Have you seen the images of just about ANY city in the aftermath of a war?
Bombed out husks. Whether it is Mosul, Raqqa, Aleppo. People flee from violence, or they die by it.
Israel's got virtually all the power in this dynamic not to mention very capable defenses. Kind of looks like they are continuing a policy of collective punishment.
Have you seen the images of just about ANY city in the aftermath of a war?
Bombed out husks. Whether it is Mosul, Raqqa, Aleppo. People flee from violence, or they die by it.
From one conservative to another, please turn off the zionist news networks. They're of course going to always tell you they are the victim.Because they shot israeli's with 400+ Rockets first? I don't know if you have heard of this term in life - I believe it's called "retaliate".
From one conservative to another, please turn off the zionist news networks. They're of course going to always tell you they are the victim.
But you can easily google/youtube Israel bulldozing houses, farms, orchards, firing on fishing boats, sniping people walking down the street. At some point someone is going to say enough is enough and fire off 400+ rockets. Have you ever heard of the narcissist tactic of poking someone until they had enough and when they respond you point fingers at them and say "Look at how horrible they are! Look at how they responded to ME!" to continue to justify their abuse? Israel is a nation full of narcissists. Figure it out, and stop believing the lies.
Collective punishment and the use of excessive force to try and cow the Arabic population into submission. The Jewish lobby (and now the Evangelicals) have a powerful voice in opposing any US effort to get the Israelis to back down. Sadly it's been that way for decades. It's become a vicious circle.
To crush your enemies. See them driven before you. And to hear the lamentations of their women.So just peeking into these goings a bit and...can somebody explain why the Israeli Air Force is blowing up apartment blocs?
Nah, not going to f*ck myself. You think there aren't Jewish groups that lobby the state department, etc.?"The Jewish lobby"
You forgot to say "Zionist" instead.
Go fuck yourself.
Nah, not going to f*ck myself. You think there aren't Jewish groups that lobby the state department, etc.?
Are you living a dream world?
And, they don't work together at all, for their sake and on behalf of Israel? I'm not shifting any goal posts. If the phase 'Jewish Lobby' is racist or something, I didn't know. I do appreciate you knowing my mind better than I do . I wish people on the forum would stop doing that.People who are Jewish being in the business of lobbying is an entirely different thing than a "Jewish lobby." There is no such thing as a "Jewish lobby."
You just shifted the goal posts to make your statement entirely meaningless. Sure, there are people of every ethnic and religious persuasion who are in the lobbying business, but that isn't what you meant.
And, they don't work together at all, for their sake and on behalf of Israel?
I'm not shifting any goal posts. If the phase 'Jewish Lobby' is racist or something, I didn't know. I do appreciate you knowing my mind better than I do . I wish people on the forum would stop doing that.
Who is they? 75% of American Jews voted for Biden in November, despite Trump kissing Netanyahu's ass and moving the embassy to Jerusalem. Similar numbers voted for Obama, in spite of his rocky relationship with Israel.
Give me a break. We hear daily about how people are "dog whistling" racism, but when it comes to anti-Semitism, it's OK to just play dumb?
And, they don't work together at all, for their sake and on behalf of Israel? I'm not shifting any goal posts. If the phase 'Jewish Lobby' is racist or something, I didn't know. I do appreciate you knowing my mind better than I do . I wish people on the forum would stop doing that.
Who is they? 75% of American Jews voted for Biden in November, despite Trump kissing Netanyahu's ass and moving the embassy to Jerusalem. Similar numbers voted for Obama, in spite of his rocky relationship with Israel.
Give me a break. We hear daily about how people are "dog whistling" racism, but when it comes to anti-Semitism, it's OK to just play dumb?
There's nothing anti-semitic about being opposed to the Israeli govt's unjust treatment of its Palestinian neighbors.
I can see a plausible case for confusion about how some people might classify the Zionists that lobby the government on behalf of the state of Israel, some of whom are quite hardline. Yes they're Jews but describing them as the Jewish Lobby is problematic at best since it's not like they represent all (or even most) Jews and that language is often utilized by antisemitics.
I see no room for confusion whatsoever. People who lobby for Israel lobby for Israel. They aren't lobbying on behalf of "the Jews." How much simpler can that be?
Normally I'd agree but I had almost this very conversation with somebody IRL a couple weeks ago and I basically saw the lightbulb go on over their head. If a person persists in using the term after understanding the distinction then feel free to judge and I know I would.
I don't disagree. However, I find that it helps to understand that the British and American interests that helped create the state of Israel did not do so out of any love or concern for the Jewish people. They did it for essentially the same reason that Liberia was created. And also that America does not continue to send billions of dollars to the Israeli govt for any reason but to be able to maintain a strategic beachhead in the area.No one said there was anything inherently anti-semitic about criticizing Israel. There are, however, some anti-semites among those who criticize Israel, and they generally do not forthrightly admit to it. They dog whistle instead.
I don't disagree. However, I find that it helps to understand that the British and American interests that helped create the state of Israel did not do so out of any love or concern for the Jewish people. They did it for essentially the same reason that Liberia was created. And also that America does not continue to send billions of dollars to the Israeli govt for any reason but to be able to maintain a strategic beachhead in the area.
The problem is that in creating a nationalist homeland for a specific group of people, under the presumed guise of protecting that people from the past abuses of nationalism, we have simply perpetuated those abuses onto yet another group of people.
And if you stop to think about it, there's really nothing quite more illiberal than creating a homeland for only one group of people by kicking another group of people off their lands. But that was done, and here we are, dealing with the inevitable consequences.. still.
To the extent any were "kicked out," it happened in the midst of an invasion by four surrounding Arab states. And only half left. The other half remained.
This is the problem with these discussions. The history is rich with facts and there is no way to address it properly with these kinds of sound bite social media posts.
An invasion of what though? In the lead up to the declaration of the State of Israel, those doing the declaring were busy waging a dirty war against the British (fair game, the British were an occupying foreign power) and against their Arab neighbors with the explicit intent of driving the Arabs out or subjugating them (both intents fulfilled with the creation of the subsequent Israeli apartheid state). The neighboring states acted in the context of the known intent of the self-declared leaders of the new Israeli state.To the extent any were "kicked out," it happened in the midst of an invasion by four surrounding Arab states. And only half left. The other half remained.
This is the problem with these discussions. The history is rich with facts and there is no way to address it properly with these kinds of sound bite social media posts.