Why are Europeans so offended by US patriotism?

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Zebo

Elite Member
Jul 29, 2001
39,398
19
81
Originally posted by: Scipionix
Originally posted by: kenleung
Keep in mind that most of western Europe is VERY socialistic (EXCELLENT benefits) and they think we're all greedy :/ Their standard of living might even be higher than here and IN GENERAL they have a lower crime rate.
Not quite. Their standard of living is not even close. Have you been to Europe recently? We are at least 50% wealthier. "VERY socialistic" means they pay 60% of their income in taxes and have shitty health care. The crime rate is not much lower either and in some places is much higher. Our economy is growing so much faster than theirs that Europe will be the third world compared to us in 30 years.

I have to disagree on this one. Have you been to europe lately? Well I have since my family is there, Sweden to be exact which you'd call the most socailistic of all. One cousin, about thirty, is a bricklayer and owns a huge modern home and makes awesome cash compared to his US counterparts. Another is a dentist she makes about 2X what he makes and still lives well. It's just different, no ones as rich as here but no one is as poor either. All the streets are immaculate and homes are kept pristine. I would move there in a heartbeat if I did'nt have a family here and could handle the cold.

As far Europeans offended I never seen that but they do call me Cowboy
 

drag

Elite Member
Jul 4, 2002
8,708
0
0
USA rocks because we can tell our government to #$@#-off and they can't do anything about. It's not our government or policies or whatever that made USA great. It is the people. People are allowed to live their lives the way they see fit. Welfare, taxes, and restrictive laws are what keeps a country down. The natural human spirit is freedom loving, responsible, and charitable. We don't need a government to make us do the right things and well.

Socialism sucks the life out of the country becuase it stiffles man's self intrest. Humans don't need a dole or subsidised food in order to survive and be happy. You take away money from people by threat of force and imprisonment and then give it food producers so those same people can afford the food and tell them to greatful for the favor, how does that make sense? It doesn't and it is a lie. It is just a way for those in power to retain their power and make people afraid to stand up for themselves by thinking they need some sort of overlord or protector in order to enjoy life and not fear for their future.

look at this

People naturally will look out for those that can't help themselves and don't need a police force avilable to enforce charity.

We in the USA try to keep this type of government bad behavior down to a minimum. There are those (morons) that wish to turn this country into a socialist state, however I chalk this bad thinking up to a lack of proper education and the over abundance of propaganda from quasa-communistic orginizations like Greenpeace in our media.

If Americans think a law is unjust we will do everything in our power to circumvent it, it is our duty to break unjust laws (think Martin Luther King and the civil disobediance movemnt). We depend on the people's ability for self-government so we only have to depend a bare essential external government to protect and honor the people's liberty. That is why religon has to play a large part in the dialy lives of the people. Without a beleif in a higher power life freedom and liberty are illogical and a democracy begins to break down becuase the people become scared of those around them and things they don't understand, they then create a artifical higher power the ease lifes uncertianies. That's why bastards like government of communistic china squash religous thought at every opportunity -They only want the people to be beholdent to one force.. themselves (such is the communist's new religon: "a bright new future": a lie).

When Bill Cliton created a budgitory crisis and shut the government down (the only good thing to come from his administration), most everybody felt as if had a weight lifted. Nobody freaked out. Everything ran like clockwork, the only weird thing that happened was they could swear on the radio because the FCC shut down, nobody gave a s#$t.

Our government for the past 30 years or so has been acting a bit weird and trying to grasp power. It is coming close to time to bitch slap the government (peacefully ofcourse) to teach them whose boss.

That is why we seem to have a very arrogent foriegn policy. Because every desicion (treaty) has to be ratified by the people's representatives (congress) and if we don't like it it ain't going to happen. Now this is not completely perfect system and every once of the while the government will get away with something naughty, but we try to keep it to a minimum.

If the European governments had the same respect for the people as we try to force our government to have the US would not be the only world superpower. It is not the obsession of every American to dominate the world. We are "number 1" because freedom = success thats all, however if someone thinks they can screw with us they are mistaken. If anybody was try to break into my home and pose a threat to me or my family, they should considure himself a dead man. I feel that all USA is is my home and every American belongs to my extended family. Most everybody here feels the same as I do and we expect our government to carry out the will of the people.

This is America's sense of pride and our source of nationalism. All of us are Americans, not nessicarialy because we were born here, but because all of us know we can have something better and we welcome likeminded individuals. We accept unskilled inviduals every day, it just that we have set up ways to make this happen and we don't want masses of people coming here everyday to take advantage of us.
 

CrowDog

Golden Member
Jun 7, 2001
1,709
8
81
Early "Americans" have acomplished what Hitler set out to do, Genocide. This country was stolen.... Columbus was a murderer of women and children.... And all this Patriotic talk makes me sick.
 

pallander

Banned
Dec 5, 2001
533
0
0
Originally posted by: Riprorin
It's not like most of us think the socialist European countries suck, it just that we're proud of our country.

I'll admit that some of our displays of patriotism are a little over the top, but why is that so offensive?


well,I dont consider it offensive but perhaps people feel like it is kind of disrespect to other countries saying we are number 1.I think it is
something good to be proud over ones country though..but respect to other,smaller,poorer countries is also very important.


 

CrowDog

Golden Member
Jun 7, 2001
1,709
8
81
Hreres some cut and paste history of Columbus...a day this country has a holiday after:

Because Columbus captured more Indian slaves than he could transport to Spain in his small ships, he put them to work in mines and plantations which he, his family and followers created throughout the Caribbean. His marauding band hunted Indians for sport and profit -- beating, raping, torturing, killing, and then using the Indian bodies as food for their hunting dogs. Within four years of Columbus' arrival on Hispaniola, his men had killed or exported one-third of the original Indian population of 300,000. Within another 50 years, the Taino people had been made extinct -- the first casualties of the holocaust of American Indians. The plantation owners then turned to the American mainland and to Africa for new slaves to follow the tragic path of the Taino.

This was the great cultural encounter initiated by Christopher Columbus. This is the event we celebrate each year on Columbus Day. The United States honors only two men with federal holidays bearing their names. In January we commemorate the birth of Martin Luther King, Jr., who struggled to lift the blinders of racial prejudice and to cut the remaining bonds of slavery in America. In October, we honor Christopher Columbus, who opened the Atlantic slave trade and launched one of the greatest waves of genocide known in history.



We may aswell have a holiday called "Hitler Day"!
 

Amused

Elite Member
Apr 14, 2001
56,001
14,528
146
Originally posted by: CrowDog
Early "Americans" have acomplished what Hitler set out to do, Genocide. This country was stolen.... Columbus was a murderer of women and children.... And all this Patriotic talk makes me sick.

Fusking whiner. Columbus was European. The US didn't exist for another 300 years.

And the Indians themselves weren't saints either. The Euros simply had better technology. Do you honestly think it would have been any different were the tables turned and a post-iron age Aztec culture discovered a pre-bronze age Europe?
 

VFAA

Golden Member
Jun 3, 2001
1,176
0
0
Sounds like most of you people don't know jack about 'socialist' government. I've traveled Europe last year and visited most Eastern European countries. It's awsome over there. There's no prejudice, like most of you wieners state (and I'm guessing you haven't even been out travelling out of your own state). Yes, there is an idiot, or two like in every country who just hates everybody or some culture in perticular. If you had a close encounter with such individual, don't assume the whole Europe is like that.

How many of you been to Germany lately? Italy? Spain? European people are damn proud of themselves and their culture. They are great patriots as well.
 

Tominator

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 1999
9,559
1
0
Socialism is a joke. The European countries exclude nearly every form of immigration and have fierce protection of their markets via very strict laws. Take your European country and let in the percentage of immigrants the US does and that country would turn belly up like a dead carp.

The US rebuilt most of Europe about 60 years ago and much of the debt was forgiven. Need we talk about the Euro and how it is the Dollar that props it up? How about the billions spent by the US trying to protect Europe mostly from each other?
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
72,699
6,196
126
Humans have an absurd characteristic that what ever they are, that's the best. Until you have delt with that rung, you aren't even on the ladder.
 

Dually

Golden Member
Dec 20, 2000
1,628
0
0
Originally posted by: glenn1
Why are Europeans so offended by US patriotism?

I think many Europeans find it hard to distinguish patriotism from nationalism. Considering that the European experiences with nationalism over the years have typically tended to wind up in extremely bloody conflicts, the concept has left somewhat of a bad taste in their mouths, and it tends to be seen as a negative trait.

European experiments with any form of government or politics have lead to long bloody conflicts.
 

Booster

Diamond Member
May 4, 2002
4,380
0
0
I think that Europeans are 'offended' b/c they envy, yes, and b/c they realize how much they lag behind. I don't believe that the EU can ever become really integrated and strong community. They are people of different race, language and they used to hate each other and kill each other not so long ago. It's only a matter of time before the EU starts to experience integrity problems. They understand it and envy the US stability, I think.

I think that the US is very popular right now across the world. You see people wearing 'USA' t-shirts and American type clothes, the same people who used to hate the US not so long ago. And they eat at McDonald's (LOL , what does it have to do with the US, anyway? But an average client still thinks it's American).

I'm pretty sure that the problem of the Europeans, and not only of them is the cultural crisis. That's why France regulates the amount of US movies to be shown on the TV. People from all over the world watch American movies, but their cultures are so different that it's hard for them to accept the differences. Europeans realize that only US movies are the best, have the biggest budget etc. The influence of American movie making industry is great, it has altered their perception of life somehow. Nowadays you often hear people saying 'OK' even though it has never existed in their own languages.

To sum it up, Europeans, I think, envy the neatness and integrity of American culture. It's something they were never able to achieve.
 
Aug 10, 2001
10,424
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I don't think that western European countries are any more offended today than they were 5, 10, or even 20 years ago. It's just that since September 11th, we (Americans) have been more sensitive when it comes to what other countries think of us.
 

Nefrodite

Banned
Feb 15, 2001
7,931
0
0
I'm pretty sure that the problem of the Europeans, and not only of them is the cultural crisis. That's why France regulates the amount of US movies to be shown on the TV. People from all over the world watch American movies, but their cultures are so different that it's hard for them to accept the differences. Europeans realize that only US movies are the best, have the biggest budget etc. The influence of American movie making industry is great, it has altered their perception of life somehow. Nowadays you often hear people saying 'OK' even though it has never existed in their own languages.

To sum it up, Europeans, I think, envy the neatness and integrity of American culture. It's something they were never able to achieve.


heh yea, for the first half of our existence we looked to europe as the peak of culture we no longer do that. course we still buy mercedes/bmw and stupid over priced designer cloths though they should be happy for that


and the french.. sign always so paranoid about losing their pathetic culture


Sounds like most of you people don't know jack about 'socialist' government. I've traveled Europe last year and visited most Eastern European countries. It's awsome over there. There's no prejudice, like most of you wieners state (and I'm guessing you haven't even been out travelling out of your own state). Yes, there is an idiot, or two like in every country who just hates everybody or some culture in perticular. If you had a close encounter with such individual, don't assume the whole Europe is like that.

How many of you been to Germany lately? Italy? Spain? European people are damn proud of themselves and their culture. They are great patriots as well.


you got the tourist impression. did you live in those countries for a while? there are right wing racist groups in many of their governments gaining power. trying to limit immigration etc. theres ugliness in their societies too, prejudice certainly exists.



Early "Americans" have acomplished what Hitler set out to do, Genocide. This country was stolen.... Columbus was a murderer of women and children.... And all this Patriotic talk makes me sick.

or perhaps the indians should have had better immune systems that was 300 years ago sheesh. indians killed a fair number of white people too many early europeans founded themselves on genocide too. cept they killed other kinds of white people oddly enough. that and the ugliness of colonialism screwing up china and africa for ages. europeans started the two world wars. europeans wouldn't help fleeing jews during ww2. many european countries were complicit in their extermination after being taken over. atleast we still live with american indians. what do you do for jews? ah yes, europe is firmly behind the terrorist palestinians hateful bunch still..



 

WhiteWonder

Diamond Member
Feb 22, 2001
3,168
0
0
Originally posted by: Scipionix
Originally posted by: TheOmegaCode
Main Entry: An·glo
Pronunciation: 'a[ng]-(")glO
Function: noun
Inflected Form(s): plural Anglos
Etymology: in sense 2, from American Spanish, short for Spanish angloamericano Anglo-American
Date: 1800
1 : ANGLO-AMERICAN
2 : a white inhabitant of the U.S. of non-Hispanic descent
- Anglo adjective
I am fully aware of the dictionary definition. It was wrong then and it is wrong now.

HAHAHA, then take it up with Webster, or you could always move to a remote part of the world and make up your own language
 

Scipionix

Golden Member
May 30, 2002
1,408
0
0
Originally posted by: WhiteWonder
HAHAHA, then take it up with Webster, or you could always move to a remote part of the world and make up your own language
Hey, if Mexicans want to be total racists, that's fine with me. At least there is nothing technically incorrect about beloved patriot. I'm just not gonna listen to any whining about "racism" while crap like this continues.
 

TheOmegaCode

Platinum Member
Aug 7, 2001
2,954
1
0
Originally posted by: Scipionix
Originally posted by: WhiteWonder
HAHAHA, then take it up with Webster, or you could always move to a remote part of the world and make up your own language
Hey, if Mexicans want to be total racists, that's fine with me. At least there is nothing technically incorrect about beloved patriot. I'm just not gonna listen to any whining about "racism" while crap like this continues.
Who the hell is whining about racism? You're the one making a big deal over who gets called what...
 

WhiteWonder

Diamond Member
Feb 22, 2001
3,168
0
0
Originally posted by: Scipionix
Originally posted by: WhiteWonder
HAHAHA, then take it up with Webster, or you could always move to a remote part of the world and make up your own language
Hey, if Mexicans want to be total racists, that's fine with me. At least there is nothing technically incorrect about beloved patriot. I'm just not gonna listen to any whining about "racism" while crap like this continues.

are we still talking about the same thing? i'm white, anglo doesn't make me think of racism crap......
 

VFAA

Golden Member
Jun 3, 2001
1,176
0
0
Quote

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Sounds like most of you people don't know jack about 'socialist' government. I've traveled Europe last year and visited most Eastern European countries. It's awsome over there. There's no prejudice, like most of you wieners state (and I'm guessing you haven't even been out travelling out of your own state). Yes, there is an idiot, or two like in every country who just hates everybody or some culture in perticular. If you had a close encounter with such individual, don't assume the whole Europe is like that.

How many of you been to Germany lately? Italy? Spain? European people are damn proud of themselves and their culture. They are great patriots as well.
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you got the tourist impression. did you live in those countries for a while? there are right wing racist groups in many of their governments gaining power. trying to limit immigration etc. theres ugliness in their societies too, prejudice certainly exists


Yes, I actually lived in Europe (Germany, Poland, France ((grandparents are French)) and now Canada - was always Canadian), so I know what the hell I'm talking about. I also major in world history at UofT. I know much has changed in Europe and almost every city there looks like your every day American/Canadian city.
 

Lithium381

Lifer
May 12, 2001
12,458
2
0
Originally posted by: bonk102
because we are celebrating freedom from Europe?


Hah, maybe bugs 'em a little....however, Mexico celebrates it's independance from Spain....they do it here too....strange, very strange
 

Martin

Lifer
Jan 15, 2000
29,178
1
81
Originally posted by: Tominator
Socialism is a joke. The European countries exclude nearly every form of immigration and have fierce protection of their markets via very strict laws. Take your European country and let in the percentage of immigrants the US does and that country would turn belly up like a dead carp.


How ironic coming from an american. The US just put tarrifs on softwood lumber from BC and imported steel., but that's not protectionsim, that's patriotism, right? Its only protectionsim if its in Europe.
And lets not forget, just like europe has its far right leaders calling for expulsion of immigrants etc, so does the US, with poeple like Buchanan.

 

Nefrodite

Banned
Feb 15, 2001
7,931
0
0
what i really don't like about europe? their paranoia against GE foods grumble...fear mongers..
 

Jimmyjammer

Member
Apr 30, 2002
141
0
0
Why are Europeans so offended by US patriotism?

Well if you take into account the following:

1) The most obvious American tourist abroad is 99% of the time the loudest, most annoying and generally quite stupid. Most 'normal' Americans would agree and be shamed by the image those loud ones were projecting, but they're intelligent and quiet and that doesn't stick in people's memories. The loud annoying ones do.

2) America dominates the media and Europeans get an awful lot of dreaful American movies/TV shows (and some very good ones) and have no one to tell them that that isn't ALL that America is about.

3) As America dominates the media, any example of American *anything* (be it patriotism, stupidity, excellence) is repeated and repeated throughout the world, via different channels.

4)There's a certain cycnicism that exists in Europe, as opposed to a generally wide-eyed innocence/naivete that many American's have (although that's fading fast!).


You put all the above together and you'll annoy many people. The more educated, travelled and experienced the people are, the less likely you'll find them annoyed at American patriotism. The funny thing is that any country, were in it America's situation, would get the same amount of flak, maybe they'd learn to be less vocal but in America's case even a whisper is a roar.

 
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