When people say the power of prayer saves lives...

[Mai72]

Just came across the Nina Pham article. Seems people are upset because she thanked God for saving her life, but in reality it was the medical staff, and science that saved her from an awful death. In reality, she would have died.

http://www.thepoliticalinsider.com/nurse-cured-ebola-thanks-god-atheists-furious/

Just curious. Where was God when...

Pol Pot killed 1.5m Cambodians.
Hitler murdered 6m Jews
The Spanish Empire wiped out the Aztecs, Mayans, and Incas
Stalin murdered 20-50m of his own people
America nearly wiped out the indigenous peoples of North America
Nearly 10 thousand people have died from Ebola this year alone

I could go on. The point I'm trying to make is if there is a God why didn't he/she do anything to save these poor people? Why is her life more important than 6m Jews? It just seems crazy when people like Ms. Pham makes those type of statements.

 

[lxskllr]

Amazing how it all falls apart with a five year old's logic, eh?

 

[Jeff7]

- God works in mysterious ways/we can't understand the mind of God, etc.
- Suffering is awesome and good and such.
- Sinners and Satan are responsible.
- They might be in Heaven now and away from any Earthly suffering, so it's actually ok.
- Aliens.

Amazing how it all falls apart with a five year old's logic, eh?

I was looking at various tornado vids on Youtube, and one of them was an interview of a woman who survived the Joplin tornado. (It's incredible what happened to that town...just absolutely devastated.) Then there were more storms threatening the area. She of course thanked God.
It's like having a guy wander through your school, kill 150 people, and then those he doesn't kill line up to thank him for his kindness as he's leaving.




What keeps coming to mind is "Stockholm Syndrome."

 

[Mai72]

Amazing how it all falls apart with a five year old's logic, eh?

I'd like to hear from someone who believes in God.

Yes, it's a simplistic view. I've brought this up to people who believe in God and normally most become angry. :'(

 

[lxskllr]

I was looking at various tornado vids on Youtube, and one of them was an interview of a woman who survived the Joplin tornado. (It's incredible what happened to that town...just absolutely devastated.) Then there were more storms threatening the area. She of course thanked God.
It's like having a guy wander through your school, kill 150 people, and then those he doesn't kill line up to thank him for his kindness as he's leaving.




What keeps coming to mind is "Stockholm Syndrome."

I AM GOD!!! I love all of my creations... Well, except you, you, and that motherfucker over there. You cocksuckers can go right to hell :^D

 

[Mai72]

I AM GOD!!! I love all of my creations... Well, except you, you, and that motherfucker over there. You cocksuckers can go right to hell :^D

Bwahaha.. Good one.

 

[MagnusTheBrewer]

Free will is a bitch! So, tell me. When is it "ok" for people to die. When it's old age? How old is old age? Is it alright for just bad people to die? Who decides? Should we all just die at the same age? Again, who decides? I'm not sure if your muddy thinking has led you to believe that God doesn't exist or, that he's evil. Maybe you could explain your thinking more clearly.

 

[Markbnj]

Free will is a bitch! So, tell me. When is it "ok" for people to die. When it's old age? How old is old age? Is it alright for just bad people to die? Who decides? Should we all just die at the same age? Again, who decides? I'm not sure if your muddy thinking has led you to believe that God doesn't exist or, that he's evil. Maybe you could explain your thinking more clearly.

People attribute the good things to divine intervention, but ignore the bad things. It's pretty interesting, actually, because when we had a pantheon of gods you could find one who was responsible for good things, and then when something bad happened you could find a reason why some other god was responsible. I wonder why Christians don't tend to blame Satan directly when bad things happen? He tempts the faithful and exerts all sorts of negative influences, but when a blight strikes the crops you don't hear Christians blaming him. I assume it's because if you allow him agency over every day events then that opens the door to acknowledging that agency and placating him with worship and sacrifice. So instead he is just sort of the embodiment of bad.

 

[GagHalfrunt]

Free will is a bitch! So, tell me. When is it "ok" for people to die. When it's old age? How old is old age? Is it alright for just bad people to die? Who decides? Should we all just die at the same age? Again, who decides? I'm not sure if your muddy thinking has led you to believe that God doesn't exist or, that he's evil. Maybe you could explain your thinking more clearly.

First lets gauge the level of your delusions

Does your invisible man in the sky have a plan? yes or no
Does your invisible man in the sky change that plan due to prayers? yes or no

 

[Jeff7]

People attribute the good things to divine intervention, but ignore the bad things. It's pretty interesting, actually, because when we had a pantheon of gods you could find one who was responsible for good things, and then when something bad happened you could find a reason why some other god was responsible. I wonder why Christians don't tend to blame Satan directly when bad things happen? He tempts the faithful and exerts all sorts of negative influences, but when a blight strikes the crops you don't hear Christians blaming him. I assume it's because if you allow him agency over every day events then that opens the door to acknowledging that agency and placating him with worship and sacrifice. So instead he is just sort of the embodiment of bad.

It would also require acknowledgement that the allegedly benevolent God intentionally permits this evil entity to move about upon his most prized speck of dust, commonly called Earth, in the Universe.

 

[GagHalfrunt]

It would also require acknowledgement that the allegedly benevolent God intentionally permits this evil entity to move about upon his most prized speck of dust, commonly called Earth, in the Universe.

“Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent.
Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent.
Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?”
― Epicurus

 

[MagnusTheBrewer]

People attribute the good things to divine intervention, but ignore the bad things. It's pretty interesting, actually, because when we had a pantheon of gods you could find one who was responsible for good things, and then when something bad happened you could find a reason why some other god was responsible. I wonder why Christians don't tend to blame Satan directly when bad things happen? He tempts the faithful and exerts all sorts of negative influences, but when a blight strikes the crops you don't hear Christians blaming him. I assume it's because if you allow him agency over every day events then that opens the door to acknowledging that agency and placating him with worship and sacrifice. So instead he is just sort of the embodiment of bad.

Some folks do think in that manner. I think it's simpler than that. People desperately want to make deals with divinity, to exert influence over divinity, when we are helpless over everything but, our own decisions and behavior.

 

[MagnusTheBrewer]

First lets gauge the level of your delusions

Does your invisible man in the sky have a plan? yes or no
Does your invisible man in the sky change that plan due to prayers? yes or no

Regardless of my beliefs, what makes you think you're capable of judging me or God?

“Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent.
Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent.
Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?”
― Epicurus

Epicurus was guilty of false reasoning. He seeks to judge God as we judge humans. He even tries to use a logical fallacy to do it.

 

[Thebobo]

I'd like to hear from someone who believes in God.

Yes, it's a simplistic view. I've brought this up to people who believe in God and normally most become angry. :'(

Well no shit they would be angry.

 

[Imp]

What?

Are you telling me that the power of Christ doesn't compel you people?

 

[John Connor]

Where was Satan?

 

[Proprioceptive]

Prayer is a symbolic gesture... mostly a medium for humility and remembrance. I don't believe that prayer directly influences any earthly "happenings" whether positive or negative. The whole point of us being here is to experience free will and gain a physical body... beyond that we're getting into some deep religious crap. The vast majority of all religious activity is based in symbolism. Now, if one were to witness an authentic miracle... and I believe I have, then who am I to judge why? I don't make those calls nor do I believe I"m capable of such a judgement. Free will allows evil things to happen, otherwise it's not exactly free will. Why certain things happen is something I choose not to worry about. I just understand that shit happens and good happens. I view God as a parent (believe he is as well) allowing his children to make their own decisions and learn from their mistakes all the while stepping in when necessary. Just because my children behave badly does not make me malevolent or less relevant.

 

[Proprioceptive]

Oh yeah... and because it's hilarious, I present the obligatory video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rIDrmYyfWe8

 

[ImpulsE69]

People pray to God because they can't bare to think they are responsible for their own lives.

 

[Mai72]

Oh yeah... and because it's hilarious, I present the obligatory video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rIDrmYyfWe8

Oh man. I remember that.

 

[John Connor]

People pray to God because they can't bare to think they are responsible for their own lives.

Um, no, failure.

 

[Mai72]

People pray to God because they can't bare to think they are responsible for their own lives.

I think most people pray to god because they're afraid to die.

What do they say?

There are no atheists in foxholes

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/There_are_no_atheists_in_foxholes

 

[Dr. Zaus]

I bid 100 ATOT-Coins for the first response after the op.

Prayer is efficacious in many ways: one is reducing stress responses, something which may have saved her from death by shock.

 

[MagnusTheBrewer]

I think most people pray to god because they're afraid to die.

What do they say?



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/There_are_no_atheists_in_foxholes

I believe the quote doesn't reflect the choice to believe as much as it does making a choice. Some surrender to God and, some surrender to nihilism.

 

[John Connor]

I think most people pray to god because they're afraid to die.

Wrong again. At least for me. I pray to ask for things where I need help in life and have asked for the forgiveness of my sins. I have sined a fucking life times worth! No more!

But I digress. If I tied you up and showed you a chain saw and said I'm gonna start with your arms and then your legs and chop you up into tiny pieces would you start praying?