What is the most economically-viable carbon-neutral/positive fuel...

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sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,127
5,657
126
it is possible to mandate universal battery and you just pull into a station, swap out the battery in x min with a mechanised device and pay x dollars for that. Obviously the batteries would be nationally owned.

install cycle pedals hooked up to dynamos as emergency power :biggrin:

An easily swappable Battery Pack would certainly be a giant leap, but you still need a decent range per Battery Pack. At least a couple hundred miles, otherwise that convenience will just become an inconvenience.
 

sdifox

No Lifer
Sep 30, 2005
96,117
15,762
126
An easily swappable Battery Pack would certainly be a giant leap, but you still need a decent range per Battery Pack. At least a couple hundred miles, otherwise that convenience will just become an inconvenience.

well, unless we create electric rails on the road I don't see how else we can get decent range on electric :awe:

I would say 100mi should be good enough no?
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,127
5,657
126
well, unless we create electric rails on the road I don't see how else we can get decent range on electric :awe:

I would say 100mi should be good enough no?

That would be plenty for most local Driving, but long distance, not so much.
 

Perknose

Forum Director & Omnipotent Overlord
Forum Director
Oct 9, 1999
46,262
9,331
146
An easily swappable Battery Pack would certainly be a giant leap, but you still need a decent range per Battery Pack.

This is the question confronting scientists, many of them clad in white lab coats, carrying clipboards, and speaking in guttural German: How is babbery formed?
 

SparkyJJO

Lifer
May 16, 2002
13,357
7
81
What is it with this "carbon neutral" crap? We aren't creating more or destroying any carbon. And carbon isn't a poison either - last I checked, life forms are based on carbon.

Repeat after me: Carbon is NOT evil. It is NOT bad.
 
Dec 26, 2007
11,783
2
76
What is it with this "carbon neutral" crap? We aren't creating more or destroying any carbon. And carbon isn't a poison either - last I checked, life forms are based on carbon.

Repeat after me: Carbon is NOT evil. It is NOT bad.

Carbon neutral is in reference to the amount of carbon currently in the atmosphere (at least how I meant it). While we aren't creating or destroying any carbon, we are adding/removing it from the atmosphere which is important. Carbon is not "good" nor "evil", it just is. That said, carbon in the atmosphere (in the form of CO2) is generally not good for life as we know it currently on this planet.

Repeat after me: Carbon in the atmosphere is bad for the life currently on this planet, and being carbon neutral (not adding nor removing it from the atmosphere) is a good thing for humans and other life.
 

Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
50,879
4,266
126
Repeat after me: Carbon in the atmosphere is bad for the life currently on this planet, and being carbon neutral (not adding nor removing it from the atmosphere) is a good thing for humans and other life. __________________


Don't tell the plants!
 

bfdd

Lifer
Feb 3, 2007
13,312
1
0
The Tesla S has a max range of 300 miles depending on which battery you choose. I think we're almost there.

Sure, we're almost there for rich Americans to do, what about everyone else? 70k+ for a car is a LOT of money.
 

sdifox

No Lifer
Sep 30, 2005
96,117
15,762
126
Sure, we're almost there for rich Americans to do, what about everyone else? 70k+ for a car is a LOT of money.

I think he means give it a few iterations and we should be there.
 

Eli

Super Moderator | Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
50,422
8
81
There is no way to answer this question because there are a number of technologies being developed which are promising, but unproven. The production of hydrocarbon fuels directly by E. coli fo rexample.

Personally one of the worst things we can do is get caught in a one size fits all solution, and we need to consider the TCO of any system.

For example thorium reactors could be an ideal solution for energy intensive purposes, but we should be moving away from a grid based system even if the initial cost were higher. Why? A couple reasons and none of it related to the source or destination of electricity, but the means by which it is transmitted. As the grid becomes larger it is of necessity larger and more complex. We have "smart" grids now so we lessen the likelihood of a large power outage. That's great, but it then becomes increasingly expensive and more vulnerable to the elephant in the room, and that's solar activity. This is not something which is sci fi. A solar storm caused some damage not many years ago, and one in the mid 1800' was so powerful that people operating telegraphs got severe shocks. At this time there isn't a good solution to this. That means anything that uses modern technology and plugged in will be cooked. Computers mostly gone. The internet- history. Power? Forget it. That's best case. It gets a lot worse than that. Imagine communications gone, data fried, and more. Back to snail mail and typewriters. In the meantime the logistics of running business or government suddenly become impossible. What can be done to avert this is beyond the scope of my post, but this is not Y2K. It's a matter of physics.

Part of the solution would be to minimize exposure to the grid. It's easier to unplug your home or cluster of dwellings and it's easier to minimize the damage. Spending more money than exists to repair society isn't exactly economical.

There's a whole lot more to it than what's the shortest and cheapest route from concept to reality.

It would be so amazingly awesome to witness an X-class flare directed straight towards Earth in our lifetimes.* Would be like winning the lottery. Except not.

*The above sentence is not sarcasm and reflects the "Doomer" in me.
 

SparkyJJO

Lifer
May 16, 2002
13,357
7
81
Carbon neutral is in reference to the amount of carbon currently in the atmosphere (at least how I meant it). While we aren't creating or destroying any carbon, we are adding/removing it from the atmosphere which is important. Carbon is not "good" nor "evil", it just is. That said, carbon in the atmosphere (in the form of CO2) is generally not good for life as we know it currently on this planet.

Repeat after me: Carbon in the atmosphere is bad for the life currently on this planet, and being carbon neutral (not adding nor removing it from the atmosphere) is a good thing for humans and other life.

Carbon by itself is a solid, so if you throw it into the atmosphere it will end up back on and in the ground again and not stay floating around up there :awe:
 

gorobei

Diamond Member
Jan 7, 2007
3,713
1,067
136
Carbon by itself is a solid, so if you throw it into the atmosphere it will end up back on and in the ground again and not stay floating around up there :awe:

carbon dioxide is a gas. it doesn't come back down. or are you joking?
 

ForumMaster

Diamond Member
Feb 24, 2005
7,797
1
0
Safe or not, we are still producing nuclear waste that will take tens of thousands of years to break down. After the human race has gone extinct, our nuclear waste will still be around.

Not only do we have to think of ourselves, we have to think of those that will follow us.




Probably the best answer so far.

In the long run, I think solar, wave and wind will be the best solutions.

read this:
link
 

Linflas

Lifer
Jan 30, 2001
15,395
78
91
Carbon neutral is in reference to the amount of carbon currently in the atmosphere (at least how I meant it). While we aren't creating or destroying any carbon, we are adding/removing it from the atmosphere which is important. Carbon is not "good" nor "evil", it just is. That said, carbon in the atmosphere (in the form of CO2) is generally not good for life as we know it currently on this planet.

Repeat after me: Carbon in the atmosphere is bad for the life currently on this planet, and being carbon neutral (not adding nor removing it from the atmosphere) is a good thing for humans and other life.

So where exactly is all that CO2 you exhale going?
 

CZroe

Lifer
Jun 24, 2001
24,195
856
126
...Repeat after me: Carbon in the atmosphere is bad for the life currently on this planet, and being carbon neutral (not adding nor removing it from the atmosphere) is a good thing for humans and other life.

BWAAAAAA HA HA HA HA HA! So unbelievably ignorant. Even if it was conclusively shown to drive climate change, it would only affect SOME species negatively but would be a HUGE boon to nearly all plants and many less-sensitive animals will directly benefit. Natural climate change does the same thing. Are you going to say that the sun "is bad for the life currently on this planet?"

Yes, the "benefit" is at the expense of the current balance but, as we all know, there is no lasting balance over any measurement of time even long before man.
 
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