What platform / CPU / APU do you recommend for people you build for?

[escrow4]

Desktops are large, noisy and use a lot of power. An i5 laptop is more than the average user needs. In my experience with people who ask for recommendations from me, they want smaller, lighter and thinner. If they actually need a Windows machine, the Atom does just fine. If not, iPad.


How is the H110 "gimped"? Genuinely curious about this.



Average users don't want expansion, they want smaller, quieter and low power usage.

H110 vs H170

- 4 vs 6 SATA 3 ports
- 4 vs 8 max USB 3 ports
- 10 vs 14 USB 2 ports
- Less PCI-E lanes from the chipset - 6 2.0 vs 16 3.0
- No RAID support
- Worse build quality
- Worse VRMs/heatsink(s)

 

[escrow4]

VirtualLarry just bought another 3 more with A75 chipset this time. He's not interested in building 10x i5-6500, it will run him with a $2,000 bill. Instead, he can buy 10x A4-3300 for $85.55, and it still serves basic Windows 10 functions well.

If you don't like our ideas, then please leave. ()

Instead of buying 10 junk parts you could have bought a single i5 6500 non K for $195 that would blow them away.

 

[SPBHM]

H110 vs H170

- 4 vs 6 SATA 3 ports
- 4 vs 8 max USB 3 ports
- 10 vs 14 USB 2 ports
- Less PCI-E lanes from the chipset - 6 2.0 vs 16 3.0
- No RAID support
- Worse build quality
- Worse VRMs/heatsink(s)

only interesting loss from this list for me would be the possibility of RAID, the rest not really.

 

[monstercameron]

My main goal is to keep people away from tablet processors. i3 would be standard, I think.

how do you feel about core m then?

 

[waltchan]

Instead of buying 10 junk parts you could have bought a single i5 6500 non K for $195 that would blow them away.

We need 10 computers for variety of uses and different settings. 1 computer isn't enough. I don't get what you're saying.

 

[ElFenix]

how do you feel about core m then?

i'd rather have it than an atom (and that includes bay/cherrytrail based celerons and pentiums, which imho are still atoms)

 

[JWade]

for when I build a system to someone, it goes by their budget to what I recommend. if they don't have a budget and have the money, then an i5/i7 of course.

low budget gamer then its an AMD APU.

I have to ask what is their budget is first, in the past someone would say they wanted a gamer, and I would build them a gamer with an i5/i7, 16gb ram and nice video card and its time to get the bill for it, they would always say it costs way too much.

I have to agree that for $200 a higher AMD dual or mid level quad, 8gb ram, and ssd is hard to beat on a tight budget

 

[Shivansps]

H110 vs H170

- 4 vs 6 SATA 3 ports
- 4 vs 8 max USB 3 ports
- 10 vs 14 USB 2 ports
- Less PCI-E lanes from the chipset - 6 2.0 vs 16 3.0
- No RAID support
- Worse build quality
- Worse VRMs/heatsink(s)

H110 is great compared to H81 and AMD Chipsets... it has front USB 3.0 support, and thats a basic need howdays, something equivalent only by AMD A78 or 970, and B85/H87...

RAID its missing on B150 as well... what is kind of noncense to me.

 

[cbn]

Here is a comparison of the GPU core on the A4-3300, A4-3420, Power Color HD5450 and a generic HD6450:

A4-3300: 160sp VLIW5 (DX11) @ 443 MHz
A4-3420: 160sp VLIW5 (DX11) @ 600 Mhz

HD5450 1GB: 80sp VLIW5 (DX11) @ 650 Mhz
HD6450: 160sp VLIW5 (DX11) @ 625 Mhz

So iGPU on the A4-3300 is 36% more powerful than the Power Color HD5450 (160 x 443/80 x 650= 1.36)

And the HD6450 is 4% more powerful than the iGPU on the A4-3420 (160 x 625/160 x 600 = 1.04)

 

[Raduque]

H110 vs H170

- 4 vs 6 SATA 3 ports
- 4 vs 8 max USB 3 ports
- 10 vs 14 USB 2 ports
- Less PCI-E lanes from the chipset - 6 2.0 vs 16 3.0
- No RAID support
- Worse build quality
- Worse VRMs/heatsink(s)

Honestly, the last two are simply down to the motherboard OEM. An OEM known for quality boards is likely going to build a quality H110 board and an OEM known for junk is going to built a junk H110 board.

The rest of your list, ehh... not really something worth losing your mind over. For the an Average User build, if you insist on building, an H110 board is probably perfect in the budget.

We need 10 computers for variety of uses and different settings. 1 computer isn't enough. I don't get what you're saying.

I don't understand the point of needing and attempting to use 10 low-end computers at once! I bet my Xeon server can do all 10 of your tasks in far less time than your 10 individual junky cheap junk could ever wish to do.

 

[escrow4]

Honestly, the last two are simply down to the motherboard OEM. An OEM known for quality boards is likely going to build a quality H110 board and an OEM known for junk is going to built a junk H110 board.

The rest of your list, ehh... not really something worth losing your mind over. For the an Average User build, if you insist on building, an H110 board is probably perfect in the budget.



I don't understand the point of needing and attempting to use 10 low-end computers at once! I bet my Xeon server can do all 10 of your tasks in far less time than your 10 individual junky cheap junk could ever wish to do.

No OEM is going to spend money on H110. They are all junk. H170 has boards with ALC 1150 and good quality caps with the rest - is there even a single H110 board in existence that has ALC 1150 and an Intel NIC and decent build quality?

 

[Shivansps]

No OEM is going to spend money on H110. They are all junk. H170 has boards with ALC 1150 and good quality caps with the rest - is there even a single H110 board in existence that has ALC 1150 and an Intel NIC and decent build quality?

H110 is a LOW cost chipset, you are really expecting top quality audio and Intel NICs?
Compared to H81, the USB 3.0 front header is a nice and needed addon, and thats about it.

Intel Nic starts to show up on some B150, but no ALC 1150.

 

[waltchan]

No OEM is going to spend money on H110. They are all junk. H170 has boards with ALC 1150 and good quality caps with the rest - is there even a single H110 board in existence that has ALC 1150 and an Intel NIC and decent build quality?

Actually, that's not true at all. All the OEM computers I've seen use the lowest-end cheapest chipset they can find. Every new Asus AMD FM2 retail desktops come with A55 chipset (yes, not a joke, despite the higher price), all Dell Inspiron and Acer Aspire desktops come with H81, and etc. Acer was lucky to use A75 chipset than Asus with A55.

 

[maddie]

Just curious. I know that some people have criticized my choices of building entry-level rigs, and some people have mentioned building rigs for other people.

Do you have a "Go to" platform or CPU that you like to recommend to people? Even if you're helping someone pick out a PC at BestBuy and not building, what CPU do you recommend?

I'm curious if everyone else here really recommends i7-6700K to all of their friends and relatives and moms and grandparents.

Or are you willing to go lower on the product stack?

Do you try to perform a needs analysis for the person, to determine the CPU / platform? Or is that too much work to get into, and you just recommend a 6700(K)?

I end up giving away a bunch of systems, so I try to economize as much as possible, while at the same time, delivering an acceptable user experience on the modern web. (So, for example, the rigs I build might play back 1080P videos OK, but not 4K, because most people don't have 4K monitors.) I pretty-much ALWAYS include an SSD, even on the giveaway rigs, and adequate RAM. (RAM's really cheap right now, so that makes it a lot easier to include 4-8GB.)

I don't really have a general "Go to" platform, other than I want something that works with Windows 7 64-bit, Windows 10 64-bit, and Linux Mint (newest version). I shop sales heavily, to find discounted parts.

Its good that you mention Linux Mint. Ran an old AM3 single core sempron (don't ask) recently with a 120GB SSD using Mint as the OS. Was extremely pleasantly surprised.

 

[skipsneeky2]

Last rig i built was for my wife.Slapped in a 180gb ssd,a G1820 with 8gb of ram and a GT740. More then enough for Facebook,Youtube,Netflix and even some gaming.

I wouldn't have a problem suggesting a G1820 build,at least for the email and Facebook checkers.Obviously going Skylake Celeron would be the better option but as a bottom dollar solution the G1820 works just fine.

Gaming well obviously the i3/i5/i7 chips are the only options.

 

[Raduque]

No OEM is going to spend money on H110. They are all junk. H170 has boards with ALC 1150 and good quality caps with the rest - is there even a single H110 board in existence that has ALC 1150 and an Intel NIC and decent build quality?

You're still not thinking of it from the same perspective. For an average user, they don't need (or care about!) the ALC1150, an ALC 892 is good enough. I guess this isn't an Intel NIC? Because that's on the Asrock H110m ITX board (which also has an M.2 slot), but I guess it's just junk regardless.

 

[crashtech]

Actually, that's not true at all. All the OEM computers I've seen use the lowest-end cheapest chipset they can find...

Yeah, this is true. Prebuilts are made to hit certain specs, and most of them have nothing to do with the quality of the chipset. 99.9% of consumers wouldn't know what H110 even was, or know anything about the role of the chipset in a PC.

 

[matricks]

If people ask for advice for a system that will be their primary computer, I have a few pieces of advice I give (which includes SSD and some networking stuff, but question here is CPU).

If a laptop, get an Intel i5 CPU or better. The only reason is that i5 has turbo, i3 and below does not. Look at the first number in the model (i5-5200), make sure to get the newest (highest number), or previous generation if it's more affordable.

If a desktop, same as above, but i3 is OK. Desktop i3 has turbo.

Yes, I am well aware that these will be overkill systems for Facebook and online banking. Keep in mind that this is for someones primary computer - if they're going to do something that requires a computer, this will be the one they use. They're probably not going to replace it before it dies. I don't care if it's overkill for their current use case, the moment they try something out that pushes the limits of the system, they will come to me to complain about my poor recommendation. I can't be bothered. A computer according to the above can deal with most stuff the average person can think of. I do have the luxury that every employed person in this country can afford a i7-6700K every month if they want to, if their spending habits are only somewhat sane.

For specific purpose-systems, e.g. HTPC, professional video editing, gaming, school work, I do research (if I care about helping them).

I'm not an Intel fanboy, I'd recommend AMD as well if their model numbers made sense. With Intel, it's fairly easy to determine basic CPU features (core count, turbo, hyperthreading) without memorizing the entire lineup. I have yet to find any pattern to AMDs current model numbers, and it's easier for both parties if I can give general advice they can apply on their own.

 

[Shivansps]

I think stepping up to quad-core unlocked FM1s, like A6-3670K and A8-3870K, offer a lot of big opportunity here. Price is gradually dropping on eBay, $47.80 and $59.50 respectively. They'll come down soon.

For today's socket, I would say A6-7400K FM2+ fits the bill perfectly. I would avoid A4-7300 because it's FM2, only $10 cheaper than A6-7400K, prone to steep depreciation, and doesn't have Crimson driver. A6-7400K overclocked at 4.0GHz has nearly the same single-thread score with Celeron G1820.

I wanted to report back on this, i just tested the A6-7400K for more of a light gaming oriented starter PC... its AWFUL, a TOTAL AND COMPLETE CRAP, STAY AWAY.

Its seems good, on paper, until you realise its actually a single core with 2 int units, even Windows 10 reports it like that... and 1 float unit for anything reasembling a game is just not enoght, CPU limited on everything...

Minecraft = CPU stuck at 100%

PES 2015 = CPU at 60% and it gets stuck at 100% when they show the stadium, causing massive FPS drop.

GTA V, it takes 30min to load, no joke, because the cpu gets stuck at 100% while loading, on the game it performs the same at 800x600 and 1280x720.

The A4-7300 is better, there is no way around it, a true dual core is needed for light gaming, its a shame that its limited to just 1333.

 

[frozentundra123456]

I wanted to report back on this, i just tested the A6-7400K for more of a light gaming oriented starter PC... its AWFUL, a TOTAL AND COMPLETE CRAP, STAY AWAY.

Its seems good, on paper, until you realise its actually a single core with 2 int units, even Windows 10 reports it like that... and 1 float unit for anything reasembling a game is just not enoght, CPU limited on everything...

Minecraft = CPU stuck at 100%

PES 2015 = CPU at 60% and it gets stuck at 100% when they show the stadium, causing massive FPS drop.

GTA V, it takes 30min to load, no joke, because the cpu gets stuck at 100% while loading, on the game it performs the same at 800x600 and 1280x720.

The A4-7300 is better, there is no way around it, a true dual core is needed for light gaming, its a shame that its limited to just 1333.

Yea, I would put the "dual core", i.e. single module APUs worse than any big core Intel desktop chip, but probably still better than atom or cat cores. None of those three make *any* sense in a desktop though.

 

[beginner99]

Depends on use case. But I guess if you target average non-gamers, Pentiums or i3 are good enough. Since the difference here between a Pentium and i3 in terms of other costs and income is negligible I usually recommend i3. those people will also keep their PCs very long and some added extensions the Pentium lacks or iGPU features can come in handy at some point.

A decade ago i would have recommended don't future proof and overpay because you will get something twice as fast at lower price in couple years anyway. Now this is not true anymore and you can keep your PC 5 years and it's only marginally slower for office and media tasks.

What I tell everyone is to absolutely take a model with SSD, regardless if PC or laptop. It's the most deciding factor for daily use if the PC feels slow or not. For average user, Pentium with SSD over i5/i5 with HDD any day.

What I would not recommend are APUs. I can get double FPS for what here is a marginal amount of money.

 

[cbn]

I wanted to report back on this, i just tested the A6-7400K for more of a light gaming oriented starter PC... its AWFUL, a TOTAL AND COMPLETE CRAP, STAY AWAY.

Its seems good, on paper, until you realise its actually a single core with 2 int units, even Windows 10 reports it like that... and 1 float unit for anything reasembling a game is just not enoght, CPU limited on everything...

(snip)

The A4-7300 is better, there is no way around it, a true dual core is needed for light gaming, its a shame that its limited to just 1333.

Shivansps, both the A6-7400K and the A4-7400 are single module processors.

P.S. A4-7300 can use DDR3 1600---> http://www.cpu-world.com/CPUs/Bulldozer/AMD-A4-Series A4-7300 - AD7300OKA23HL - AD7300OKHLBOX.html

 

[escrow4]

Depends on use case. But I guess if you target average non-gamers, Pentiums or i3 are good enough. Since the difference here between a Pentium and i3 in terms of other costs and income is negligible I usually recommend i3. those people will also keep their PCs very long and some added extensions the Pentium lacks or iGPU features can come in handy at some point.

A decade ago i would have recommended don't future proof and overpay because you will get something twice as fast at lower price in couple years anyway. Now this is not true anymore and you can keep your PC 5 years and it's only marginally slower for office and media tasks.

What I tell everyone is to absolutely take a model with SSD, regardless if PC or laptop. It's the most deciding factor for daily use if the PC feels slow or not. For average user, Pentium with SSD over i5/i5 with HDD any day.

What I would not recommend are APUs. I can get double FPS for what here is a marginal amount of money.

An i3 is a dual-core that tries so hard to be more. Buy a higher clocked i5 if you want something to last (not the abortion that is the i5 6400). The minimum I recommend for a desktop is an i5, the minimum for a laptop is a mobile i5, latest gen. Most would use tech near every day and its a part of their life so saving a $100 or $200 meh.

 

[myocardia]

...

 

[VirtualLarry]

He never mentioned an A4-7400. The A4-7300 that he did mention has two modules that turbo to 4.0 Ghz, while the A6-7400k has one module, that only turbos to 3.6 Ghz. That's the epitome of an easy choice, if you ask me.

Help me understand this. You are saying that the A4-7400K is a single-module, dual-core APU, but the A4-7300 is a dual-module, dual-core? Meaning it would have to be made from a dual-module, quad-core die, but with one core per module disabled?