What was the idea behind windows ME?

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mysticfm

Member
Jun 21, 2004
137
0
0
One thing that hasn't been mentioned yet is that WinME added decent support for WDM drivers, which allow some peripherals to achieve better performance than they can with VxD drivers. This was a particularly big deal to someone like me who used his PC for multitrack digital audio, an area where WDM drivers are much preferable to VxD, which is why I went with WinME rather than 98SE for my last pre-XP machine. In fact I didn't have any major problems with WinME ... it worked pretty well for me on the whole. (It should be noted that, technically, Win98 did have some "support" for WDM drivers, but said support was mostly in name only and failed to work correctly more often than not ... WinME was much better in this regard.)

XP Pro has (for me) proved to be one heck of a big step up from either, though.
 

drag

Elite Member
Jul 4, 2002
8,708
0
0
Originally posted by: minofifa
i live pretty close to blackcomb.... that is kind of neat.

As far as that palladium goes, i don't like the sound of it one ibt. not that i have massive amounts of illegal material on my computer (which i really don't) but i think other people will have too much control over what we use our computers for. Maybe in some situations it would be a good idea but i hope we have a choice.

There are some possitive uses for it. For instance it potentially makes having secure corrispondance over the internet a bit easier. Companies will be able to use it for a little bit extra protection for sensitive documents.

But, ya, mostly trusted computing is about control. Big media enterprises tend to be very anal. For instance music stations are given playlists that they have to use, they use different mixes for different stations. Like on a "alternative" music channel will have a the same song as a "easy rock" station, but they will use a different mix to suite the audiances and such. Everything is about marketting and control.

They know that there is a lot of money aviable in using the internet and electronic media to distribute and sell works, however they want to have the nearly free access to consumers (in comparision to outlet malls, for instance) AND they want the control, which is something nobody has over the internet. So they figure if they control the hardware and the software on your computer, then that's good enough.

Also there are other aspects. For instance in many countries excersize large amounts of control over internet access. It's popular in middle eastern countries to offer relatively cheap internet access, but monitor activity and censor out 'bad' websites. In china every internet connection in and out of the country is controlled and monitored. Breaking rules and circumventing controls that block websites is a very serious crime. DRM/Trusted computing will help keep the governments in control of the information. Even in the EU they want to institute controls to block things like "hate speech" and stuff. I guess the internet is just a bit too free.

But here in the US and many other countries, its just about money and direct marketing scemes. They want your computer to be just like a TV + video game console. You select the items you want to watch, listen to, and play, and that way they can turn around and use that information to target to you customized marketting and get you to buy more stuff. It's similar to the reason why you have supermarkets giving out those discount scan cards... It's to compile information on buying habits and such.

Also once you buy into a product, like a Itunes for instance, you have to use the programs and devices that they allow you to use to enjoy your digital media. It's a bit of a lock-down.

Say you use Office to write a bunch of articles and they are made automaticly with DRM protections... You would have to use Office again to view them, or another aproved and licensed veiwer. If you record a song with a player that uses a certain type of digital protection and share it with friends they have to use similar software or devices to play it.

For instance I made the mistake of buying a 'ebook' type thing, but it was a audio book. My mistake was that it had digital protection on it and it required me to be using Microsoft Windows in order to listen to it.

Well I don't have microsoft Windows and I don't have MS media player. So I go to their website and buried was the disclaimer that it wouldn't work on Linux OSes and they had no desire or plans to make it so that it would work. So I was SOL. I am not going to go out and buy a 200 dollar OS to listen to a 10 dollar book. Pissed me off pretty well.

Similar thing with the DVDs. Most DVDs are region encoded and are encrypted. One kid in Sweden or Norway or something wrote a decrypter so that we could watch DVDs in Linux. He was arrested for it, of course. Luckly he won, he was able to 'prove' his innocence... However because of stuff like DMCA I am technically breaking the law every time I want to watch a movie now in the US, even one that I own.

People have actually gone to court about this.. Judges ruled basicly since it was so well known how to break the DVD encryption, it's not even worth enforcing.. however it didn't mean that it was OK. It's still illegal to go around breaking protected media, and it's still illegal to distribute programs to do it, or even explain teach someone how to do it.

Technically that is. There is still sanity, but if this sort of thing becomes realy accepted then there is no legal way around it.

It's not all doom and gloom, though. pluses and minusses to everything, and their is only a certain amount of control most poeple will subject themselves. Mostly it's the inconvencies that are the most annoying, but thats not all people care about... at least I hope so.

If your curious there is more (and much more accurate ) information at EFF.org. I am working off of memory and half-remembered things, so what I say is probably fairly innaccurate in a few respects.
 

bersl2

Golden Member
Aug 2, 2004
1,617
0
0
Yay for threadjacking!

I for one welcome our new trusted overlords! (yeah right)
 

vanderStoep

Senior member
Mar 1, 2000
333
0
0
I used win 98 fe, SE and win ME quite a lot. I did upgrade most of my 98 machines to ME. It booted faster and had beter colors and stuff. I did find it to be more unstable. If I now instal a windows to an older PC I prefer to install 98 SE.
 

hopejr

Senior member
Nov 8, 2004
841
0
0
drag, just some corrections on what you've said on page 1 of the thread. Whister was XP. 2k3 was .NET. Longhorn is NT 6.0.

Longhorn is supposedly coming out next year with many of it's original planned feature cut out. Microsoft got a bit too excited about LH initially and ended up with mega scope creep. Blackcomb will be out in 2010 apparently.

WinMe was the pits. I've never used such a terrible OS that was written post 1990. I built a brand new computer back in 2001, bought Me OEM for it, and during install, I got a BSoD, not once, but 3 times! It was terrible. The longest uptime I had was about 6 hours, before it would die on me. As soon as XP came out, I switched to that. XP is way better than any previous version of Windows, but I would think it is to 2k what Me was to 98SE (hardly a difference, except in basic look. Not even the version number is very different 5.0 -> 5.1).
I would've installed 2k on that new computer, but I read heaps of reviews saying that 2k is not for home users, so I went Me and regretted it. I also hated the way it was so difficult to get into DOS (I'm a DOS user, well, at least, I started with DOS). I hated it that I couldn't put stuff in autoexec.bat apart from things that would set environment variables, because it would just go and delete everything else out. Very annoying OS.
 

rmrf

Platinum Member
May 14, 2003
2,872
0
0
Originally posted by: hopejr
drag, just some corrections on what you've said on page 1 of the thread. Whister was XP. 2k3 was .NET. Longhorn is NT 6.0.

Actually, that is not correct. Longhorn is NT5.3 and Blackcomb is NT6. Originally Longhorn was just going to be a service pack for XP, with Blackcomb being the next big release, but Longhorn turned out to be much more than that, so now Longhorn is the next release, which some people have been comparing it to WinME, and Blackcomb will be the ground breaking release.
 

hopejr

Senior member
Nov 8, 2004
841
0
0
wanna bet (no, not really, lol), Longhorn is 6.0. I've used both builds 4051 and 4074 and they both show up as NT 6.0 in the about box.
 

rmrf

Platinum Member
May 14, 2003
2,872
0
0
Originally posted by: hopejr
wanna bet (no, not really, lol), Longhorn is 6.0. I've used both builds 4051 and 4074 and they both show up as NT 6.0 in the about box.

Hmm.. actually, now that I have done my research, it seems as if you were right. *DAMMIT*

I did find many papers that referred to longhorn as being the next in line 5.xx M$ product. Could it be they realized that blackcomb was so far off, they were just going to throw the new kernel out there, and use the next 4-5 years to service pack the hell out of it until blackcomb? I don't know, the whole way of thinking over at M$ baffles me, but it probably shouldn't.
 

drag

Elite Member
Jul 4, 2002
8,708
0
0
What is in a name? A rose by any other name will smell just as five point three.



Skipping a version number or two is pretty standard thing to do.

Now with windows XP you could use Windows 2000 drivers in them for many cases, and you could hack up windows 95 to run Windows 98 libraries and programs minus Internet Explorer. Well be able to find out how much of a big step from WinXP to Windows 'longhorn' when it comes and people start to realy mess around with it.

Personally I think that it's a bigger step from XP to 'longhorn' then there was from Windows 2000 to Windows XP.
 

Amaroque

Platinum Member
Jan 2, 2005
2,178
0
0
Originally posted by: madthumbs
-I only had to reboot when installing or updating something.
-Never seen a Dr Watson error on ME, and blue screened only from hardware fault
-Uptime for me was 3 weeks and then only because of accidental reboot. Back then, it was rare for me not to need a reboot for software installs.

I had many more problems with XP in the beginning than ME. I won't call XP crap because of it though.

I had pretty much the same experience with ME. Not really different then 98se IMO. I like 2K, and XP much better, but I think the bad rap ME got is because users who upgraded didn't get what they were expecting...

Therefore they felt ripped off, and proclaimed it garbage in retaliation.

BTW: I've had ME running for anywhere from two to four weeks at a time between reboots.
 

shortylickens

No Lifer
Jul 15, 2003
80,287
17,078
136
Since everyone has said what it was and no one has said what it should have been, I'll step up.

WinME SHOULD have been 98 3rd Edition.
Thats how it should have been developed at the starting block, thats how it should have been ditributed to the end user and thats how it should have been marketed.

But coulda, shoulda, woulda dont feed hungry mouths at M$. Like any other Corp they no longer have an interest in taking care of the customer, they just want to get the next dollar through the door. The product is irrelevent, and in the end its really the honest customer who gets reamed. The poor shmuck who actually shells out $300 for an OS.
Soon we'll be paying $20 if we want the latest service pack for XP or 2003.
And that price will reflect on the shelves at BestBuy too.
 

cubby1223

Lifer
May 24, 2004
13,518
42
86
Microsoft really did a lot of work fixing Windows ME in the years after its initial release, and now I'd say it's worth trusting if you've still got a copy of it.

But I tell ya, my first experience with WinME back in 2000 was horrendous. Two brand new Dells were purchased and both had ME plus all that other garbage that gets pre-loaded. I began to take off some of the software that was not needed (like MS Money for one). During software uninstallation, both machines generated an error, system restore kicked in & restored a copy of the registry from before I began the uninstallation procedures. Both machines were immediately unusable and had to be restored back to the factory install. I generally turn System Restore off even on XP machines. My theory is that if a computer becomes that messed up, it's time to reload Windows regardless.
 

Wolfshanze

Senior member
Jan 21, 2005
767
0
0
Actually you all have it quite wrong.

WinMe should have been Win95 1st Edition.

Win95 was a good idea horribly messed up.

Win95 OSR2, Win98, Win98SE and WinME were all patches to the original Win95.

WinME is really a fully-patched Win95 that works.

The problems with WinMe primarily revolved around the fact it needed a beefy system to run (at the time), and it was not what people expected (I think folks were expecting more of a WinXP experience).

If you look at WinME in a vacuum, it's not that bad of an OS, mostly it received a bad wrap by bad release timing and wrong expectations.

I have a dual-boot 3.0GHz system running both WinME and WinXP. Both run smooth as silk on my system, and I NEED both OS's because there are things that require WinXP, and (believe it or not) things that require WinME that just won't run in XP... ergo I have BOTH OS's on my computer.

In the famous words of a certain character in Roger Rabbit... it's not a bad OS... it was just released that way.
 

halfadder

Golden Member
Dec 5, 2004
1,190
0
0
My school had a shoutcast server running on WinME. The thing had something like 280 days of uptime before a power outage caused a reboot. Several power outages later the thing is still chugging away as good as can be hosting shoutcast for about 3 years now. I haven't used WinME personally, but I know it worked great for that use.
 

Whizzy

Senior member
Oct 11, 1999
258
0
0
"What was the idea behind windows ME?"

Money...

Personally i think its worse than 98 or 2000... or XP for that matter..




 

hopejr

Senior member
Nov 8, 2004
841
0
0
Actually, come to think of it, WinMe ran better on my P2 350 than Win98SE did. It crashed much less. On newer hardware it was bad though.
 

javald

Member
Jan 25, 2005
38
0
0
I think they made it cause they wanted everyone to upgrade and spend more money i have never owned a computer with windows ME but i have used one and it has all sortes of problems so in my opinion no one should have ever believed in it...
 

Harvey

Administrator<br>Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
35,057
60
91
Win 98 SE is far and away more stable and functional than ME. If you remember back far enough, ME was the Windows equivalent of MS-DOS 4, as bloated a beast of DOS as Micro$oft ever produced. ME was a disaster where they tried to patch on a few cute functions, but they sacrificed stablity and real functionality.

MS finally got MS-DOS right in ver. 6.22, where they got everything they < ahem > "borrowed" from DR-DOS right. Aside from not recognizing larger drives, DOS 6.22 was better than DOS 7 (the version of DOS in 98 SE and ME).
 
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