Who are WE? (Boston & US)

[Grooveriding]

You're in a room full of people and one guy is a lot bigger than the rest, has a big bat with nails sticking out of it and has already lost his temper and thumped a few of the people in the room with it thinking they were looking at him funny.

Guess who the big guy is with the track record of instability and irrational actions in this analogy.

 

[Smoblikat]

I am so glad you posted this thread. I can almost guarentee you that 95% of America has never even considered the events the way you suggested. It is tragic that innocent civilians died (on both sides) but one side should have expected it and the other shouldnt have. Its not so much that America is evil, our government is evil. Our government is no longer Americans, we have been taken over by special interests and large banks who dictate everything we do.

 

[OBLAMA2009]

Really? Propaganda, admitted to and corroborated by Japanese historians as well.

Admit it, you don't know jack shit about the history, and are just parroting your typical bullshit attention whore nonsense. The math has been done, and the casualties would have far, far outweighed what they were, for both sides.

oh really, so there are japanese historians out there saying america did the right thing dropping nuclear bombs on their civilian cities? oh and by the way you do realize that they didnt drop nuclear bombs on "9 divisions", they dropped them straight in the middle of cities, with the deliberate intention of murdering hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians, dont you? kinda makes 9/11 look like nothing by comparison...

 

[Sulaco]

oh really, so there are japanese historians out there saying america did the right thing dropping nuclear bombs on their civilian cities? oh and by the way you do realize that they didnt drop nuclear bombs on "9 divisions", they dropped them straight in the middle of cities, with the deliberate intention of murdering hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians, dont you? kinda makes 9/11 look like nothing by comparison...

*sigh* Oh God, you're such a fool.

Your last statement just shows how ignorant you are, and how little you know.

The 9 divisions, which actually would have been as many as 13 by August, learned of through Japanese ULTRA intercepts, were fortified around Kyushu, where American forces would have had to have landed for ground invasion in lieu of dropping the bombs, moron. Meaning, had a standard ground invasion gone ahead instead of their dropping, hundreds of thousands more Japanese and Americans would have died, including civilians.

Even AFTER BOTH bombs were dropped, Hirohito's cabinet was still split about surrender, and only Hirohito himself intervening changed that, and EVEN THEN there was a coup and rebel factions within the government that opposed surrender stormed the palace and tried to burn the surrender document, as well as torching the houses of those within the cabinet who advocated surrender.

This myth that the Japanese were on the cusp of surrender is just that. You only expose your profound ignorance again and again, and look like an utter fool doing it. Even after the dropping of the bombs, only the overriding decision of the Emperor himself, as well as the assurance his Emperor status would survive, was surrender finally agreed to.

Again, learn something. Read.

 

[Orignal Earl]

WW2 was a set up by the FBI to gain control of Japan

edit- I put a wink in there so I don't have to come back and defend my statement

 

[Double Trouble]

What a nonsense thread. This is the sort of shit Moonbeam would write.

That was my first thought as well, but then moonie would have added in some wit or sarcasm of some sort instead of just the whiny self loathing bullshit in the OP.

 

[NesuD]

OP please explain to me the logic in attacking innocents in retaliation for attacks on innocents. There is never a justification for the intentional targetting of innocent men, women, and children.

 

[Orignal Earl]

What a nonsense thread.

Because there are a lot fewer accidents then people would like to think, right?
The mil has to follow the ROE and most strikes are carefully calculated by CAOC.
Somebody decides if Taliban Joe is worth 13 innocent children or not.

 

[Moonbeam]

Do anyone question themselves about?

Of course they do. Here is one example:

http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Zinn/Terrorism_War_Zinn.html

But you have to understand that humanity is evolving and has a long journey ahead or will wind up on the ant heap.

It is important to have perspective. You are here among animals who still have a hand on the vine asking if anybody questions and that's like asking the blind if they can see. As with everything else, human evolution is driven by the eye of the pyramid, pictured on the dollar bill, the visionary few whose radical and forward views become tomorrow's platitudes. All over the planet the views you see expressed here by the backward and emotionally ignorant are being supplanted with new understanding that all people everywhere are the same.

Spend some time at TED, BBC-Future, EDGE, etc. and links they may provide. They may help you feel less alone.

 

[Moonbeam]

*sigh* Oh God, you're such a fool.

Your last statement just shows how ignorant you are, and how little you know.

The 9 divisions, which actually would have been as many as 13 by August, learned of through Japanese ULTRA intercepts, were fortified around Kyushu, where American forces would have had to have landed for ground invasion in lieu of dropping the bombs, moron. Meaning, had a standard ground invasion gone ahead instead of their dropping, hundreds of thousands more Japanese and Americans would have died, including civilians.

Even AFTER BOTH bombs were dropped, Hirohito's cabinet was still split about surrender, and only Hirohito himself intervening changed that, and EVEN THEN there was a coup and rebel factions within the government that opposed surrender stormed the palace and tried to burn the surrender document, as well as torching the houses of those within the cabinet who advocated surrender.

This myth that the Japanese were on the cusp of surrender is just that. You only expose your profound ignorance again and again, and look like an utter fool doing it. Even after the dropping of the bombs, only the overriding decision of the Emperor himself, as well as the assurance his Emperor status would survive, was surrender finally agreed to.

Again, learn something. Read.

You make the same brain dead assumption that so many make, that because they can read they understand what they read. Everywhere the brain dead look they see confirmation of their opinion. You will see me as completely mad because you are.

 

[tuxberg]

Glad to know that the Preamble to the Constitution is just so much hogwash.

What were those guys thinking....

The initial draft read "We the people of Massachusetts, New York, ect." and listed all the signer states. It was never intended as the Jacobin mantra we see today. Given that the constitution was created in secret by wealthy elites and voted on by less than 2/3 of the eligible white-male land-owners in those colonies, I wouldn't think that liberals would continue to hold it up as the paragon of collectivist egalitarian virtue.

If you want to use that nonsense to claim personal responsibility for every war and atrocity committed by the political machine, be my guest, but I must insist that there is no collective responsibility for the many who did not ask for this evil.

 

[Nebor]

I'm not advocating pacifism at all. I'm even a veteran of the U.S Armed Forces, who's done several tours in the Middle East.

My point is, you can't slaughter hundreds of thousands of innocent people (doesn't matter what your intentions or reasons are) and expect no serious blowback..

If you do a drone strike or bombing on a target that kills the terrorist, but also kills 15 other people that probably had nothing to do with terrorism other than being in the vicinity, it understandably creates some hard feelings and you've now "created" more terrorists..

What you end up with, is an endless cycle of violence that will never end with each side scoring victories and experiencing failures; a cycle that consumes not only lives, but tremendous wealth and resources as well..

We need to get out of the Middle East and stay out. Those people are fucking crazy, as their religion has warped their minds over centuries of psychological conditioning which allows them to perform acts that would be unimaginable to most other people.

Unless we're willing to use brutal Roman tactics and subjugate them using extreme violence (and we're not), we'll never completely beat them.

Holy shit, they let Bradly Manning have internet access?

 

[Gintaras]

OP please explain to me the logic in attacking innocents in retaliation for attacks on innocents. There is never a justification for the intentional targetting of innocent men, women, and children.

Neither I have/understand that "logic":

Two bads never make one good...

My logic:

Both are as bad - just on different sides of the fence.

Terrorists are as bad as those, who support war in Iraq, etc...

As I said - all are the same, just different side of the fence....