Who here knows the actual cost of their health care?

[bobcpg]

I pay $45/month for good insurance, if I smoked i'd pay $90. I'm sure my employer subsidizes it, but you know what I also get paid good. Yeah you might be thinking ooh you are lucky. Yes I am lucky but you know what, I didn't go to a big name school, I went to some no name state college. It took me 6.5 years to graduate with a 4 year degree. I see no reason that ANYBODY couldn't do what I did. I paid for ALL my college by working, i'm white so I didn't get any help from the government.

Point being: Go get a good job, it might take some work but get it done! Mainly, for all the sob stories I have been reading I figured I'd post mine.

ps. I am finding out now that If I didn't work during college uncle sam would have paid for a good amount of it. F'd up, the less you work the more you get for free.

Anyways, I'm sure I'll be blasted, called a racist yadda yadda but I really do not care. Stop bitching and stop drinking the juice. *Because its the juice that will get you sick!*

 

[Via]

There was a story in the Chicago Tribune a while back about how a guy in his 50s was in debilitating pain and was approved for back surgery.

After the surgey was performed his insurance company reversed it's decision and declined to cover it. The cost was around $160,000.

After this whole mess became public the company waffled and ended up paying.



Why does a back surgery cost 160,000 motherfucking dollars?

 

[Engineer]

Originally posted by: bobcpg
I pay $45/month for good insurance, if I smoked i'd pay $90. I'm sure my employer subsidizes it, but you know what I also get paid good. Yeah you might be thinking ooh you are lucky. Yes I am lucky but you know what, I didn't go to a big name school, I went to some no name state college. It took me 6.5 years to graduate with a 4 year degree. I see no reason that ANYBODY couldn't do what I did. I paid for ALL my college by working, i'm white so I didn't get any help from the government.

Point being: Go get a good job, it might take some work but get it done! Mainly, for all the sob stories I have been reading I figured I'd post mine.

ps. I am finding out now that If I didn't work during college uncle sam would have paid for a good amount of it. F'd up, the less you work the more you get for free.

Anyways, I'm sure I'll be blasted, called a racist yadda yadda but I really do not care. Stop bitching and stop drinking the juice. *Because its the juice that will get you sick!*

White has nothing to do with getting help from the government to go to school. It depends on income. I received Pell grants (and state grants) while going to school, and yes, both my wife and I worked while I was in school. To say that you get no aid because you're white is a crock of shit (and you know it too).

As for your ps. I agree. The less you make, the more you get. My wife and I made $15,000 the last year before I was to graduate. We were turned down for ALL financial aid because we made too much money. The only thing that changed that and allowed me to finish school (one semester) was the fact that my wife was pregnant, and once learning of that, we were "re-evaluated" and was awarded a Pell grant to finish.

 

[0marTheZealot]

Originally posted by: bobcpg
Point being: Go get a good job, it might take some work but get it done! Mainly, for all the sob stories I have been reading I figured I'd post mine.

What about small business owners? Are they just screwed? Should we all simply become sheeple in a large corporation so we can get decent health insurance?

 

[shira]

Three years ago, my father had stenosis of the aortic valve. He underwent valve-replacement surgery followed by a week in ICU (he had complications) followed by two weeks in a rehabilitation facility. The total billed cost for all care (diagnosis, surgery, hospital, rehabilitation, and follow-up) was about $362,000. Medicare knocked that down to (as I recall) about $140,000 and paid most of it. My father's supplemental policy paid most of the rest. I believe the total amount paid by my parents was less than $1000.

Was this worth it? Well, my father went from a state where he would pass out without warning at least once a week (and it likely would have gotten worse) to where he was completely back to his fully self-sufficient lifestyle.

 

[Pens1566]

Originally posted by: alphatarget1

Originally posted by: 0marTheZealot

Originally posted by: alphatarget1
Force all insurance policies to have at least 20% co-pay.

Do you have 150,000 or more to pay for chemotherapy?

No, but maybe having a minimum copay for all policies will force people to live healthier since they wouldn't be able to afford the expensive procedures. No more stomach bypass when fat people live healthier, it's a win-win!

If cancer is curable, and you'd still live a productive life after recovery, I don't see why the government couldn't set up some sort of loan for people to pay it off.

If you smoke 10 packs a day and you get cancer, why should I have to pay for your poor life decisions?

It's a gross simplification, of course, but the point is that people need to have some skin in paying for procedures. We can't give everyone the best and most advanced treatment for every kind of disease, period. 10-20 years ago the same people who were sick would've just died.

Yeah, "live healthier" will keep that 3 yr old from getting leukemia ....

Vast majority of cancer isn't lifestyle induced.

 

[Carmen813]

Originally posted by: bobcpg
I pay $45/month for good insurance, if I smoked i'd pay $90. I'm sure my employer subsidizes it, but you know what I also get paid good. Yeah you might be thinking ooh you are lucky. Yes I am lucky but you know what, I didn't go to a big name school, I went to some no name state college. It took me 6.5 years to graduate with a 4 year degree. I see no reason that ANYBODY couldn't do what I did. I paid for ALL my college by working, i'm white so I didn't get any help from the government.

Point being: Go get a good job, it might take some work but get it done! Mainly, for all the sob stories I have been reading I figured I'd post mine.

ps. I am finding out now that If I didn't work during college uncle sam would have paid for a good amount of it. F'd up, the less you work the more you get for free.

Anyways, I'm sure I'll be blasted, called a racist yadda yadda but I really do not care. Stop bitching and stop drinking the juice. *Because its the juice that will get you sick!*

This whole "I'm white" so the government won't help me is total bullshit. The government didn't help you because you didn't take the time to learn about programs available to help you. My family is white, my mom makes over 140k a year, and my brother still qualified for federal student loans.

I'm white, and a few years back before my mother landed a good job I was able to get state tuition grants, federal grants, and federal loans. Now I have a full scholarship. Stop blaming your skin color.

As for the people blaming cancer patients for getting cancer, I can't wait until the day the bus hits you too. Learn more about the various diseases before you make ignorant statements. As a side note, cancer patients DO pay for a lot of their services. I'm still fighting over stuff that was supposed to have been paid by my insurance company 3 years ago.

 

[shira]

Originally posted by: alphatarget1

Originally posted by: 0marTheZealot

Originally posted by: alphatarget1
Force all insurance policies to have at least 20% co-pay.

Do you have 150,000 or more to pay for chemotherapy?

No, but maybe having a minimum copay for all policies will force people to live healthier since they wouldn't be able to afford the expensive procedures. No more stomach bypass when fat people live healthier, it's a win-win!

If cancer is curable, and you'd still live a productive life after recovery, I don't see why the government couldn't set up some sort of loan for people to pay it off.

If you smoke 10 packs a day and you get cancer, why should I have to pay for your poor life decisions?

It's a gross simplification, of course, but the point is that people need to have some skin in paying for procedures. We can't give everyone the best and most advanced treatment for every kind of disease, period. 10-20 years ago the same people who were sick would've just died.

Sounds like you want death panels.

 

[Carmen813]

We can't give everyone the best and most advanced treatment for every kind of disease, period. 10-20 years ago the same people who were sick would've just died.

It's called progress.

 

[alphatarget1]

Originally posted by: Carmen813

We can't give everyone the best and most advanced treatment for every kind of disease, period. 10-20 years ago the same people who were sick would've just died.

It's called progress.

I'm going to piss a lot of people off if I say that modern medicine is keeping the bad genes in the pool by keeping people alive who otherwise would've died, and it is making our species as a whole weaker. Things like pennicilin, treatment of polio, etc, has greatly benefited mankind since they treated people who didn't have to die for a relatively low cost, and it treated disease caused by external factors.

 

[zephyrprime]

Well, I know my old insurance from my employer cost $450/mo for 1 person. I don't know how much various medical services cost.

 

[alphatarget1]

Originally posted by: shira

Sounds like you want death panels.

People need to understand treatment vs. quality of life. It should be an informed decision made by the patient and the family. In principle I support end of life consultations.

 

[Pens1566]

Originally posted by: alphatarget1

Originally posted by: Carmen813

We can't give everyone the best and most advanced treatment for every kind of disease, period. 10-20 years ago the same people who were sick would've just died.

It's called progress.

I'm going to piss a lot of people off if I say that modern medicine is keeping the bad genes in the pool by keeping people alive who otherwise would've died, and it is making our species as a whole weaker. Things like pennicilin, treatment of polio, etc, has greatly benefited mankind since they treated people who didn't have to die for a relatively low cost, and it treated disease caused by external factors.

Which is it, bad genes or lifestyle choices? You're all over the place on this.

 

[alphatarget1]

Originally posted by: Pens1566

Which is it, bad genes or lifestyle choices? You're all over the place on this.

Both.

 

[0marTheZealot]

Originally posted by: alphatarget1

Originally posted by: Pens1566

Which is it, bad genes or lifestyle choices? You're all over the place on this.

Both.

So people with good genes should be treated? People with bad genes should just accept their fate for the greater good? What about people with good genes but those who made bad decisions about their health, do they get some bastardized treatment plan for squandering their gift? I don't even know what you are trying to say at all.

 

[Brovane]

In my Opinion the entire thing is a racket.

Earlier this year my wife went in to have her thyroid removed and spent 2 nights in the hospital. We have Aetna PPO. The hospital charge was $24k however the network negotiated amount was $3.7, WTF? How can there be such a huge disrepenancy? So if I was paying cash you would charge me $24k? Also the hospitals just about make it impossible to shop for price unless you are doing a ellective procedure like plastic surgery.

 

[b0mbrman]

I get socialized, single payer health care from the VA

 

[Thump553]

Originally posted by: Brovane
In my Opinion the entire thing is a racket.

Earlier this year my wife went in to have her thyroid removed and spent 2 nights in the hospital. We have Aetna PPO. The hospital charge was $24k however the network negotiated amount was $3.7, WTF? How can there be such a huge disrepenancy? So if I was paying cash you would charge me $24k? Also the hospitals just about make it impossible to shop for price unless you are doing a ellective procedure like plastic surgery.

Excellent point. And if you went in without insurance, there is not a chance that you could have negotiated the price down to the $3700. if the hospital sued you, YOU would have had to produce expert testimony that the 24k charge was unreasonable and that $3700 was the reasonable value for the services rendered.

 

[Xellos2099]

Seeing this thread, it seems it is the hospital that charge outrageous fee is mroe of a cause of raising healthcare cost then it si the insurance company. Yet people blame, blame blame insurance company.

 

[Gooberlx2]

An old co-worker of mine sustained a bite from a black-tailed rattlesnake, on the job, which also caused him to go in to sepsis.

2 weeks ICU, 2 weeks PCU, 1 week regular care unit. 11-or-so doses of anti-venom (at something like $15k each), drugs, several surgeries, skin grafts, therapy, etc, etc...

He still gets the EOBs with worker's comp. Cost to date has come around $2 million+. The simplest of mishaps can cost absolutely retarded amounts of money.

 

[soccerballtux]

Originally posted by: Jakeisbest

Originally posted by: 0marTheZealot
You probably received around 4,000 dollars worth of treatment.

Thats what I am talking about! I mean while I was in the ER i all ready paid my deductible. They could have sold me snake oil and I would have been like " Hell Ya, that snake oil is great, really takes the pain away!".

How can we possibly control health care cost if the consumer is totally out of the loop?

LOL, you're right, all those greedy insurance companies just love to fork over thousands for treatment.

 

[ohnoes]

Originally posted by: Brovane
In my Opinion the entire thing is a racket.

Earlier this year my wife went in to have her thyroid removed and spent 2 nights in the hospital. We have Aetna PPO. The hospital charge was $24k however the network negotiated amount was $3.7, WTF? How can there be such a huge disrepenancy? So if I was paying cash you would charge me $24k? Also the hospitals just about make it impossible to shop for price unless you are doing a ellective procedure like plastic surgery.

This is what my Dr. friend says also. The hospital bills out at a really high rate, but the insurance companies negotiates only to pay a % of that rate. In the no insurance case, what'll actually end up happening is they'll charge you the full amount, and if you can't pay, they sell your bill for a % of its face value to a collections agency, which then go after you.

From what he says, the reason that the rates are so high is partly 1) they know insurance companies won't pay face value and 2) ER's, uninsured people, and end-of-life care raise costs for everyone. My take is that its really #2 that's the problem. Apparently, everyone in the medical community knows a fraction of the patients account for the majority of the bills. When he does urgent life saving procedures (especially those from the ER), there's never any discussion of cost or who's going to pay for it. It's just a matter of doing everything they can to save that guy's life. The hospital then has to go recoup those costs from everyone else who can pay.

Just as an example, he told me that they buy propofol at <$1/vial, but bill it out at $40-50, of which they only expect to collect ~$10.

 

[ohnoes]

Originally posted by: soccerballtux

Originally posted by: Jakeisbest

Originally posted by: 0marTheZealot
You probably received around 4,000 dollars worth of treatment.

Thats what I am talking about! I mean while I was in the ER i all ready paid my deductible. They could have sold me snake oil and I would have been like " Hell Ya, that snake oil is great, really takes the pain away!".

How can we possibly control health care cost if the consumer is totally out of the loop?

LOL, you're right, all those greedy insurance companies just love to fork over thousands for treatment.

I remember you. You're the idiot that thought not having subsidized health insurance was awesome. Maybe you should look into the laws that govern ER treatment.

 

[Brovane]

Originally posted by: ohnoes

Originally posted by: Brovane
In my Opinion the entire thing is a racket.

Earlier this year my wife went in to have her thyroid removed and spent 2 nights in the hospital. We have Aetna PPO. The hospital charge was $24k however the network negotiated amount was $3.7, WTF? How can there be such a huge disrepenancy? So if I was paying cash you would charge me $24k? Also the hospitals just about make it impossible to shop for price unless you are doing a ellective procedure like plastic surgery.

This is what my Dr. friend says also. The hospital bills out at a really high rate, but the insurance companies negotiates only to pay a % of that rate. In the no insurance case, what'll actually end up happening is they'll charge you the full amount, and if you can't pay, they sell your bill for a % of its face value to a collections agency, which then go after you.

From what he says, the reason that the rates are so high is partly 1) they know insurance companies won't pay face value and 2) ER's, uninsured people, and end-of-life care raise costs for everyone. My take is that its really #2 that's the problem. Apparently, everyone in the medical community knows a fraction of the patients account for the majority of the bills. When he does urgent life saving procedures (especially those from the ER), there's never any discussion of cost or who's going to pay for it. It's just a matter of doing everything they can to save that guy's life. The hospital then has to go recoup those costs from everyone else who can pay.

Just as an example, he told me that they buy propofol at <$1/vial, but bill it out at $40-50, of which they only expect to collect ~$10.

When this really drives me nuts is when we have a out of network doctor that doesn't go by there negotiated amount. They then charge a much higher rate than what Aetna thinks is reasonable and customary since this rate is based off the negotiated amount. Aetna then tells you that you are on the hook for anything beyond what they consider reasonable and customary. I had this when my first daughter was born. The hospital was in Network but unknown to me the Doctors in the NICU where not in the AETNA PPO network. So when they had to resuscitate my daughter sticking a tube down here throat was $460 dollars for the doctor charge. However Aetna said that only $160 was reasonable and customary. So I got to foot the rest of the bill. Aetna acted is if I should have known. Yeah as if I am going to ask a doctor as they stick a tube down my newborn's throat and get her breathing again. What do you charge for this? Are you charges reasonable and customary?

 

[RU482]

On the subject of insurance...I was in a fender bender in May. I was at fault. My insurance compnay paid out $2200 to the other party. I did not make a claim, but rather opted to buy used parts cheap (headlight and front bumper cover for less than my deducible) My 6 mo premium went up $120. at first I was pissed, but then, I realized it would take the insurance company just about 10 yrs to recover that payout (difference above me just paying my normal premium with a non-tainted record). Sure there's some (maybe alot) of that risk built into the previous premium, but I'm glad I didn't have to payout that $2200 out of pocket.

guess I'm happy to take the gamble of having insurance

Ooo, on the contrary (sort of)...soon not having health insurance and getting sick will be as big of a crime as not having car insurance and getting in an accident!!!