What takes priority?

[Lemodular]

I always wondered about this.....If you have a drive jumpered to master ans put it on the slave possition on the cable, how would your bios read it? I've always jumpered it correctly or use cable select, so I don't know.

Is there an advantage to actually jumpering a drive rather than cable selecting it?

 

[Zepper]

Position on cable only matters when drives are jumpered to Cable Select and the cable is CS compliant. When using the M/S jumpers, position is irrelevant, though it is customary to place the master at the end of the cable. and the slave in the middle. Some drives are fussy and prefer to be M or S depending on the drive they are paired with - generally setting to CS avoids that issue entirely. I've gone to using only CS and only 80-wire cables as those are all supposed to be CS compliant.

.bh.

:moon:

 

[ribbon13]

Jumpers.

 

[Philippine Mango]

Originally posted by: Zepper
Position on cable only matters when drives are jumpered to Cable Select and the cable is CS compliant. When using the M/S jumpers, position is irrelevant, though it is customary to place the master at the end of the cable. and the slave in the middle. Some drives are fussy and prefer to be M or S depending on the drive they are paired with - generally setting to CS avoids that issue entirely. I've gone to using only CS and only 80-wire cables as those are all supposed to be CS compliant.

.bh.

:moon:

No, 40 conductor wires also are cable select compliant... Even computers as old as 1994 support cable select and that was before 80 conductor wires... All depends whether or not the controller supports that feature.

 

[JimPhelpsMI]

Hi, Jumpers! There is no Master/Slave position on an IDE cable. Any connector can go to the MB or either drive. The floppy is the one with the funny cable with a twist. That is known as Cable Select (CS). You would only use CS if the IDE cable had a twist. MFM drives sometimes used a twist and CS many yrs ago. I have never seen an IDE cable with a twist and I have seen many, many IDE cables. Jim

 

[flightlesscake]

i set my jumper manually on the hard drive. It was default on cable select (maxtor) and I didn't know wth that was and I fear change lol. Set it to master and cd to slave with no probs. So i use jumper although cable select probly is equal since it was the default setting.

 

[Zepper]

Yes, some 40-wire cables are made for cable select, but most aren't. Those that are will be marked: Primary here, Secondary here, Mobo here (or similar) because the 40-wire CS cables were made two different ways (neither of which involves a twist ). Almost all 40-wire CS cables were OEM for one of the big box-pushers like Dell and Compaq. CS makes life easier for the bix box-pushers. ALL 80-wire cables are supposed to be CS thus the color coded connectors: blue to mobo, grey to secondary, black to primary drive. IAC, the drive jumpers definitely control what happens. If you use the M/S jumpers then the CS feature of the cables will be ignored.
. Beware some drives have TWO postitions for Master - one for Master Stand-alone, and the other for Master with Slave. These are usually WD but I have heard of others. This has caused no end of hair pulling.
. What's JP been drinking - that post is an embarrassment of errors... Has anyone ever seen a 40-wire CS cable with a twist? All 80-wire IDE cables are CS compliant - where is the twist? I don need no steenking tweest... :roll:
. The reason FD cables are usually twisted is because Floppy Drives have drive address jumpers or switches - up to four FDs could be attached to one flat cable each with a dedicated select line. The twisted FD cable was done that way because of another big box-pusher, IBM. So the drives could be set all the same way at the OEM's factory and the assemblers wouldn't have to touch the address jumpers/switches. The one on the end will be primary (A) and the one in the middle is secondary (B). More an indictment of IBM's attitude toward its assemblers than anything else.

.bh.

 

[MonkeyWrench4000]

i never used cable select. Master would be on the end of the cable right? Well with a dual hard drive dual optical drive setup, it makes it tricky to get that cable to the HD on the end, and the optical in the middle of the cable. lol. Same goes if your using a single IDE channel setup, with a hard drive and an optical drive. Optical drive is usually all the way up top and the hard drive is usually in the 3.5 inch cage, making it near impossible to have the hard drive on the end of the cable, to be read as master, cause the cable will never get to the cd-rom drive!

I guess thats my reason I use jumpers.

 

[corkyg]

I have used nothing but CSEL for years. Older 40-wire ribbons for CSEL were different and marked. (One of the wires is cut.)

If you use mobile racks or other removable/selectable devices for changing HDDs, CSEL is very useful and prevents a lot of unnecessary mechanical changes. M/S jumpers would have to be physically changed every time a drive change was made.

Unless CSEL is selected on the jumpers, and the cable is of current vintage, the M/S jumpers take priority and position on the cable means nothing.

I have three IDE drives to select from - and all are required to be on CSEL for use with Trios II.

So, this is not a one size fits all choice. It depends on how you are set up. But - when used properly, CSEL is every bit as good and reliable as the old M/S setting.

 

[JimPhelpsMI]

Hi, Twist means that all the leads don't go straight thru. Several are crossed to other pins at one End. Applies to any IDE cable I suggest that Zepper googles for CABLE SELECT and learn something new. CS requires special cables!!!! Jim

 

[corkyg]

Originally posted by: JimPhelpsMI
Hi, Twist means that all the leads don't go straight thru. Several are crossed to other pins at one End. Applies to any IDE cable I suggest that Zepper googles for CABLE SELECT and learn something new. CS requires special cables!!!! Jim

Correct, Jim! I used to have to special order them and the ribbons were stamped CSEL in blue.

 

[VirtualLarry]

Originally posted by: Philippine Mango
No, 40 conductor wires also are cable select compliant... Even computers as old as 1994 support cable select and that was before 80 conductor wires... All depends whether or not the controller supports that feature.

You needed special "cable-select" 40-pin cables. Normal 40-pin cables are not cable-select capable at all, even if you jumper both drives that way.