What is the "liberal" view on home schooling?

[Hayabusa Rider]

I wonder what conservatives think of Fords?

 

[smashp]

Home schooling produces mostly religious fanitics that cant function in Society.

Ive met extremely intelligent people that were home schooled.

They spent so much time with mama growing up that they had norman bates syndrome and couldnt quite let go of momma's tit.

Life is hard and rough. send them to a good public school, it builds character and lets the Kid see things first hand that a book or parent could never teach them.

 

[alchemize]

Originally posted by: smashp
Home schooling produces mostly religious fanitics that cant function in Society.

Ive met extremely intelligent people that were home schooled.

They spent so much time with mama growing up that they had norman bates syndrome and couldnt quite let go of momma's tit.

Life is hard and rough. send them to a good public school, it builds character and lets the Kid see things first hand that a book or parent could never teach them.

Are you saying that home schooling produces extremely intelligent religious fanatic psychopaths? What great insight

By your logic, all we need for home schooling to work is just beat up the kids some every few weeks and make them afraid for their lives.

 

[alchemize]

Originally posted by: oreagan
I went to two public schools (moved in the middle of high school, whee!) and I have to say that it was a very good thing for me. Could I have learned faster in some subjects if I were homeschooled? Sure. The gifted, however, are going to be held back by having just one teacher. I'm sorry, but unless you and your wife are REALLY well educated, you're just not going to be able to teach AP level Physics, Psychology, English Lit., foreign language, Calculus, etc. There's just too much. I took 8 AP classes from 7 different teachers and each of them were amazing educators. I just can't picture many families anywhere in the world with parents capable of combining the skills, knowledge and experience of even just these 7.

Then, of course, are the social aspects. I suppose if you get your kid in sports, clubs, camps, churches, and as many other social aspects as possible that'll help, but day-to-day interactions are VERY important. I was cock of the walk at my first high school. When I moved to the new one, I learned some humility; there were about 5-6 of us at the top of this (larger) class just as smart as I, some more gifted in various areas. Learning to live, day to day, with equals and betters is a worthwhile lesson. Without high school, I wouldn't have had my girlfriend, the cameraderie of my soccer teams (high school is very different from club soccer), my friends. I wouldn't have met people who I sincerely disagreed with, yet respected.

Am I against homeschooling? Nope. My dream for America is a country where every person gets the very best education possible in every way. However that happens, I'm thrilled when it does. I just think that there are probably some important lessons a child learns in public schooling that he just can't get anywhere else.

Actually the advanced education is covered by two aspects (at least in my community):

1) Advanced classes, i.e. physics, calculus, etc. are taught by specialists in the Co-op. There are several PhD's in the Co-op in our area that handle the high school classes.
2) At age 16 they can start taking advanced classes at the local community college that has an agreement with the Co-op.

 

[LunarRay]

Originally posted by: WinstonSmith
I wonder what conservatives think of Fords?

One was enough.
As in the case of Bushes.


What say you about home schooling? The practical use is for those folks who can devote the time. Public school produces accross the spectrum but, Private and Home produce greater results. Maybe it is genetic? If they can afford the time they can survive on one income and it probably is a good one $ wise.

 

[Konigin]

I was homeschooled through 10th grade, then I went to public school. From experience I can say both have their particular advantages. If I had to do it all over again, I would have liked to be homeschooled through 8th grade, then go to a public high school.

 

[alchemize]

Originally posted by: Konigin
I was homeschooled through 10th grade, then I went to public school. From experience I can say both have their particular advantages. If I had to do it all over again, I would have liked to be homeschooled through 8th grade, then go to a public high school.

Thanks Konigin it is good to hear from someone who actually has been there. Can you explain why you would have rather gone to high school 2 years earlier? What about a private high school, would that have been acceptable to you also at 8th grade?

 

[alchemize]

Originally posted by: LunarRay

Originally posted by: WinstonSmith
I wonder what conservatives think of Fords?

One was enough.
As in the case of Bushes.


What say you about home schooling? The practical use is for those folks who can devote the time. Public school produces accross the spectrum but, Private and Home produce greater results. Maybe it is genetic? If they can afford the time they can survive on one income and it probably is a good one $ wise.

The stats are probably skewed, aren't they. After all these are people that care enough about their childern to sacrifice a lifestyle (SUV's and Big Screens) by likely having one income to stay at home and learn em It's so much easier to stick a bottle of formula in their mouth, stick em in daycare at 6 weeks, and never look back. If they go astray, blame the public schools

 

[LunarRay]

Originally posted by: alchemize

Originally posted by: LunarRay

Originally posted by: WinstonSmith
I wonder what conservatives think of Fords?

One was enough.
As in the case of Bushes.


What say you about home schooling? The practical use is for those folks who can devote the time. Public school produces accross the spectrum but, Private and Home produce greater results. Maybe it is genetic? If they can afford the time they can survive on one income and it probably is a good one $ wise.

The stats are probably skewed, aren't they. After all these are people that care enough about their childern to sacrifice a lifestyle (SUV's and Big Screens) by likely having one income to stay at home and learn em It's so much easier to stick a bottle of formula in their mouth, stick em in daycare at 6 weeks, and never look back. If they go astray, blame the public schools

I guess you're right. Do without for your kids. What a novel approach to life. I guess one could make it on the single income and raise kids properly. My wife stayed home and had her nose into everything that went on with the kids. Drove them nuts.
I didn't go to public anything because I grew up living near the PS this or that in NYC and I know what the "Welcome Back Kotter" kids had for teachers and classes. Some excelled despite the inequities but, many didn't.
I like the notion of Home schooling for kids and the co-op feature as well. The tax issue needs being visited on this because that part makes it double with the supplies and books and like that. Out here everyone goes to the "Boys and Girls club" or Boy Scouts or some athletic league so there is lots of peer interaction. The church sponsors lots of outings as well.

 

[oreagan]

I should mention that while I believe I got a very strong education from the public education system, a lot of my success can be attributed to parents who read to me when I was young, encouraged me to read myself when I could, and generally created a family environment that contributed to my love of academics. Even the most fervent anti-homeschooler has to admit that SOME homeschooling is hugely important in every child's life. Likewise, homeschooling advocates has to admit that with some parental suppliment and a decent school district, public schools can offer very strong educations.

 

[Orsorum]

I have no problem with it.

 

[LunarRay]

My granma used to tell me that you can't put in what God left out. Neither can any form of schooling or system. What one can do as a parent, as oreagan said; provide the atmosphere conducive to achievement. When both parents work they are either going to give up their relationship with the kids, their spouse, or themselves or comprimise somewhere. I don't know how folks can work 8 or 9 hours, sleep some and be there with the right attitude to deal with their kid's needs too. Some folks can do it, somehow. Many try and come as close as they are able. As alchemize said Having the big house, SUV and all the rest is nice but is that really what it is all about?
I often wondered what it would have been like to have a mother and father to raise me instead of my grandma. After all these years I've not figured it out. I think I got the better deal, though, because she (granma) was always there. She'd teach what she could, talk about what she saw as she had lived it but, mostly she told me about people. From their point of view. Not much of that going around these days, is there.

 

[heartsurgeon]

many of the people who post in these forums are "youthful"
having once been "youthful" myself, i actually appreciate and understand your point of view, even though I know believe
it to be mostly wrong.

when i was in high school, i was a volunteer staff worker for Hubert Humphrey's (liberal democrat) election committee..
i will guess that the majority of the liberal posters on this forum have not worked on an election committee

when i was in college, i took glee at the crucifixion of Richard Nixon and Spiro Agnew

then i got a real job, and started paying taxes, and getting frivilously sued by malpractice attorneys dumber than rocks..

now i'm a "conservative" what ever that means....

the unfortunate reality of politics is that it is all about the money..it is rarely (if ever) about actual ideals or personal held beliefs or
"leadership". it is about the money.

likewise, public school teachers teach to get paid money. They may have started out "caring" about kids, they may still "care" about kids, but they want to make a living just like everyone else. They belong to unions which look after their vested interests..that's what unions do...its not the "students" union, it's the "teacher's" union..they look after the teacher's best interest.

well, if you get your money from the goverment, and the goverment has set you up as a near monopoly, your obvious not going to like the idea
of having "your" money (tax revenue) diverted to a competitor (via vouchers), or having to work harder to improve the product (educated students) you make.

now we get down to the nitty gritty...what is in the students best interest, fundamentally conflicts with what is in the teachers best interest...
what is best for students is choice..a level playing field where they can choose the educational enviroment that best educates them. What is best for the teachers is no choice, take what they offer, and make sure no alternatives are available.

a harse, but accurate depiction of reality.

why so cynical you say? not cynical, just reality..

i sent my teen age daughter to a charter (public) school that attracts really smart kids from across the city...ANYONE can go there, even not so smart kids..NO ONE IS REFUSED...but because they are a charter school (outside the control of the teachers union, outside the control of the local school board), the local public school teacher's union, the local school board, and the local teachers have gone ballistic and done EVERYTHING they can think of to get the school closed down.

well, the school is very succcessful, half of all the national merit scholars in the entire city come from this one school, enrollment is increasing, and the student body has "great" school spirit. the kids love this school, the teacher's union has made it their mission in life to close it down...

i may be cynical, but i'm also more accurate in my depiction of reality than you may ready to accept.

when you are "youthful", you think the world is a fair and just place, and what is "morally good and right" wins out in public debate...
sorry to burst your bubble...what wins out is self-interest..

follow the money, and you will see what political debates are really about...
sad but true..

 

[CADsortaGUY]

Originally posted by: oreagan
I should mention that while I believe I got a very strong education from the public education system, a lot of my success can be attributed to parents who read to me when I was young, encouraged me to read myself when I could, and generally created a family environment that contributed to my love of academics. Even the most fervent anti-homeschooler has to admit that SOME homeschooling is hugely important in every child's life. Likewise, homeschooling advocates has to admit that with some parental suppliment and a decent school district, public schools can offer very strong educations.

Yep. Fortunately the school district I live in is VERY good, but what has made it "better" than most is because of the parental involvement. The school district and parents aren't always stepping on each other's toes and trying to pick fights either. Obviously it could always be better, but I firmly believe that schools can't truely be "good" without strong support from the parents who send their kids there.

Just my $.02

CkG

 

[Athanasius]

heartsurgeon:

Great post. The truth is never cynical.

The main attack on home schooling still seems to be the socialization issue, yet that concern has been addressed repeatedly. Furthermore, homeschooling is not what it was even five years ago. It is the fastest growing form of education in the country. It is growing because it works. It is growing despite that fact that homeschoolers operate on a shoe string budget, funding the kids' education without and second income while still fully funding the public school system through taxes.

Which brings up vouchers. Could I use the tax break? Of course I could. But I also recognize that many people will never have a better option than public schools and I want those schools be the very best they can be whether my kids go there or not. I think "promoting the general welfare" of the people includes providing a solid public educational system. I think a voucher system could work in a better system, but that they could be a death blow to the current system in many instances. And the current system is the only system that some people have access to. So do we just let that system die?

But schools do best when there is true community and parental involvement, as has already been stated. The current system is too bloated with bureaucrats and administrators (at least where I live) who, as heartsurgeon pointed out, make decisions that are too heavily influenced by the teachers' career self-interest.

I live in Prince George's County, Maryland. If you know the local news around here, you know what a fiasco the school board has been.