Why don't you just delid? /s
der8auer seems to suggest that as long as you don't replace the stock TIM, the thing should last and not require replacing periodically. Of course how much of a headache it will be for OCing is an entirely different matter.I realize this was sarcasm, and well placed at that. But to answer anyway, one reason I don't like TIM is because it needs replacing. People talk about how solder degrades under thermal cycling, but TIM is what degrades and needs replacing over time. It breaks down. As long as an 8 core chip would last, I don't want to think about having to delid the thing again to replace the TIM. Its ridiculous. And what about selling the thing? Most people won't want to buy a de-lidded chip. I know I would never buy someone's delidded CPU. Also, warranty goes out the window. WHAT A CRAP SHOW.
der8auer seems to suggest that as long as you don't replace the stock TIM, the thing should last and not require replacing periodically. Of course how much of a headache it will be for OCing is an entirely different matter.
Not me! Seems like Skylake-X will use TIM instead of soldered heatspreader. LOL that's just pathetic from Intel, a giant middle finger to consumers everywhere.
Usage of TIM doesnt matter for 99% HEDT users as they won't be OCing.
My favorite board has to be the EVGA x299 dark with the gigabyte gaming 9 auros a close second.Usage of TIM doesnt matter for 99% HEDT users as they won't be OCing. CPU will work fine within official specifications. This forces overclockers to delid. They get lower temperatures and Intel gets rid of the problem of replacing damaged OCed CPUs as warranty is voided. If those complaining 1% of users are unhappy, they can always go for AMD product if they think its better.
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For people interested in Skylake-X, here is (again) list of some X299 motherboards:
https://www.techpowerup.com/233821/...nal-gaming-i9-and-x299-killer-sli-ac-detailed
http://wccftech.com/asus-x299-motherboard-rog-rampage-vi-extreme/
https://www.techpowerup.com/233809/gigabyte-x299-aorus-gaming-9-motherboard-detailed
https://www.techpowerup.com/233864/gigabyte-c422-ws-bridges-the-gap-between-core-x-and-xeon-gold
My initial favorite was the ASRock x299 professional gaming i9, but now that I see Asus ROG Rampage 6 extreme it replaced it. It has 4 evenly spaced PCIe slots. In case of 2-way SLI the little PCIe slot is still usabe. 2x M.2 on that DIMM slot looks easier to cool. Not that it really matters but it has also better Wifi.
Gigabyte C422-WS looks interesting because it also supports Gold and Platinum Xeons in addition to Skylake-X. Intel tried to separate them but Gigabyte found a way to unite them like it was in X99. Lots of PCIe slots, although the rest may be questionable (VRM, BIOS options, memory speeds).
What's your favorite X299 motherboard?
The article on the Gigabyte board claims that it will support 128 GB of memory on Core X, but 512 GB of memory on Xeon, which is pretty ridiculous when Core CPUs are now going up to 18C. Intel's segmentation game just gets stronger and stronger with each generation.https://www.techpowerup.com/233864/gigabyte-c422-ws-bridges-the-gap-between-core-x-and-xeon-gold
Gigabyte C422-WS looks interesting because it also supports Gold and Platinum Xeons in addition to Skylake-X. Intel tried to separate them but Gigabyte found a way to unite them like it was in X99. Lots of PCIe slots, although the rest may be questionable (VRM, BIOS options, memory speeds).
What's your favorite X299 motherboard?
Those are the same thing. You can't solder a small die and have it be a reliable chip.First it was no solder because small die, now it's reliability.
How small is small? How large is large? People have been running overclocked CPUs on both ends of the spectrum for a long time.Those are the same thing. You can't solder a small die and have it be a reliable chip.
der8auer seems to suggest that as long as you don't replace the stock TIM, the thing should last and not require replacing periodically. Of course how much of a headache it will be for OCing is an entirely different matter.
Or to use a liquid metal TIM. Guess we'll see how the existing TIM works as soon as reviews go out. Maybe it doesn't suck as much as Kaby Lake, maybe it does.
Or to use a liquid metal TIM. Guess we'll see how the existing TIM works as soon as reviews go out. Maybe it doesn't suck as much as Kaby Lake, maybe it does.
Intel has a single process for packaging (and it all happens in the same south-east Asia factory). By now, I would stop expecting any improvements in this area from Intel and just accept the reality of the delid.If the IHS to die gap is as thick as previous iterations... it won't be pretty.
Hopefully, they fixed that.
Intel has a single process for packaging (and it all happens in the same south-east Asia factory). By now, I would stop expecting any improvements in this area from Intel and just accept the reality of the delid.
If anything, the server chips are under less extreme thermal loads than client chips, due to larger die area and lower frequencies. We can wait and see, but I won't expect any major differences. As for TIM performance, I anticipate it to be sufficient for the highest TDP server chips (260 W). That will be enough for anything I care about, but probably not for 5 GHz on all cores.I'm not expecting anything. I'm just waiting to see the results. There could be variations in the manufacturing line based on product. There may be tighter controls on Intel's server line (which would make sense operationally), or there may be no changes. Have you ever worked in a manufacturing plant? It's not unusual to use different equipment for different types of runs, etc.
IIRC, the fellow that delidded the soldered 6950X got better temps with TIM...Why don't you just delid? /s
I've delidded my friend's 7700k and it's quite easy with the right tools, but it's still extremely annoying you need to do it to get acceptable temps. However, having to delid a $1000 CPU is outrageous. This makes Skylake x close to a deal breaker for me.
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I watched the der8auer video you are referring to, and well, Intel cannot even solder properly. Now compare it with the Ryzen delid.IIRC, the fellow that delidded the soldered 6950X got better temps with TIM...
I watched the der8auer video you are referring to, and well, Intel cannot even solder properly. Now compare it with the Ryzen delid.
I'm talking about the temperature difference with delid.Well, RyZen seems to be running as fast as it can out of the box.
Every process has pluses and minuses. I'm actually impressed they got the LPP process to clock as high as they did. Closer to that processes sweet spot it's a fair amount more efficient than Intel's. As a guess, the next version of Ryzen will be on their LPU process. It'll clock a bit higher, but lose a little efficiency.Well, RyZen seems to be running as fast as it can out of the box.
I'm talking about soldering probably not giving RyZen much benefit. Or Broadwell-E.I'm talking about the temperature difference with delid.
Brodwell-E temperatures dropped by 4 degrees, Haswell-E by 8, because the solder layer was too thick. Direct die with Conductonaut on Ryzen resulted in 3 degree delta in maximums and only 1 degree average.I'm talking about soldering probably not giving RyZen much benefit. Or Broadwell-E.