I know literally zero people who would cross shop these two vehicles.
AWD is terribly overrated.haha i only considered it because they're both AWD, and i had a forester coworker and model Y coworker each extolling their relative virtues
for the kind of driving i do though (long multi-day trips, sometimes on crap roads in the middle of nowhere) i think the subaru makes more sense
but i haven't test driven any comparable options, so i'll need to do that when conditions are more favorable for buyers
AWD is terribly overrated.
I suppose that depends on where you live, where I used to live in the Midwest it was very helpful. And I do mean specifically down to neighborhoods and streets, with regard to hills, how often routes are plowed, etc. It's not a panacea, but it sure made my life easier. I drove in the same conditions in FWD cars and RWD cars with snow tires as well.AWD is terribly overrated.
I suppose that depends on where you live, where I used to live in the Midwest it was very helpful. And I do mean specifically down to neighborhoods and streets, with regard to hills, how often routes are plowed, etc. It's not a panacea, but it sure made my life easier. I drove in the same conditions in FWD cars and RWD cars with snow tires as well.
I'm not sure what you'd be looking for in a car but you can get cheaper than a Tesla Y. The EV6 looks pretty good and is ~$17k less than the Tesla Y. Still more expensive than a Forrester but there are some other benefits too like the much better warranty. When we looked in 2019 the Subaru features offered were sparse as well but how much that matters depends on what you want. Plus Subarus (WRX and maybe a few high end trims aside) tend to be very boring to drive and sluggish. And I say that as a Camry owner. My wife loves her Subaru but I don't see us getting another one
lol it's true
anti-EV posts have been all the rage on my local small town facebook group
shoot they even make fun of people who drive hybrids
real muricans drive 15 mpg vehicles 30 miles to work one way
I don't get the anti EV people either, and they always have the same old arguments too such as the cost to replace the battery. That's more of a right to repair issue than an EV issue. Most defective batteries could be fixed instead of replaced if they provided parts/service. They also like to bring up one time environmental impacts like building the car, while ignoring the continuous environmental impact of gas.
The only thing I'm NOT a fan of is that it seems EVs are always "connected" and have excessive electronics and it seems they almost require to use apps for stuff, but not sure if that's the case, I think some stuff is doable without apps right? I don't like that crap, I don't want my products calling to the mothership, or the fact that they can be remotely disabled or modified etc. But nothing stops them from doing that to gas cars too and it will probably come.
My biggest argument against EVs now is the cost. I just can't justify it even with the gas savings. I do hope they come down in price or become mainstream, so that they can eventually trickle down to the used market. Right now they are basically a premium niche product and have the price tag that comes with that.
Right now if I was to buy I'd probably be looking at the Hyunday Ioniq 5. I priced one off their site and it would come up to around 70k if I recall. That's the AWD model. I don't know how well the 2WD model would do here. Even in my truck I find myself having to put it in 4x4 a lot, especially at stop signs so I can take off again.
AWD is terribly overrated.
It can be but even taking that into account EVs are so much better for the human race and planet as a whole its incredible. We're just used to the oil spills, human death, destruction and suffering around oil control, smog and pollutants everywhere that it fades into the background. Even if it were remotely close to even - its a lot easier to clean up the mining practices compared to vehicle exhaust as mining activities are a tad more concentrated than literally anywhere on any road where a ICE car can be polluting.By far the biggest problem with EV's has nothing to do with the vehicles themselves. Not saying that ICE vehicles are not even worse overall but mining for resources to make batteries is a serious problem.
Yeah, I guess that's fair, I was interpreting it as "AWD is overrated" = "not that useful", and I suppose for the people you're describing that could be true. I never regretted my decision, and sold it when I moved where the snow is more of a rarity and the area pretty much shuts down when it does snowMy old driveway was a decently steep hill — more than once my AWD 3-series made short work of it while my wife’s FWD Volt wouldn’t move an inch. Both on identical Blizzak snow tires. My trick was to turn around and reverse it up the hill so that weight moved to the drive wheels. I drive RWD cars now and she drives AWD so I guess that was important to one of us.
I think the point was that many people really want AWD and the vast majority of them will never or extremely rarely see conditions like that to need it. My friend in SF is a good example .. he was just car shopping and AWD was high on his list of wants for some reason. Pretty much only good for a 5%+ fuel economy hit in most cases.
It can be but even taking that into account EVs are so much better for the human race and planet as a whole its incredible. We're just used to the oil spills, human death, destruction and suffering around oil control, smog and pollutants everywhere that it fades into the background. Even if were remotely close to even - its a lot easier to clean up the mining practices compared to vehicle exhaust mining activities are a tad more concentrated than literally anywhere on any road where a ICE car can be polluting.
(Article looks at manufacturing (including battery), use and then recycling\scrapping vehicle)
Electric cars have much lower life cycle emissions, new study confirms
In the US, life cycle emissions for EVs are already 60-68% lower than gasoline.arstechnica.com
While I agree with your intent of the post, we aren't quite there yet. 60% of electricity is still from fossil fuels: mostly natural gas, coal, and oil. So, EVs are still mostly subject to spills, human death, destruction and suffering around fossil fuel control, smog, pollutants, etc. It just is more hidden from view unless you drive by a power plant.It can be but even taking that into account EVs are so much better for the human race and planet as a whole its incredible. We're just used to the oil spills, human death, destruction and suffering around oil control, smog and pollutants everywhere that it fades into the background. Even if it were remotely close to even - its a lot easier to clean up the mining practices compared to vehicle exhaust as mining activities are a tad more concentrated than literally anywhere on any road where a ICE car can be polluting.
AWD is terribly overrated.
Driven FWD vehicles my whole life, including in ski country. I got along just fine without ever getting stuck. Came close to being stuck a single time: trying to leave a space in a poorly plowed and somewhat slushy lot, but rocked the car out of the space, and I had a snow shovel in the trunk if it really came to that.Unless you live where it snows a lot in which case it totally rocks.
I clearly recall stopping in the middle of steep, icy upgrades just for the sheer joy of easily starting again in my last Subaru. (I've owned 4 and all but the ancient GL Wagon from my dad went over 200k)
In Maine/Vermont ski-country I swear every 3rd car is a Subaru and with good reason. When things get rough out there a Subaru WILL get you through even when most other AWD cars are hopelessly stuck. (the exceptions being Audi and believe it or not Mazda)
This needs some explanation. How is AWD overrated? I'd never own a car without it at this point unless I have 4wd.
Driven FWD vehicles my whole life, including in ski country. I got along just fine without ever getting stuck. Came close to being stuck a single time: trying to leave a space in a poorly plowed and somewhat slushy lot, but rocked the car out of the space, and I had a snow shovel in the trunk if it really came to that.
Sure, that's probably true, but it doesn't mean that AWD is still not overrated. It can help in some small use cases, but people act like FWD vehicles simply cannot operate in snowy weather and also act like AWD is some impenetrable shield against shitty road conditions.I can tell you with absolute 100% certainty that AWD handles better in snow then 2WD with equal tires and drivers.
AWD only helps a little while driving. AWD is absolutely necessary once you have spun off the road.Sure, that's probably true, but it doesn't mean that AWD is still not overrated. It can help in some small use cases, but people act like FWD vehicles simply cannot operate in snowy weather and also act like AWD is some impenetrable shield against shitty road conditions.
with equal tires and drivers.
AWD only helps a little while driving. AWD is absolutely necessary once you have spun off the road.
AWD only helps a little while driving. AWD is absolutely necessary once you have spun off the road.
There's a few times this year where I was glad I had my truck and 4x4. My city is not on the ball with plowing anymore it seems. Quite a few times where my street had a good foot or so of snow in it.
I kind of hope that EV trucks eventually become obtainable as ideally that's what I want, but I will probably settle for a non truck at some point as I want an EV either way. Hyundai Ioniq AWD model is probably the best contender. I'd want to make sure I can get a tow hitch on it, and maybe a lift kit if something like that is available, then get a trailer and I can basically do everything I can with the truck. I don't need the truck so much for the power, but for ability to haul, and also have decent ground clearance in the bush, or even in the city after a snow fall.