I see them for about $10 online, and I would rather try that than go into either a new display or a new motherboard at this point.

There was definitely dried drink down inside the touchpad, and I think my deduction that the little thingie there directly under the magnet on the lid is indeed the reed switch.

Remembering my wife's description of things at the time, it sounds plausible - the spill was on the touchpad, very little if any into the keyboard. She scurried to wipe it up, and then kept working. There were a couple of spontaneous reboots and then it went black. I am guessing that the switch was getting flipped by the electrical action of the drink drying and eating at something, and so was going into its thing of calling for a suspend, which would look sort of like a restart. Her description is uncertain [she is zero on a ten scale of tech savvy].

Oh well

Hey, thanks all, I got a lot of help on this one and I think it will turn out ok

 

[sonoferu]

YEEEHAAA!!!

After a couple of obvious ideas I missed, I finally had one by myself and it worked!!!

I reasoned that if the problem is really in the switch embedded in the touchpad, and it's stuck in the closed position, that means a circuit is completed and it's sending a signal - "the circuit is closed, so that means the cover is down - let's turn off the screen".

Lifting the cover should break the circuit, right? Hmmmmm ... how else can we break the circuit ..... ??

Doh - unplug the touchpad!

So I pulled the cables from the touchpad and presto, we have a display!!

She doesnt need the touchpad, she uses a mouse anyway.

So there it is, we're all set. Thanks for all the suggestions and comments, pretty much all of which were shots in the dark, I know, but we finally hit the broad side of the barn!

 

[baileychic8]

I've done this several times, unhook everything remove the cmos battery, cpu and wifi card run a sink of warm soapy water and let it soak. This was the last resort on all of them. All of them worked turns out everything from coffee to vodka had been spilled on them. Let them dry several days before even thinking about connecting power.

 

[VirtualLarry]

Yeah, I don't think wash (in water) is the worst thing in the world. I would remove all fns and heatsinks, all batteries, and of course, DO NOT submerge the LCD screen/bezel. But if you remove and disconnect the motherboard from everything, and remove the fans off of it, and then remove the heatsinks, you should be able to soak it, in either water (yes, tap water could be risky, if you have high mineral content), or isopropyl alcohol. Then re-paste the heatsinks, and re-attach the fans, and cables for trackpad, keyboard, power switch, screen, etc.

What have you got to lose?

Of course, if you DO have accidental damage protection warranty on the unit, you could just send it in. Maybe remove the drive first, and keep that safe.

 

[jagdishsingh]

since you tried turning it on after the sill, that may have resulted in short circuit within the motherboard so no chance of revival here. I once spilled half a litre of water on my dell laptop. All I did was immediately unscrewed the backpanel, removed battery ram keyboard, motherboard from the chasses and let it to dry for more than 3 days. Then again stuck everything and it is good as it was before the spill.