Whats the future of the apple ecosystem

Naer

Diamond Member
Nov 28, 2013
3,290
136
106
I have to pick a street. Half my products are apple half android and pc

Is apple a safe bet?
 

postmortemIA

Diamond Member
Jul 11, 2006
7,721
40
91
for full scale lock-in, it is. With next OSX there will be pretty good integration with iOS devices, but not much with competing products.

Never put all your eggs in one basket.
 

mmntech

Lifer
Sep 20, 2007
17,504
12
0
Apple has been a safe bet for a long time now. All their products are tightly integrated and they don't share the same fragmentation issues Android has. If you do need Windows, every recent Mac can run it. Where as most PCs cannot run OS X.

The biggest threat to Apple right now is becoming stagnant. Since they are a "luxury" brand that commands a luxury price. Since Jobs' death, I think they've already lost their luster. Especially if that grating fitness commercial of theirs is any indication.
 

sm625

Diamond Member
May 6, 2011
8,172
137
106
I always wondered if anyone would even care if Apple openly admitted that it was completely capturing every bit of data you send and receive. With the recent revelations (Zdziarski et al) we are moving dangerously close to that point.

This company, with its billions in cash, is in a position to exploit user data. Imagine you are a small company using Apple products to conduct technical discussions of an upcoming design. And Apple gets its hands on that discussion, and uses their enormous wealth to front run a patent. The implications are absolutely incredible. But what is even more incredible is the sheep like willingness to tolerate anything even remotely like this in the marketplace. Will that sheeplike tolerance continue? You have to believe it will in order to believe their ecosystem has a future.
 

TheStu

Moderator<br>Mobile Devices & Gadgets
Moderator
Sep 15, 2004
12,089
45
91
I always wondered if anyone would even care if Apple openly admitted that it was completely capturing every bit of data you send and receive. With the recent revelations (Zdziarski et al) we are moving dangerously close to that point.

This company, with its billions in cash, is in a position to exploit user data. Imagine you are a small company using Apple products to conduct technical discussions of an upcoming design. And Apple gets its hands on that discussion, and uses their enormous wealth to front run a patent. The implications are absolutely incredible. But what is even more incredible is the sheep like willingness to tolerate anything even remotely like this in the marketplace. Will that sheeplike tolerance continue? You have to believe it will in order to believe their ecosystem has a future.

People are more than willing to keep using Google's services, and Facebook's.

I read about the back-doors (nice of you to include the links that support your FUD), and although they could be a cause for concern is there any actual evidence that Apple is even thinking about doing this terrible thing that you say that they could do (collecting user data en masse, sorting through all of this user data, identifying potentially valuable ideas, writing up and then applying for patents for said ideas). You understand the sheer work involved with that... right? There are 600mil+ iDevices out there.

Gosh, I sure hope you've destroyed the iDevice that you hate so much (and yet you bought it) so that they can't think about maybe stealing all your data.
 

mmntech

Lifer
Sep 20, 2007
17,504
12
0
People are more than willing to keep using Google's services, and Facebook's.

I read about the back-doors (nice of you to include the links that support your FUD), and although they could be a cause for concern is there any actual evidence that Apple is even thinking about doing this terrible thing that you say that they could do (collecting user data en masse, sorting through all of this user data, identifying potentially valuable ideas, writing up and then applying for patents for said ideas). You understand the sheer work involved with that... right? There are 600mil+ iDevices out there.

Gosh, I sure hope you've destroyed the iDevice that you hate so much (and yet you bought it) so that they can't think about maybe stealing all your data.

Not only that, businesses would drop Apple devices faster than if they were on fire. I believe it's also illegal.
 

JackBurton

Lifer
Jul 18, 2000
15,993
14
81
I always wondered if anyone would even care if Apple openly admitted that it was completely capturing every bit of data you send and receive. With the recent revelations (Zdziarski et al) we are moving dangerously close to that point.

This company, with its billions in cash, is in a position to exploit user data. Imagine you are a small company using Apple products to conduct technical discussions of an upcoming design. And Apple gets its hands on that discussion, and uses their enormous wealth to front run a patent. The implications are absolutely incredible. But what is even more incredible is the sheep like willingness to tolerate anything even remotely like this in the marketplace. Will that sheeplike tolerance continue? You have to believe it will in order to believe their ecosystem has a future.

Are you talking about the Android sheep? Because if there is any company that is going to capture data, it will be Google. Why? Because they are the best at collecting data. They've been crunching your data since their inception.

As for Apple, there is no better ecosystem than the new OSX Yosemite and iOS 8. It is such a seamless experience and one that the competition will be VERY hard pressed to duplicate. If you want tight integration and a seamless experience, you don't get any better than Apple. If you want something else, well, there are the others.
 

smackababy

Lifer
Oct 30, 2008
27,024
79
86
I am really confused at people constantly claiming Apple is on the verge of capturing all your data and that Android (created and maintained by a company already capturing all your data) is the answer.
 

KeithP

Diamond Member
Jun 15, 2000
5,660
198
106
I have to pick a street. Half my products are apple half android and pc

Is apple a safe bet?

Why do you have to "pick a street". As long as the services you want to use are available on both platforms what is wrong with mixing and matching?

I have an Android phone, an iPad and a MacBook Pro where I use both OS X and Windows 7. The only issue that I have run into is that I purchased some TV shows on iTunes some time ago which I can't use on the other platforms. However, I knew this going in and have since decided to not do it in future. I will just rip what I need.

Overall, it works well.

-KeithP
 

smackababy

Lifer
Oct 30, 2008
27,024
79
86
Why do you have to "pick a street". As long as the services you want to use are available on both platforms what is wrong with mixing and matching?

I have an Android phone, an iPad and a MacBook Pro where I use both OS X and Windows 7. The only issue that I have run into is that I purchased some TV shows on iTunes some time ago which I can't use on the other platforms. However, I knew this going in and have since decided to not do it in future. I will just rip what I need.

Overall, it works well.

-KeithP
Because, as is displayed very often in the console gaming section, one cannot be reasonable and own both competing side's products. Having a PS4 and an Xbox One is simply unpossible! You must pick a side and stick with, otherwise, you can't equate your value as a person with the value of a particular company, thus rendering you worthless!
 

TheStu

Moderator<br>Mobile Devices & Gadgets
Moderator
Sep 15, 2004
12,089
45
91
Because, as is displayed very often in the console gaming section, one cannot be reasonable and own both competing side's products. Having a PS4 and an Xbox One is simply unpossible! You must pick a side and stick with, otherwise, you can't equate your value as a person with the value of a particular company, thus rendering you worthless!

Well, especially in the case of the consoles, it's not like they are super cheap. My soon-to-be roommate has a PS4, which makes things easier for me, since I really want both (Halo).

In the case of these sorts of things... constantly switching devices can add up in cost, or at the very least in the time involved with selling and buying, and setting up the systems fresh. And I use system loosely to also cover phones, tablets, whatever.
 

sxr7171

Diamond Member
Jun 21, 2002
5,079
40
91
I always wondered if anyone would even care if Apple openly admitted that it was completely capturing every bit of data you send and receive. With the recent revelations (Zdziarski et al) we are moving dangerously close to that point.

This company, with its billions in cash, is in a position to exploit user data. Imagine you are a small company using Apple products to conduct technical discussions of an upcoming design. And Apple gets its hands on that discussion, and uses their enormous wealth to front run a patent. The implications are absolutely incredible. But what is even more incredible is the sheep like willingness to tolerate anything even remotely like this in the marketplace. Will that sheeplike tolerance continue? You have to believe it will in order to believe their ecosystem has a future.

Sure this is true but at least Apple needs to sell product and for that reason would be loathsome to use user data for overtly nefarious purposes. With Google they don't really even have to care. They make great "free" products that people use. People even know from the outset that their data will be used for profitable purposes when they use Google services.

I would rather not give out all that data but it is necessary to participate in the modern software conveniences that everyone uses. I would say giving data to Apple is safer than giving it to Google. I would have MS also until I found out they snooped on a Hotmail account to nail a guy. I would also be comfortable with my data in Amazon's hands also as they need you to buy stuff from them to be profitable (one day). You have to pick one and Apple is lesser evil than some of the others.

Amazon is good one because it lets you switch your hardware/OS at will. But for that you get a less integrated system.
 

mmntech

Lifer
Sep 20, 2007
17,504
12
0
I am really confused at people constantly claiming Apple is on the verge of capturing all your data and that Android (created and maintained by a company already capturing all your data) is the answer.

Yep. That's how Google makes their money. They don't put their software out for free as a charity initiative.

Android's laissez faire software policy can be a double edged sword too. It's great not having limits to the kinds of apps your device can run. At the same time, they're not as rigorously checked for bugs and security flaws. It's vulnerable to viruses, and IIRC, some shadier apps were skimming personal data without the user's knowledge or consent. Apple is still pretty rigorous when it comes to their approval process. They want the "walled garden" to feel secure.

Of course if you're really concerned/paranoid about security, you don't buy either. You get a BlackBerry 10 device. Which I'm actually seriously considering.
 

joshhedge

Senior member
Nov 19, 2011
601
0
0
Currently locked myself into the Apple ecosystem completely with the purchase of the iPhone 5S. Contract expired, didn't want to wait for the 6 as I smashed my previous phone screen in the lab. IOS8 and Yosemite's hand-off features are what really sealed the deal. It's been weird going from a 4.7" device to a 4" device, and maybe it's a bit too small, 4.3-4.5" would have been ideal however nothing I've used before has felt as rapid and fluid as the 5S.
 

vbuggy

Golden Member
Nov 13, 2005
1,610
0
71
Never put all your eggs in one basket.

Unless you do with Apple - and it's uniquely for Apple - you're going to have a bad time, in that a lot of your time is going to be spent figuring out how to twist one Apple software / service / product into doing something it's not intended to.
 
Feb 25, 2011
16,822
1,493
126
Unless you do with Apple - and it's uniquely for Apple - you're going to have a bad time, in that a lot of your time is going to be spent figuring out how to twist one Apple software / service / product into doing something it's not intended to.
It's good practice for working in a mixed Linux/Windows environment.
 

Kaido

Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
Feb 14, 2004
48,518
5,340
136
for full scale lock-in, it is. With next OSX there will be pretty good integration with iOS devices, but not much with competing products.

Never put all your eggs in one basket.

I dunno, I have plenty of friends who are waist-deep in the Apple ecosystem & are perfectly happen there - Airports, Time Capsules, iMacs, iPhones, iPads, Apple TV's, etc. Gives them a fairly hassle-free residential computing experience! :thumbsup:
 
Feb 25, 2011
16,822
1,493
126
I dunno, I have plenty of friends who are waist-deep in the Apple ecosystem & are perfectly happen there - Airports, Time Capsules, iMacs, iPhones, iPads, Apple TV's, etc. Gives them a fairly hassle-free residential computing experience! :thumbsup:
It is nice - until you want just that one little thing that Apple didn't design to accommodate, or you want to do it for a fair price.

RAID-1 on a time capsule, for instance. (Sorry, no, but we can totally sell you a Mac Mini server and a Thunderbolt drive enclosure!)

Or somebody buys you a Kindle for Christmas.

Or you decide you don't really want to spend $100+ on an Apple TV for the workout room, but a Chromecast is within budget and would work better with a wall-mounted TV anyway.

Etc.

IMO, it's better to get used to making things work with stuff and things, so you can things the stuff you things when you stuff them. Android, et al, are always going to be relatively accommodating of open standards, and Apple stuff will be accommodating enough of those same standards that they can work as a gateway drug. The rest is education.
 
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vbuggy

Golden Member
Nov 13, 2005
1,610
0
71
It's good practice for working in a mixed Linux/Windows environment.

The problem is that the moment you introduce one Apple thing in a heterogeneous system, it creates deliberate complications due to Apple's approach where you end up:

a) Waving a white flag and going all Apple if you actually want to get anything done instead of futzing with solutions that will break inevitably the time Apple has the next update
b) Tossing out the Apple trinket for something better

And the real problem is that especially in terms of home entertainment, the most plausible solutions are front-ended by the iPad (and also increasingly the Mac) these days, and many makers often just refuse to support anything else.

So b) just isn't a viable option in many cases especially if you're at the high end, you just can't avoid Apple stuff - so it's no wonder a lot of people end up going the a) route. Even for me, iPads essentially run my homes. And I even have an entirely separate, Extreme / Express wireless network for my Apple hardware since they can't hold a stable signal to my regular AP's (which even the - if you believe the largely iObsessed tech press, supposedly wireless-issue-plagued - Surface Pro 2 works fine on).
 
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weevilone

Member
Jun 24, 2012
135
0
76
It is nice - until you want just that one little thing that Apple didn't design to accommodate, or you want to do it for a fair price.

RAID-1 on a time capsule, for instance. (Sorry, no, but we can totally sell you a Mac Mini server and a Thunderbolt drive enclosure!)

There are plenty of other devices on the market that will accommodate RAID1 on a NAS and not disrupt anything about the Apple ecosystem. No, it might not be the same color but that's about it. There has to be some caution taken to ensure that time machine will work with whatever you buy, but it's not like it doesn't happen. My approach is a bit convoluted because I owned the device before I came about needing for the specific application, so it's not time machine compatible. I run Crashplan locally to a RAID1 device, then do time machine to an internal drive simply for quick and easy file recovery. Sure, it might waste a bit of space but it works.
 

vbuggy

Golden Member
Nov 13, 2005
1,610
0
71
Every rabid Machead says that. And then when you pick up something it's 'Oh yeah it totally works, but...'.
 
Feb 25, 2011
16,822
1,493
126
There are plenty of other devices on the market that will accommodate RAID1 on a NAS and not disrupt anything about the Apple ecosystem. No, it might not be the same color but that's about it. There has to be some caution taken to ensure that time machine will work with whatever you buy, but it's not like it doesn't happen. My approach is a bit convoluted because I owned the device before I came about needing for the specific application, so it's not time machine compatible. I run Crashplan locally to a RAID1 device, then do time machine to an internal drive simply for quick and easy file recovery. Sure, it might waste a bit of space but it works.
Right. But that's the point - you have to fiddle a little bit to make the non-apple stuff work with the apple stuff.
 

mmntech

Lifer
Sep 20, 2007
17,504
12
0
Currently locked myself into the Apple ecosystem completely with the purchase of the iPhone 5S. Contract expired, didn't want to wait for the 6 as I smashed my previous phone screen in the lab. IOS8 and Yosemite's hand-off features are what really sealed the deal. It's been weird going from a 4.7" device to a 4" device, and maybe it's a bit too small, 4.3-4.5" would have been ideal however nothing I've used before has felt as rapid and fluid as the 5S.

I'm still rocking the 4S. Contract expires in the fall but I'll probably go with an unlocked phone this time around. I had a 3G before, as well as the iPad 1 and iPad 3rd Gen. So I've been locked into Apple for awhile.

I don't really use my phone for any heavy lifting anymore. So I might look into the 5S, or 6C if there is one. I've also been checking out the Nexus 5, BB Z10, and OnePlus One.
 

weevilone

Member
Jun 24, 2012
135
0
76
Right. But that's the point - you have to fiddle a little bit to make the non-apple stuff work with the apple stuff.

I only had to fiddle because I bought a product that wasn't compatible with Time Machine. If you know your needs going in, it's not a huge deal. But sure, if you run all Apple then you don't even need to read the box.
 

CptObvious

Platinum Member
Mar 5, 2004
2,500
1
76
I have a Moto G, iPad Air, and PC. I don't have any problems between the three keeping my contacts/calendars synced. I think ecosystem is far less of a factor than it was a few years ago. The practical differences between Android/iOS have shrunken to a point of being negligible. I say just buy what you like (I bought the Moto based on price and the iPad based on screen quality/color calibration)
 
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