What do you think of Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez?

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Amused

Elite Member
Apr 14, 2001
56,001
14,528
146
She's both ignorant and stupid. Your video is just the tip of the iceberg. As far as being attractive . . meh. I live in a part of the country that is literally overrun with gorgeous Hispanic women and AOC isn't even average. Shit, I own horses that don't have teeth as big as hers. LoL.

She's better educated, more knowledgeable and more accomplished than you are.

As usual, you fall for the right-wing cult propaganda about her.
 

Jaskalas

Lifer
Jun 23, 2004
33,575
7,637
136
AOC is a fine young woman. She's honest in her speech, which means she'll make mistakes. That's what freshmen do. They learn later how to guard themselves, to slow down, and choose their words more carefully. Unless they're named Trump, then even at a geriatric age an entire party celebrates his lack of decorum and blatant lies.

I do not approve of everything she stands for. I do not need to.
She is passionate for helping people, and that counts a lot more right now than any Republican would ever know.
 
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Blackjack200

Lifer
May 28, 2007
15,995
1,685
126
She also talked about the money that Amazon was going to get as if it was money that the city/state was giving to Amazon as cash. It was not. That too was a dumb thing she did. Nobody is perfect.

She's right about the Amazon deal, a big chunk of it was refundable tax credits, so the state or the city would have been paying money to Amazon.

I do agree that she is not perfect. In terms of foreign policy she is nowhere near as good as Ilhan Omar.

Your position is that she made a mistake about the double job thing. If she gets dragged into topics where she makes those types of comments, it will make her look like she does not know what she is talking about.

Anyone that does a lot of interviews and engages with people publicly on a regular basis (i.e. her Twitter account) is going to make mistakes. I don't think her mistakes have been unusually bad or frequent, but I think her critics have very little to bite on, so they try to make a big issue of them and also make a big deal of her driving around in cars.

She also did something like that with the Amazon deal. Talking about how the money should go to transit instead of Amazon makes no sense given what the deal was. Nobody was giving Amazon $3 billion.

I makes perfect sense to people that are opposed to corporate handouts. The criticism of her comments came from people who supported the grotesque spectacle of mayors and governors groveling before Amazon.
 
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realibrad

Lifer
Oct 18, 2013
12,337
898
126
True, but you're far more likely to have a better outcome when starting with Good Principles rather than Bad Principles.

Yes, but, you asked what is there to not like. While I agree that having people with good principles is very important, there is an ocean of bad outcomes from good intentions.
 

yllus

Elite Member & Lifer
Aug 20, 2000
20,577
432
126
Well-spoken, fearless, comes in with an excellent set of ideals and is grounded in how normal people live their life. America needs 100 more AOCs.
 

blankslate

Diamond Member
Jun 16, 2008
8,659
491
126
She's both ignorant and stupid.

AOC is very smart

this is how we know.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexandria_Ocasio-Cortez

She graduated cum laude from Boston University's College of Arts and Sciences in 2011, majoring in international relations and economics.[27][31][32]

In the 2016 primary, Ocasio-Cortez worked as an organizer for Bernie Sanders's 2016 presidential campaign.[41] After the general election, she traveled across America by car, visiting places such as Flint, Michigan, and Standing Rock Indian Reservation in North Dakota, and speaking to people affected by the Flint water crisis and the Dakota Access Pipeline.[42]




__________
 
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Reactions: UberNeuman

realibrad

Lifer
Oct 18, 2013
12,337
898
126
She's right about the Amazon deal, a big chunk of it was refundable tax credits, so the state or the city would have been paying money to Amazon.

I do agree that she is not perfect. In terms of foreign policy she is nowhere near as good as Ilhan Omar.

No, she was clearly wrong. You cant invest a tax credit if you don't give it out. Can you explain how she could say that, and not be wrong?

"If we were willing to give away $3 billion for this deal, we could invest those $3 billion in our district ourselves, if we wanted to. We could hire out more teachers. We can fix our subways. We can put a lot of people to work for that money, if we wanted to"

Anyone that does a lot of interviews and engages with people publicly on a regular basis (i.e. her Twitter account) is going to make mistakes. I don't think her mistakes have been unusually bad or frequent, but I think her critics have very little to bite on, so they try to make a big issue of them and also make a big deal of her driving around in cars.

She is new, so frequency is not a good measure yet. But, she is in the public eye far more than normal. The Right is watching her to use as a lightning rod. She is also quite popular on the Left as well.

I'm not making the argument that she is the worst, as clearly she is not. I'm just responding to a thread asking about personal views on her.

I makes perfect sense to people that are opposed to corporate handouts. The criticism of her comments came from people who supported the grotesque spectacle of mayors and governors groveling before Amazon.

Her comment as I quoted above was that if we were willing to give Amazon a tax break of $3 billion, that we should be willing to spend $3 billion on other things. The reason to give a tax break was that the city would not collect as much as normal, but, that would also mean they brought in over $20 Billion. So, either she was mistaken, or, she was playing with words to mislead. I'm guessing it was that she was mistaken.
 

hal2kilo

Lifer
Feb 24, 2009
23,652
10,515
136
Well-spoken, fearless in speaking up and comes in with an excellent set of ideals and is grounded in how normal people live their life. America needs 100 more AOCs.
She has to deal with the idea, that she's way out in front of the parade, if she goes too far the parade won't follow. Kind of like where legalization of rec marijuana is maybe was. The Dems just won majority of the house, they were not all of AOC's political persuasion, they have more moderate constituencies. She needs to back off the "we will primary them" crap.
 

Amused

Elite Member
Apr 14, 2001
56,001
14,528
146
Interesting write up about the hysteria surrounding her.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/life...4d6b7840b82_story.html?utm_term=.9100729e5f56

The ‘ravenous hysteria’ over Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez just reached a new level of crazy


Sometime over the past few days, the overreaction to Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez moved from somewhat strange to downright bizarre — and, at times, more than a little scary.

On Greg Gutfeld’s show on Fox News, commentator Katherine Timpf lit into the 29-year-old congresswoman from New York over her championing of the Green New Deal, quipping that the climate-change initiative might even lead to cannibalism.

“I don’t want to eat people, Greg, and I don’t want people to eat me,” Timpf said. “AOC, do you want people to eat you?”

At last week’s CPAC conference, Sebastian Gorka took his shot, inspired by Ocasio-Cortez’s recent suggestions that the environment would benefit from restrictions on factory farming and suggestions that Americans consider eating less red meat.

“They want to rebuild your home, they want to take away your hamburgers,” said Gorka, the former Breitbart editor and former Trump administration official known for his Islamophobic ideas.

“This is what Stalin dreamed about but never achieved.”
 

Blackjack200

Lifer
May 28, 2007
15,995
1,685
126
No, she was clearly wrong. You cant invest a tax credit if you don't give it out. Can you explain how she could say that, and not be wrong?

"If we were willing to give away $3 billion for this deal, we could invest those $3 billion in our district ourselves, if we wanted to. We could hire out more teachers. We can fix our subways. We can put a lot of people to work for that money, if we wanted to"

Do you know what a refundable tax credit is?

Her comment as I quoted above was that if we were willing to give Amazon a tax break of $3 billion, that we should be willing to spend $3 billion on other things. The reason to give a tax break was that the city would not collect as much as normal, but, that would also mean they brought in over $20 Billion. So, either she was mistaken, or, she was playing with words to mislead. I'm guessing it was that she was mistaken.

The $27 billion figure was over 25 years. And it was bullshit all along.

https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2019/2/17/1835392/-Amazon-s-27-Billion-Mirage
 

soundforbjt

Lifer
Feb 15, 2002
17,788
6,040
136
Interesting write up about the hysteria surrounding her.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/life...4d6b7840b82_story.html?utm_term=.9100729e5f56

The ‘ravenous hysteria’ over Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez just reached a new level of crazy


Sometime over the past few days, the overreaction to Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez moved from somewhat strange to downright bizarre — and, at times, more than a little scary.

On Greg Gutfeld’s show on Fox News, commentator Katherine Timpf lit into the 29-year-old congresswoman from New York over her championing of the Green New Deal, quipping that the climate-change initiative might even lead to cannibalism.

“I don’t want to eat people, Greg, and I don’t want people to eat me,” Timpf said. “AOC, do you want people to eat you?”

At last week’s CPAC conference, Sebastian Gorka took his shot, inspired by Ocasio-Cortez’s recent suggestions that the environment would benefit from restrictions on factory farming and suggestions that Americans consider eating less red meat.

“They want to rebuild your home, they want to take away your hamburgers,” said Gorka, the former Breitbart editor and former Trump administration official known for his Islamophobic ideas.

“This is what Stalin dreamed about but never achieved.”
At CPAC during Trump's meandering "speech", he did a bit about the Green Deal (paraphrasing) "Honey?, is the wind blowing? I'd like to watch some TV."
 

[DHT]Osiris

Lifer
Dec 15, 2015
14,624
12,757
146
No, the $27B figure was bullshit.
Understood. Why does it always seem like any story presenting a view that makes it beneficial to give tax breaks to an organization that doesn't need it, ends up being completely false?

Is it ... is it because it's all bullshit?
 

realibrad

Lifer
Oct 18, 2013
12,337
898
126
Do you know what a refundable tax credit is?

Yes, it means that the tax is collected and then given back. The only way for them to collect that tax is to make money. No tax was collected, so there is no money to invest.

Do not deflect. She got it wrong by saying that the $3 Billion could be spent somewhere.


The $27 billion figure was over 25 years. And it was bullshit all along.

https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2019/2/17/1835392/-Amazon-s-27-Billion-Mirage


The person that wrote that article is an idiot. If you are only going to look at tax collected then yes, its not $27 from Amazon and its employees. That is not how that $27 Billion was estimated though.

https://ny.curbed.com/2019/2/14/18225029/amazon-hq2-nyc-deal-canceled

That number was estimated by the net effect on all employment in the city. Amazon would have caused more demand in the city and the state. That demand would drive other jobs to be created that would not otherwise be created if Amazon was not there. The net effect of all of that was estimated to be $27 billion. The person from your article is a complete idiot.
 

VRAMdemon

Diamond Member
Aug 16, 2012
6,572
7,823
136
She's an outspoken, strong woman.This is mainly why the right is talking about her. I would think if they were concerned about her ideas gaining traction then they'd just ignore her rather than draw attention to her. They know that she's getting attention so they're belittling her. They will broadcast her positions representing the positions of all mainstream Dems. According to the Republican spin machine anyway. And that spin machine will broadcast that image of The Dems as far and wide and often as sub-humanly possible

She's been known now for calling out Corporate money, pulling in a populist, anti-corruption direction and the game that everyone there knows about, and most participate in, but dare not speak of. She's threatening that golden goose. That's why there is such an obsession over this freshmen representative. They will try to abort her career, if you'll pardon the expression, because she poses a threat to their cash flow. Is she dumber or more extreme that Louis Gohmert or Steve King?. Is she an empty suit?. It's to early for me to make that determination.
 
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Blackjack200

Lifer
May 28, 2007
15,995
1,685
126
Understood. Why does it always seem like any story presenting a view that makes it beneficial to give tax breaks to an organization that doesn't need it, ends up being completely false?

Is it ... is it because it's all bullshit?

I have no idea what that's supposed to mean. I'm pointing to one frequently cited figure that has never been convincingly supported and calling it bullshit. How that translates to "any story presenting a view that makes it beneficial to give tax breaks to an organization that doesn't need it" is beyond me.


Yes, it means that the tax is collected and then given back. The only way for them to collect that tax is to make money. No tax was collected, so there is no money to invest.

No, that's not what it means. Refundable tax credits are paid out even if the value of the credit exceeds that taxes paid. That means that the city or the state would be writing Amazon a check.

Do not deflect. She got it wrong by saying that the $3 Billion could be spent somewhere.

The person that wrote that article is an idiot. If you are only going to look at tax collected then yes, its not $27 from Amazon and its employees. That is not how that $27 Billion was estimated though.

https://ny.curbed.com/2019/2/14/18225029/amazon-hq2-nyc-deal-canceled

That number was estimated by the net effect on all employment in the city. Amazon would have caused more demand in the city and the state. That demand would drive other jobs to be created that would not otherwise be created if Amazon was not there. The net effect of all of that was estimated to be $27 billion. The person from your article is a complete idiot.

You're missing the point. Her statement that people having multiple jobs are double counted was wrong. She acknowledged her mistake.

She has not conceded that she was wrong on her Amazon statements. I agree with her on the Amazon issue. If you think she's wrong, that's fine and we have a whole thread about the Amazon deal where that could be argued. But it doesn't fall into the category of a simple mistake of fact, this is a far complex issue.
 

Homerboy

Lifer
Mar 1, 2000
30,856
4,974
126
I've said it a dozen times here and other places, and I will paraphrase myself:

Smart, (now) powerful, well spoken, "radical" ideas, woman, minority and the clincher: attractive. The GOPers and Trump humpers are confused about the tingling in their pants about her.
 

HomerJS

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
36,289
28,144
136
I do notice how AOC detractors hold her to a much higher standard then the current POTUS.

At least if they were honest with themselves
 

Zaap

Diamond Member
Jun 12, 2008
7,162
424
126
This forum has gotten worse than it was. Who actually enjoys this sewer?
 

ecogen

Golden Member
Dec 24, 2016
1,217
1,288
136
She's better educated, more knowledgeable and more accomplished than you are.

As usual, you fall for the right-wing cult propaganda about her.

I mean, that's not a really high bar. My pet rock fits those criteria.
 
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