because of this
gearheads live in their own world and think of everyone else as a gearhead. they don't understand people *not* understanding.
for example; many high powered sports bikes have a 4 inline, which sits below your knees; this gives the bike specific weight balance, and determines how fast the bike inclines. a twin which sits at your knee and basically between your buttcheeks doesnt have the same tendency to fall as fast as a 4 does.
thats not really disputable. you can't argue that an engine is somewhere it isn't, or that gravity works in a different way than it does.
but apparently some people think that treating bikes like an object and not something with a soul is blasphemy.
ducati bikes are easy to ride; they have lots of torque at the bottom and they don't tend to kick so much at the last 1k revs. most japs instead will rip your arms off at the top; the amount of effort you need to incline a bike that's at the top is also different between a straight power curve and a bell curve like ducati have. they also are anemic at bottom revs and can easily fall when going too slow.
also; the sv is a tall, soft bike. it has NONE of the characteristics of a jap, and it has nowhere near the stiffness in the shocks as any racing bike would have; you would learn nothing of riding if not the rules of teh road, which you might as well learn from riding a 125.
actually, if one ants to learn to ride, a proper racing 125 or 250 would be far better, but for someone who wants a commuter bike, the sv is far superior - cheaper, economical, and easier.
and more;
the whole thing of "things you aren't told" is that first and foremost, its not the bike which will kill you, but uneven roads, other drivers and other "not supposed to be there" hazards.
you are also not told how any minor incident on a bike (which, in a car, would be but a scratch on the paintwork) is a trip to the emergency room or a new set of clothes, not to mention the smashed carbon-fibre bodywork, handles, mirrors, pedals, etc.
Y.a.n.t. : how easy it is to have your bike stolen
y.a.n.t. how harsh is to deal with the weather and how you are *always* in your leathers and helmet, which you live with.
y.a.n.t. that riding anything which doesn't have a fairing like a busa or bigger means any highway travel will be done lying on the gas tank (or the wind will rip your head off)
y.a.n.t. essentially what a massive ripoff any bike with more than 50hp is; they look awesome, but they are 1% practical use and 99% e-peen. you are better off with a moped for city transport, and with a car for anything long distance. anything between these two and a commuter bike - like an EN5, SV650, or anything in the 400~500cc range is MUCH better than a racing bike, stiff racing shocks suck for normal life, straight power curves suck for normal life, racing geometries suck for normal life, etc ..
etc.
etc..
answers for the post above:
1) helmets make no sense (at first)at normal speed (i.e 30mph) but when you get going, they become essential.
2) if i were to EVER ride a bike again, i would go for the biggest, most protective fairing there is; i wouldn't consider anything less than a sports tourer. highway travel w/o a proper windshield is a nightmare.
3)i doubt you are that small. most bikes (japanese ones in primis) tend to be smaller than what an average sized person is comfortable with. but, if you really are a midget, yes, you can get a shaved seat and raised pegs. my buddy the sushi chef rode my MV and he was about 5 feet, had to do s running hop to ride, but never had problems fitting *on* the bike.
I wear a Shoei RF1100 and had two RF1000s prior. I don’t notice any distortion through the clear shields that come with the Shoei helmets. Optically they are pretty good. I’m a big fan of their spectra shields for riding on bright sunny days as they cut a lot of the glare but you really shouldn’t use them after the sun sets.3 Questions?
1.) I wore an ARAI brand full face helmet before and notice you have an almost distorted view of things compared to when people usually don't wear a helmet. Its like as if you're looking at a huge "wide view peep hole" almost. Wouldn't a full face helmet be a factor in seeing properly on the road? So what's a good helmet you can recommend?
Yes, they are useful. You really don’t look through the windscreens on most bikes, they are really just for directing airflow off of the rider. How effective they are depends on a number of factors, like shape, angle, height, etc. some accomplish this better than others. You just have to ride them and adjust and see what feels/works best for you.2.) Are windshields on bikes useful? Do they distort the view for a rider? Some 600cc super sports I notice have tiny ones (I guess for aerodynamic and styling purposes?) while some other non sport bikes have huge versions.
Lowering a bike definitely affects the handling. Ideally you would want to lower it the same amount front to rear which would not be inexpensive, plus you would have to contend with parts of the engine or exhaust hitting the ground when leaned over which could cause a loss of control. Personally, I would not recommend doing this unless you absolutely cannot get comfortable riding it at the stock height.3.) I read for 600cc bikes you can shave the seat and as a last resort lower the bike somehow if you're a smaller rider. How would this affect ride handling?
Sitting on a bike will give you a feel for it but nothing compared to what riding it will. Unfortunately, many dealers will not allow test rides on their bikes. Some have demo models or do demo days (BMW and Ducati are pretty good about allowing test rides as long as you sign your life away and have a proper motorcycle endorsement and gear). Japanese dealers you probably won’t be able to ride before you buy.I personally think another way to know if a bike is good for you or not is to simply go and sit on as much motorcycles as possible without even riding it and see what feels the most comfortable. Especially for beginners I would think something like the instrument cluster layout of a bike is important as well. If you don't feel comfortable and can't comprehend the instrument panel numbers like the speedometer tachometer then what's the use of purchasing that particular bike?
ducati bikes are easy to ride; they have lots of torque at the bottom and they don't tend to kick so much at the last 1k revs. most japs instead will rip your arms off at the top; the amount of effort you need to incline a bike that's at the top is also different between a straight power curve and a bell curve like ducati have. they also are anemic at bottom revs and can easily fall when going too slow.
and more;
the whole thing of "things you aren't told" is that first and foremost, its not the bike which will kill you, but uneven roads, other drivers and other "not supposed to be there" hazards.
you are also not told how any minor incident on a bike (which, in a car, would be but a scratch on the paintwork) is a trip to the emergency room or a new set of clothes, not to mention the smashed carbon-fibre bodywork, handles, mirrors, pedals, etc.
no. the opposite.Anyway, if Ducatis have lots of bottom end torque vs. an inline 4 then wouldn't in theory the Ducati be a bit harder to control for everyday riding? Because a small flick of the throttle pretty much sends the bike flying fast. Whereas a high revving inline 4 say something like a Yamaha R6 which revs high and most of the meat of the horsepower is in the upper power band wouldn't this be an easier bike to ride for slow, everyday riding?
no. the opposite.
@tortoise.
helmets "seem" a hindrance at low speeds. many have argued that the reduced awareness brought on by wearing helmets results in more crashes.
also, most people that get injured because of no- or open- helmets at low speed get so because of the other motorist (or unusual consequences).
still, i'd wear a helmet anytime regardless, i wouldn't claim they are bad.
but for someone who comes from riding scooters, the helmet always seems like a stupid thing at first.you think you never get into the situation where it woudl help you, and you think it does more harm than good.
but then you get on a real bike and go to real bike speeds and that open helmet you just bought all the sudden becomes the worst idea you ever had as you eat bugs and the air pressure tries to rip your eyeballs out.
@indy, i think its time we asked you why you want a motorcycle. give us an answer so we can give you a reasonable recommendation.
(fyi my nearly-70yo uncle still rides his cbr600 daily, so whatever you say, my answer is going to be cbr600)
there's an advanced msf course that you could take afterwards or you could look into taking a total control class. I think it's called the advanced riders clinic.
there's an advanced msf course that you could take afterwards or you could look into taking a total control class. I think it's called the advanced riders clinic.
Most advanced rider courses insist on minimum 3,000 miles of recent riding experience. They would kick out a new rider who signed up.
I have a Stage II modded 2008 STi, and used to have a 2001 M3, and even a middling bike like my Ninja 650 is MUCH more fun.
Of course it is. But you can mitigate a lot of it. Training, not getting too much bike to start with, riding at off hours to avoid traffic at first, secluded roads, FULL GEAR, including a full face helmet.
Ignore anyone who tells you to start on a super sport, and not to wear anything but full gear as well.
The most annoying part of riding for me is putting on all my gear. Big overpants, full racing boots, armor jacket..takes a bit and is kind of annoying to walk in the overpants. But when I think how fast I can go flying off the bike and skidding down the street, and what it would feel like without all that stuff...I stop complaining.
On a hot summer day, how do you manage to keep cool with all the gear on?
But you wear it, because a collision is sometimes done TO you. My first bike was totaled when a guy driving his buddies from a bar crowded through my lane as we were approaching a red light. He wanted to make a right on red and didn't want to be stuck behind me. His mirror snapped my left handlebar off and as I was falling off the bike, my hand maintained grip on the throttle and it sped right into a speed limit sign.
I went face first into the pole, the hit it with my shoulder as I was flipped over the bars. Full gear, so all I had were a few bruises and a sore shoulder. Without the gear, I could have easily been crippled.
All the gear, all the time.
But you wear it, because a collision is sometimes done TO you. My first bike was totaled when a guy driving his buddies from a bar crowded through my lane as we were approaching a red light. He wanted to make a right on red and didn't want to be stuck behind me. His mirror snapped my left handlebar off and as I was falling off the bike, my hand maintained grip on the throttle and it sped right into a speed limit sign.
I went face first into the pole, the hit it with my shoulder as I was flipped over the bars. Full gear, so all I had were a few bruises and a sore shoulder. Without the gear, I could have easily been crippled.
All the gear, all the time.
You probably should have just let go of the bike.
My .02
I have a Stage II modded 2008 STi, and used to have a 2001 M3, and even a middling bike like my Ninja 650 is MUCH more fun.
Although, I deleted some other stuff you posted about coach led track days instruction I will do my homework on those things.
Thanks for the info! :thumbsup:
I don't mean to talk about cars in this thread, but
Also, how much horesepower and torque is your STi putting out with your particular mods? And how much did you purchase your STi? Although, I'm interested in the Lancer EVO and the 2 others I listed earlier, The STi I'm particularly interested in because of the Boxer engine and 2.5L torque from it. I guess it is ALMOST like a Porsche 911 turbo if you mod it properly, except it has 4 doors. I guess I will go ahead and change my earlier stance on "keeping things stock philosophy" and allow myself a little breather room for a modded ride in the future.