Whole Home Audio Systems

[Jawo]

My parents recently built a new house and want to put in a wired whole home audio system. During construction the house was wired with 14g speaker cable and cat5 in 15 different zones (8 upstairs, 6 in basement and one outside). Ideally, each zone would be able to play different music from the receiver and have local input. Not really looking for a home theater capabilities. I was planning on helping my dad install the system and he wants something he will be able to tweak himself. Looking at ~$5,000 for the system in total.

I've been looking to see what is available and liking Crutchfield's guides. Here's what I have come up with:

These speakers from Monoprice: 6-1/2 Inches Kevlar 2-Way In-Ceiling Speakers

"home intercom" Type systems: Niles ZR6 Or Russound Systems
Pro: Distributed system
Con: underpowered, limited to ~25W RMS per channel

Home Theater Receiver: Yamaha A3010
Pro: Input for anything and everything, lots of power
Con: Expensive, only two zones, don't need the surround sound system

Crestron system
Pro: Does exactly what I want
Con: VERY expensive, can't maintain yourself, everything has to be done by an authorized tech

As it seems like there are many amp, receivers available, I'm thinking that my quest is more for receiver software than hardware. Is there something like the Crestron software that can be installed separately (like DD-WRT for Cisco routers)? Or another Home automation system company I have been missing?

 

[purbeast0]

so he did all this work to get 15 zones wired with speaker wire throughout an entire house, but would use $45 speakers?

/confused

 

[Plugers]

There was a guy that build a system with an old PC and 2 SB 5.1 cards.

You could then get a decent power supply (Meanwell) and use multiple 4 x 100 watt TK2050 tripath boards $50 each


edit: Here is the link I think. https://sites.google.com/site/maycreates/music-server

 

[Jawo]

Purbeast0: I'm not looking for audiophile speakers, but something that is affordable, and produces a good sound. This is the main reason why I want a good receiver/amps that can drive the system to 50w at 8 ohms. CNet highly reviewed the Monoprice surround sound system, and the reviews seem to be great. Do you have a better suggestion? Many of the Polk, JPL, etc speakers that are $100 each have the same specs.

 

[purbeast0]

Purbeast0: I'm not looking for audiophile speakers, but something that is affordable, and produces a good sound. This is the main reason why I want a good receiver/amps that can drive the system to 50w at 8 ohms. CNet highly reviewed the Monoprice surround sound system, and the reviews seem to be great. Do you have a better suggestion? Many of the Polk, JPL, etc speakers that are $100 each have the same specs.

as someone who's about to drop a lot of money on a HT system, my recommendation would be to go to stores and listen to speakers instead of spending money on something you may not like.

people have different preferences so what may sound good to one person may not sound good to another.

 

[Jawo]

as someone who's about to drop a lot of money on a HT system, my recommendation would be to go to stores and listen to speakers instead of spending money on something you may not like.

people have different preferences so what may sound good to one person may not sound good to another.

Do you have any suggestions on other components that would send the signal to whatever speakers like receivers/amps?

 

[purbeast0]

Do you have any suggestions on other components that would send the signal to whatever speakers like receivers/amps?

well the receiver i'm looking at has 3 zones (denon 4311ci) but i'm not sure how many zones receivers go up to. as far as how many you are looking for, i really am not sure and don't have much knowledge over there.

i'd recommend going to avsforum.com and doing some research over there. it's got a ton of great knowledge.

 

[Zivic]

home theater direct has some decent solutions. just put a system in my dads new house last year. for the money, they have a lot of options

 

[Jawo]

home theater direct has some decent solutions. just put a system in my dads new house last year. for the money, they have a lot of options

Thanks! Your dad is pleased with the system? Looks like an ideal system with lots of functionality, and options.

 

[Kaido]

Two questions:

1. Are you into DIY at all?

2. How do you want to stream the music to each room and to multiple rooms?

 

[ArJuN]

I just installed a similar setup for my parents. The criteria was cost effectiveness and ease of use. I personally don't think high quality speakers are needed for the ceiling to play music because 9/10 times the room isn't set up for acoustics, and the media being streamed isn't of high quality. The Monoprice speakers are more than sufficient in my opinion. For the easy of trouble shooting when I'm not around, I used one stereo receiver for each zone, and a speaker selector if I needed to expand that. I added an Airport express to each zone since Airplay was the easiest way for them to use. Now they just hit power on the remote and grab the nearest iPhone/iPad/iPod/computer and pick a song and control the volume.

You have many more zones than I do though, so 15 amps may be a lot. Definitely keep HTD's Lync system in mind:
http://www.htd.com/Products/Lync

 

[Gooberlx2]

Why not something like a Sonos?

We have two zones in our house. It's brain dead simple to setup and works very well.

 

[Jawo]

Kaido: 1. Open to DIY software, but not DIY hardware. 2. That is what I'm looking for: How to stream music to each room.

Gooberlx2: Sonos is quite pricey if you want more than 2-3 zones/rooms. The house is already wired as well.

ArJuN: Zivic recommended HTD as well. Their Lync system is looks quite nice, pretty much what I'm looking for. Do you have experience with them? My parents don't have any Apple devices, but looking at the HDNet-Lync as they have Android cell phones.

 

[sdifox]

humm, what about a server, android sticks and a screen in each room? wireless remote or kb can control it and you can do a shit ton more with them, like stream radio. you would need amp and speakers of course.

 

[Zivic]

Thanks! Your dad is pleased with the system? Looks like an ideal system with lots of functionality, and options.

yes, we bought the MC66SET-KC7 and paired it with a cheaper HK stereo receiver. the builder installed the speakers; a lower end speaker craft model.

I have bought from HTD for a few yrs now and always had good customer service.

He was going to get a system through the builder, but after I saw what he was offering for more money, I started looking into systems. the biggest advantages of the HTD system was 6 full function touchpads vs one full function and 5 volume knobs and we got a stand alone amp.

 

[Jawo]

yes, we bought the MC66SET-KC7 and paired it with a cheaper HK stereo receiver. the builder installed the speakers; a lower end speaker craft model.

I have bought from HTD for a few yrs now and always had good customer service.

He was going to get a system through the builder, but after I saw what he was offering for more money, I started looking into systems. the biggest advantages of the HTD system was 6 full function touchpads vs one full function and 5 volume knobs and we got a stand alone amp.

Thanks for your suggestions! Looking at the Lync 12 zone system, and will probably link a few common zones together (kitchen/great room/dining room).

 

[Gooberlx2]

Sonos is quite pricey if you want more than 2-3 zones/rooms. The house is already wired as well.

Maybe look in to squeezebox then? I'm pretty sure it accomplished mostly the same thing for less. Not sure if that's still the case with the new direction logitech went with those products though.

 

[vi edit]

There is no way you are getting different music into 15 unique zones for $5000. Not happening. Or at least not in any remotely easy to operate or maintain way. They need to reset their goals and figure out just how many realistic zones they truely need. 3 or 4 is not unusual. 15 is crazy.

 

[Jawo]

There is no way you are getting different music into 15 unique zones for $5000. Not happening. Or at least not in any remotely easy to operate or maintain way. They need to reset their goals and figure out just how many realistic zones they truely need. 3 or 4 is not unusual. 15 is crazy.

I believe what Zivic recommended will suit my needs. If this system would be for my house I would take Pluggers' suggestion and build a system myself.

 

[vi edit]

To be clear, you aren't going to have 15 different streams of music playing in 15 different rooms. You have the *abiliity* to do that with a system like the Lync. It's not zone limited, it's input limited. You need 15 different inputs to be able to split the sources out like desired.

 

[Kaido]

Kaido: 1. Open to DIY software, but not DIY hardware. 2. That is what I'm looking for: How to stream music to each room.

OK, that gets me started then. As far as speakers go, both Monoprice and Parts Express have really good deals on in-ceiling and in-wall speakers. You can also find in-wall subwoofers if you are so inclined.

As far as amps go, AudioSource makes a nice one called the AMP-100. It's usually around $100 (Amazon has it for $85 right now). 50 watts per channel (2 channels) and has two inputs, one of which is a priority override:

http://www.amazon.com/AudioSource-AM...dp/B00026BQJ6/

So you could run an RCA or Minijack wallplate into every room and patch that into the override input on the amp. So you could plug in an iPod or whatever into a specific room.

As far as whole-house music goes, if you don't mind DIY software as you mentioned, you can do some pretty neat stuff. Airplay is at the heart of all of my current audio projects. Airplay is Apple's wireless audio streaming system. In it's native form, it's a bit limited, but with some modifications you can do some really cool things. For starters, you need some audio hardware. You basically have 3 choices:

1. Airport Express
2. AppleTV
3. Raspberry Pi (they demo'd Airplay running on it, although I don't know if it's available for general release yet)

The Airport Express is the easiest choice to go with - it supports analog minijack output, so you can get a Y-cable that terminates in standard RCA cables to run into the amp. Next, you need some software. There's lots of good mod software available; I like Airfoil a lot from Rogue Amoeba:

http://rogueamoeba.com/airfoil/windows/

Basically, this allows you to send any audio from a PC or Mac to a single or multiple Airplay receivers. You can also setup other computers as Airplay receivers if they have speakers (as well as mobile devices like an iPod Touch, iPad, or iPhone). There are also apps for mobile devices (Apple iOS devices, Android, etc.).

But long story short, the idea is to send an audio source to multiple speakers. In the room, the wall plate can handle local device hookup (a record player, an iPod, whatever), but for streaming, you usually want some kind of audio server with all of your music & services - MP3 files, MOG, Rdio, Spotify, etc. So the next step is to get a great remote system:

http://reemoteapp.com/airfoil/

Basically, you will need a Mac (or Hackintosh) and an iOS device. The Mac acts as the server and handles both local media and cloud media (like Pandora). The iOS device (such as an iPod Touch) acts as the remote control. So anywhere you are in your house, the iPod Touch with the Reemote app lets you send any audio you want to any of your Airplay-enabled speakers. And you can make any speakers Airplay-enabled by simply strapping on a $99 Airport Express to them - you don't have to buy special Airplay-enabled speakers (unless you want to, but you can do better for less money by using Monoprice or Parts Express speakers).

 

[Kaido]

Okay, let me summarize that above:

1. Monoprice or Parts Express in-ceiling speakers
2. AudioSource AMP-100 2x50w amp (one per room)
3. RCA or Minijack wallplate in each room
4. Airport Express for each amp you purchase
5. Mac server
6. iPod Touch remote control with Reemote app

Let's say you have 5 rooms. You'd buy 5 pairs of in-ceiling speakers, 5 amps, 5 walljacks, 5 Airport Express devices, a Mac server (like a Mac Mini computer), an iPod Touch, and the Reemote app for iOS. And a partridge in a pear tree

The iPod Touch would act as the remote for the entire system. The Mac acts as both the LAN & Cloud player. You can control the following from Reemote:

iTunes
Last.fm
Spotify
Rdio
Streambox (Pandora)
Quicktime
Realplayer
VLC
Cog (Ogg Vorbis, FLAC, etc.)
Winamp
MOG
Sonora
Musicality
Muse (another Pandora player)

Using the Reemote app, you can control which speakers get the music, as well as the volume of the music in each room:

http://reemoteapp.com/airfoil/img/device_iphone.png

So far, it's hands-down the best system I've used for whole-house audio. It's not complicated and it does what I want - a simple remote for the house, where I can control the songs and volume in every room from the palm of my hand, as well as override with a local source like a visitor's MP3 player. Awesome.

 

[vi edit]

If you only need one music source you really can't beat Sonos. It's small, well supported, easy to operate and just flat out works. It can be controlled by iOS and Android devices very easily.

The pandora streaming, access to spotify, rhapsody and slacker are excellent. Figure that you are essentially getting a premium Pandora account with it and the price isn't as bad over the life of the device. I just can't state enough how much use this device gets in my house and how happy I am with it.

 

[Kaido]

If you only need one music source you really can't beat Sonos. It's small, well supported, easy to operate and just flat out works. It can be controlled by iOS and Android devices very easily.

The pandora streaming, access to spotify, rhapsody and slacker are excellent. Figure that you are essentially getting a premium Pandora account with it and the price isn't as bad over the life of the device. I just can't state enough how much use this device gets in my house and how happy I am with it.

Sonos is super awesome. If you want a plug & play solution, I like this even better than the big-boy systems that are sold as part of dedicated whole-house audio & home automation/smart home packages. Really a piece of cake to setup & use!

 

[Jawo]

Thanks for the suggestion Kaido, but need to power 34 speakers across two floors. Additionally, my parents don't have any apple devices. Looking at the HTD Lync 12 right now, and will combine some like zones together to get to 12 zones.

Would love a system that could connect to the home network though...a Crestron/Nuvo A/V distribution system without the home automation.