who's the best baseball player in the MLB right now?

[KGB]

So what stats are "meaningful?" And why is WAR so useless?

Read it:

"Wins Above Replacement, commonly known as WAR, is a non-standardized sabermetric baseball statistic that is used to show how many more wins a player would give a team as opposed to a "replacement level", or minor league/bench player at that position. While WAR values are scaled equally for pitchers and hitters, the result is calculated differently for pitchers versus position players: position players are evaluated using statistics for fielding and hitting, while pitchers are evaluated using statistics related to the opposing batters' hits, walks and strikeouts.

There is no clearly established formula for WAR. Sites that provide the statistic, such as Baseball Prospectus, Fangraphs, and Baseball Reference, all calculate it differently. However, all of these sites calculate the value of WAR using these principles, and each site publicly acknowledges how they calculate their individual WAR values."

 

[rcpratt]

Read it:

"Wins Above Replacement, commonly known as WAR, is a non-standardized sabermetric baseball statistic that is used to show how many more wins a player would give a team as opposed to a "replacement level", or minor league/bench player at that position. While WAR values are scaled equally for pitchers and hitters, the result is calculated differently for pitchers versus position players: position players are evaluated using statistics for fielding and hitting, while pitchers are evaluated using statistics related to the opposing batters' hits, walks and strikeouts.

There is no clearly established formula for WAR. Sites that provide the statistic, such as Baseball Prospectus, Fangraphs, and Baseball Reference, all calculate it differently. However, all of these sites calculate the value of WAR using these principles, and each site publicly acknowledges how they calculate their individual WAR values."

All that says to me is that it's meaningless to compare FG WAR to BP WAR, etc. Which nobody was doing.

 

[BeauJangles]

Read it:

"Wins Above Replacement, commonly known as WAR, is a non-standardized sabermetric baseball statistic that is used to show how many more wins a player would give a team as opposed to a "replacement level", or minor league/bench player at that position. While WAR values are scaled equally for pitchers and hitters, the result is calculated differently for pitchers versus position players: position players are evaluated using statistics for fielding and hitting, while pitchers are evaluated using statistics related to the opposing batters' hits, walks and strikeouts.

There is no clearly established formula for WAR. Sites that provide the statistic, such as Baseball Prospectus, Fangraphs, and Baseball Reference, all calculate it differently. However, all of these sites calculate the value of WAR using these principles, and each site publicly acknowledges how they calculate their individual WAR values."

Have you ever actually looked at how WAR is computed or is this your knee jerk reaction?

edit: I only ask because I bet that you accept that OBP is a "real" stat, yet ten years ago you would have been arguing against that "nonsense," too.

 

[mike2fix]

The talk about Ichiro is interesting, I have watched him since he arrived in Seattle. I watch most of the Mariners games and have for years. He has been fun to watch, some of the things he could do are beyond belief but this year he has literally been aging before my eyes. I have been amazed/saddened by the plays he can no longer make and his hitting has dropped off as well, he just looks bad flailing at some pitches, he never much did that in the past. He is known for taking care of himself but Mother nature has the last word and she has impacted his abilities significantly.

 

[SP33Demon]

And, while we're at it, I just want to point out why Votto (besides the raw numbers) is "better" -- he's younger and cheaper. You can build a team around him and he delivers numbers better than Berkman without the $14.5 million dollar price tag which means that the Reds can invest in other positions of need. He's less of an injury risk and he's less of a decline risk.

You are all over the place here. We're not talking about who to invest in for the future. If I had a choice, it'd be Adrian Gonzales over Votto.

I agree, Kemp and Reyes are ahead of Berkman. Nowhere did I say that he was better than either in any post.

I don't like fangraph's calculation of WAR, simply because Baseball-ref uses a better metric IMO. Total runs is an actual value vs FIP's predictive value. But I'm not here to debate that. If you're really worried, take an average of the two and Kemp is still ahead of Reyes by a full half a point (which is significant for both sites).
BTW, not sure if Fangraphs is still using straight UZR but a regressed UZR would be much more favorable for defense just as TA said last year:
http://triplesalley.wordpress.com/2010/09/19/looking-at-fangraphs-position-player-war/

So far in 2011, Reyes has been just as shitty IMO. Let's see how they both finish out the year. I love how you try to duck and dodge when the fact of the matter is you slammed Berkman's defense but put Reyes as your top pick in the NL. I just call a spade a spade, baseball ref's dWAR doesn't lie. And just going off the numbers alone, Berkman has 3 errors vs Reyes' 9. Both have .968 fielding percentages.

If you want to do some predicting, I'm going to predict that the MVP will go to Braun or Votto. I highly doubt Kemp or Reyes or Berkman will be able to sustain their pace but who knows?

 

[BrokenVisage]

There was an unearned lead-off home run in last night's Red Sox/Brewers game, first since 1979, go figure.

Also a bit of trivia, the national anthem officially started being played/sang before every game since World War II. So what happened in 2002 that ended the "streak" of that tradition?

 

[BeauJangles]

You are all over the place here. We're not talking about who to invest in for the future. If I had a choice, it'd be Adrian Gonzales over Votto.

Defining what you mean by "best" is incredibly difficult. Yeah, a guy like Pujols or circa 2004 A-Rod might be the best hitter in baseball, but that doesn't necessarily make him the best player in the game, especially because teams deal with the reality of budget constraints.

I agree, Kemp and Reyes are ahead of Berkman. Nowhere did I say that he was better than either in any post.

Okay.

I don't like fangraph's calculation of WAR, simply because Baseball-ref uses a better metric IMO. Total runs is an actual value vs FIP's predictive value. But I'm not here to debate that. If you're really worried, take an average of the two and Kemp is still ahead of Reyes by a full half a point (which is significant for both sites).

Different strokes for different folks. They both have value and the reality for each player probably resides somewhere in the middle. Good point on the TR vs FIP.

BTW, not sure if Fangraphs is still using straight UZR but a regressed UZR would be much more favorable for defense just as TA said last year:
http://triplesalley.wordpress.com/2010/09/19/looking-at-fangraphs-position-player-war/

Agreed 100% on the volatility of UZR.

So far in 2011, Reyes has been just as shitty IMO. Let's see how they both finish out the year. I love how you try to duck and dodge when the fact of the matter is you slammed Berkman's defense but put Reyes as your top pick in the NL.

Reyes has been a better defender by most metrics. He isn't great, but it seems he's been right around league average, unless I'm missing some number right now. I don't think Reyes is the best player in the NL. He's in the conversation, but I'd probably take Votto over him.

If you want to do some predicting, I'm going to predict that the MVP will go to Braun or Votto. I highly doubt Kemp or Reyes or Berkman will be able to sustain their pace but who knows?

Kemp's BABIP scares me. It isn't that much higher than his career avg, but I don't think he's going to keep it up. Barring injury, Berkman will probably finish with a better year.

Votto for MVP.

 

[SP33Demon]

There was an unearned lead-off home run in last night's Red Sox/Brewers game, first since 1979, go figure.

Also a bit of trivia, the national anthem officially started being played/sang before every game since World War II. So what happened in 2002 that ended the "streak" of that tradition?

Something related to 9/11?

 

[SP33Demon]

Kemp's BABIP scares me. It isn't that much higher than his career avg, but I don't think he's going to keep it up. Barring injury, Berkman will probably finish with a better year.

Votto for MVP.

Yeah Kemp fell off last year towards the end. May do the same thing. Berkman will probably come back to earth but he has solid protection to see fastballs.

Votto, I could buy that. He's slightly better than Braun at average and hits in a better hitter's park.

 

[BrokenVisage]

Something related to 9/11?

Nope. Think north of New York.

And if not for interleague play it probably would have never happened.

 

[SP33Demon]

Nope. Think north of New York.

And if not for interleague play it probably would have never happened.

So it was just for one particular game? or a league-wide event?

 

[BrokenVisage]

So it was just for one particular game? or a league-wide event?

It was in however many games were played in a series between 2 teams in 2002.

 

[SP33Demon]

Ah, Toronto and the Expos before they moved to DC.

 

[BrokenVisage]

Ah, Toronto and the Expos before they moved to DC.

there ya go!

 

[Rastus]

In Soviet Canukistan, national anthem sings you.