Why are you patriotic?

[piasabird]

Originally posted by: Elias824
only in america can a poor black boy, become a rich white man.

The thing that eludes most people is they beleive they can not succeed so they dont try. If you truly believe you can succeed then you go out and do what it takes. I am kind of on the lazy side myself and could probably be doing better if I just applied myself better. However, often we get into a rut and become complacent.

If everyone you know is not successful then maybe you have no role models. However, the most difficult thing to do is to convice yourself that you can succeed.

 

[jonks]

Was it Carlin?

Be happy you were born in america, don't be proud.

 

[Adam8281]

Originally posted by: Elias824
only in america can a poor black boy, become a rich white man.

Which is why Michael Jackson is the paradigmatic patriot.

Seriously, I agree with many of the previous posters, and will only add: because it is mine. It's appropriate to have love and affinity and pride in what is yours, in where you are from and in what formed you to be who you are. I feel affection and pride for my hometown even while I know that from some "objective" viewpoint it's not necessarily exceptional. I feel similarly for my country, although more intensely (and honestly believing that it is exceptional, unlike my home town), and I think of this as patriotism.

 

[TallBill]

Because I was born in America.. I'd probably be patriotic if I was born elsewhere.

 

[Muse]

Originally posted by: jonks
Was it Carlin?

Be happy you were born in america, don't be proud.

Esto.

 

[manowar821]

Originally posted by: mxyzptlk

Originally posted by: Oceandevi
I am human. I love my species despite it's shortcomings. The elders of my local landmass do not concern me.

this works for me.

Nationalism/patriotism is about as stupid as sports team or console fanboyism... but worse because the fanboys have literal armies.

Agreed.

 

[Craig234]

I think one thing to do first is to define patriotic.

Does it mean appreciating your country, or saying your country is the best in everything?

Does it mean not finding fault in your country, or finding constructive criticism? (See my sig for this issue).

Does it mean "my country right or wrong", or "my country right, and try to make it right when it's not"?

Michael Parenti wrote an interesting book called "Supertpatriotim" about those people who are rabidly patriotic, but don't really know why they are. It's worth a read.

Here's his summary of the boook:

Superpatriots are those people who place national pride and American supremacy above every other public consideration, those who follow leaders uncritically, especially in their war policies abroad. Superpatriotism is the nationalistic hype propagated by officialdom, the media, and various flag-waving groups.

Michael Parenti demonstrates how superpatriotism attaches itself to religion, sports, the military, the schools, and big business. He questions whether its top politico-economic propagators are themselves really patriotic, given how they evade taxes, export our jobs, pollute our land, and plunder the public treasury.

With incisive probing, fine style, and humorous touch, Parenti treats such urgent questions as: What does it mean to love one?s country? Why is it so important to be Number One? What determines America?s ?greatness?? And are we really God's gift to humanity? He examines how US leaders and the corporate media fan the flames of fear to win support for huge arms budgets, global aggrandizement, and the suppression of political dissent at home and abroad.

Finally, he poses an alternative to superpatriotism, arguing that the real patriots are those who care enough to educate themselves about our country?s history and its present plight. He reminds us that it is not ?anti-American? to criticize unjust social conditions at home or oppose global policies pursued by our rulers. Rather it is our democratic right and patriotic duty to do so.

 

[palehorse]

Originally posted by: Craig234
I think one thing to do first is to define patriotic.

Does it mean appreciating your country, or saying your country is the best in everything?

Does it mean not finding fault in your country, or finding constructive criticism? (See my sig for this issue).

Does it mean "my country right or wrong", or "my country right, and try to make it right when it's not"?

Michael Parenti wrote an interesting book called "Supertpatriotim" about those people who are rabidly patriotic, but don't really know why they are. It's worth a read.

Here's his summary of the boook:

Superpatriots are those people who place national pride and American supremacy above every other public consideration, those who follow leaders uncritically, especially in their war policies abroad. Superpatriotism is the nationalistic hype propagated by officialdom, the media, and various flag-waving groups.

Michael Parenti demonstrates how superpatriotism attaches itself to religion, sports, the military, the schools, and big business. He questions whether its top politico-economic propagators are themselves really patriotic, given how they evade taxes, export our jobs, pollute our land, and plunder the public treasury.

With incisive probing, fine style, and humorous touch, Parenti treats such urgent questions as: What does it mean to love one?s country? Why is it so important to be Number One? What determines America?s ?greatness?? And are we really God's gift to humanity? He examines how US leaders and the corporate media fan the flames of fear to win support for huge arms budgets, global aggrandizement, and the suppression of political dissent at home and abroad.

Finally, he poses an alternative to superpatriotism, arguing that the real patriots are those who care enough to educate themselves about our country?s history and its present plight. He reminds us that it is not ?anti-American? to criticize unjust social conditions at home or oppose global policies pursued by our rulers. Rather it is our democratic right and patriotic duty to do so.

how about you go out on a limb and tell us why you are patriotic, or why you're not...?

Feel free to use your own definition just like the rest of us have.

I can't wait to read it.

 

[Paladin3]

Originally posted by: miketheidiot

Originally posted by: Jaskalas

Originally posted by: DaveSimmons
Though flawed, the US used to set an example of freedom, democracy, progress, and the right to "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness."

Bush has spent his time in office grinding the constitution and our reputation into the mud, but I have some hope that Obama will restore at least some of our good name.

Here's the answer to your hope.

Does Obama believe in the government or in the people? Which will he empower?

I already know, any speech of his makes it perfectly clear, but I figured I would pose the thought to you since you view it so differently. As for Bush, yeah ? so much for the opposition to government expansion. They turned tail and joined the Democrats.
-snip-

what exactly are these founding principles?

FREEDOM. Pure and simple. The ability to do what I want to do, to the extent that I don't hurt anyone else, with as little government interference as possible.

Has Bush given me more freedom? No. Will Obama or any of the dems give me more freedom with their "change"? Hell no!

All politicians want the same thing: POWER. Obama and the dems are going to get it via bigger government and making the American people as reliant on them for as many of their daily needs as possible. They'll do it with their social engineering, environmentalism, and redistribution of "opportunity" until they are the ones at the top holding the strings on which we all dance. And they'll make us pay for it.

I'm patriotic in the sense that I believe we should all stand together and defend this country against any threat because this is still the best place on the Earth to live. So it really saddens me that the American people have proven they are a bunch of idiots who will sacrifice freedom for a pocket full of freebies and the empty promise of "change". There is nothing inherently special or unique about that.

 

[Red Dawn]

It's been ingrained into me.

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: palehorse
I never understood why so many people, including some here, think it's wrong to simply love one's country for the sake of loving one's country. Doing so does not inherently mean that you believe your country is always right. Nor does it mean that one must forsake all other countries to love his own. It simply means that you have a very strong attachment to your own country's land, people, and history.

It's my home. I love my home. I will fight to the death to defend my home against all enemies, foreign and domestic.

The problem is sometimes we are our own worse enemy.

 

[Robor]

Originally posted by: Paladin3
Has Bush given me more freedom? No. Will Obama or any of the dems give me more freedom with their "change"? Hell no!

All politicians want the same thing: POWER. Obama and the dems are going to get it via bigger government and making the American people as reliant on them for as many of their daily needs as possible. They'll do it with their social engineering, environmentalism, and redistribution of "opportunity" until they are the ones at the top holding the strings on which we all dance. And they'll make us pay for it.

I'm patriotic in the sense that I believe we should all stand together and defend this country against any threat because this is still the best place on the Earth to live. So it really saddens me that the American people have proven they are a bunch of idiots who will sacrifice freedom for a pocket full of freebies and the empty promise of "change". There is nothing inherently special or unique about that.

Piss off you hack.

 

[Robor]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: palehorse
I never understood why so many people, including some here, think it's wrong to simply love one's country for the sake of loving one's country. Doing so does not inherently mean that you believe your country is always right. Nor does it mean that one must forsake all other countries to love his own. It simply means that you have a very strong attachment to your own country's land, people, and history.

It's my home. I love my home. I will fight to the death to defend my home against all enemies, foreign and domestic.

The problem is sometimes we are our own worse enemy.

Then it is up to us to fix it, right?

 

[SP33Demon]

Originally posted by: Paladin3

Originally posted by: miketheidiot

Originally posted by: Jaskalas

Originally posted by: DaveSimmons
Though flawed, the US used to set an example of freedom, democracy, progress, and the right to "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness."

Bush has spent his time in office grinding the constitution and our reputation into the mud, but I have some hope that Obama will restore at least some of our good name.

Here's the answer to your hope.

Does Obama believe in the government or in the people? Which will he empower?

I already know, any speech of his makes it perfectly clear, but I figured I would pose the thought to you since you view it so differently. As for Bush, yeah ? so much for the opposition to government expansion. They turned tail and joined the Democrats.
-snip-

what exactly are these founding principles?

FREEDOM. Pure and simple. The ability to do what I want to do, to the extent that I don't hurt anyone else, with as little government interference as possible.

Has Bush given me more freedom? No. Will Obama or any of the dems give me more freedom with their "change"? Hell no!

All politicians want the same thing: POWER. Obama and the dems are going to get it via bigger government and making the American people as reliant on them for as many of their daily needs as possible. They'll do it with their social engineering, environmentalism, and redistribution of "opportunity" until they are the ones at the top holding the strings on which we all dance. And they'll make us pay for it.

I'm patriotic in the sense that I believe we should all stand together and defend this country against any threat because this is still the best place on the Earth to live. So it really saddens me that the American people have proven they are a bunch of idiots who will sacrifice freedom for a pocket full of freebies and the empty promise of "change". There is nothing inherently special or unique about that.

The "empty promise of change" is better than no promise at all. Take your blinders off.

 

[Paladin3]

Originally posted by: Robor

Originally posted by: Paladin3
Has Bush given me more freedom? No. Will Obama or any of the dems give me more freedom with their "change"? Hell no!

All politicians want the same thing: POWER. Obama and the dems are going to get it via bigger government and making the American people as reliant on them for as many of their daily needs as possible. They'll do it with their social engineering, environmentalism, and redistribution of "opportunity" until they are the ones at the top holding the strings on which we all dance. And they'll make us pay for it.

I'm patriotic in the sense that I believe we should all stand together and defend this country against any threat because this is still the best place on the Earth to live. So it really saddens me that the American people have proven they are a bunch of idiots who will sacrifice freedom for a pocket full of freebies and the empty promise of "change". There is nothing inherently special or unique about that.

Piss off you hack.

Either contribute to the discussion or come up with a more entertaining insult next time.

Thanks

 

[Paladin3]

Originally posted by: SP33Demon

Originally posted by: Paladin3

Originally posted by: miketheidiot

Originally posted by: Jaskalas

Originally posted by: DaveSimmons
Though flawed, the US used to set an example of freedom, democracy, progress, and the right to "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness."

Bush has spent his time in office grinding the constitution and our reputation into the mud, but I have some hope that Obama will restore at least some of our good name.

Here's the answer to your hope.

Does Obama believe in the government or in the people? Which will he empower?

I already know, any speech of his makes it perfectly clear, but I figured I would pose the thought to you since you view it so differently. As for Bush, yeah ? so much for the opposition to government expansion. They turned tail and joined the Democrats.
-snip-

what exactly are these founding principles?

FREEDOM. Pure and simple. The ability to do what I want to do, to the extent that I don't hurt anyone else, with as little government interference as possible.

Has Bush given me more freedom? No. Will Obama or any of the dems give me more freedom with their "change"? Hell no!

All politicians want the same thing: POWER. Obama and the dems are going to get it via bigger government and making the American people as reliant on them for as many of their daily needs as possible. They'll do it with their social engineering, environmentalism, and redistribution of "opportunity" until they are the ones at the top holding the strings on which we all dance. And they'll make us pay for it.

I'm patriotic in the sense that I believe we should all stand together and defend this country against any threat because this is still the best place on the Earth to live. So it really saddens me that the American people have proven they are a bunch of idiots who will sacrifice freedom for a pocket full of freebies and the empty promise of "change". There is nothing inherently special or unique about that.

The "empty promise of change" is better than no promise at all. Take your blinders off.

I'd rather have significant and substantial change and know what it is before I vote for someone to actually implement said change. Call me a dreamer.

And it sounds like you all think I'm a Bush fan, lol!

 

[Robor]

Originally posted by: Paladin3

Originally posted by: Robor

Originally posted by: Paladin3
Has Bush given me more freedom? No. Will Obama or any of the dems give me more freedom with their "change"? Hell no!

All politicians want the same thing: POWER. Obama and the dems are going to get it via bigger government and making the American people as reliant on them for as many of their daily needs as possible. They'll do it with their social engineering, environmentalism, and redistribution of "opportunity" until they are the ones at the top holding the strings on which we all dance. And they'll make us pay for it.

I'm patriotic in the sense that I believe we should all stand together and defend this country against any threat because this is still the best place on the Earth to live. So it really saddens me that the American people have proven they are a bunch of idiots who will sacrifice freedom for a pocket full of freebies and the empty promise of "change". There is nothing inherently special or unique about that.

Piss off you hack.

Either contribute to the discussion or come up with a more entertaining insult next time.

Thanks

My response was valid. With the exception of the bolded sentence your 3 paragraphs were nothing but a 'it's all the (D)'s fault' rant.

 

[ebaycj]

Originally posted by: mxyzptlk

Originally posted by: Oceandevi
I am human. I love my species despite it's shortcomings. The elders of my local landmass do not concern me.

this works for me.

Nationalism/patriotism is about as stupid as sports team or console fanboyism... but worse because the fanboys have literal armies.

Agreed.

 

[ebaycj]

Originally posted by: Elias824
only in america can a poor black boy, become a rich white man.

I'm certain it's also possible in the UK.

 

[BoomerD]

Why? Because I love my country.

I love the things that it's SUPPOSED to stand for.

(but I fear my government...lately, it's been very unlike the things America is supposed to be)

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: Paladin3

Will Obama or any of the dems give me more freedom with their "change"? Hell no!

Obama and the dems are going to get it via bigger government and making the American people as reliant on them for as many of their daily needs as possible. They'll do it with their social engineering, environmentalism, and redistribution of "opportunity" until they are the ones at the top holding the strings on which we all dance. And they'll make us pay for it.

I'm patriotic in the sense that I believe we should all stand together and defend this country against any threat because this is still the best place on the Earth to live.

So it really saddens me that the American people have proven they are a bunch of idiots who will sacrifice freedom for a pocket full of freebies and the empty promise of "change". There is nothing inherently special or unique about that.

Wow, let's really hear you arrogance and negativity of a guy that is not even President yet.

No criticizing of your hero Bush of course that got us in this mess. :roll:

 

[StageLeft]

I am more inclined towards support of ideals rather than a country. A country should serve its people and the people serve the country only insofar as it can in turn reward them with more than they have put in. Lacking any sentience, lines on a map should not be revered or worshiped. A country represents a container of culture, economics, etc. and should be lauded due to its endorsement of them. A country is a team. It's nice to be on the winning team. If it starts to lose, you think of plays to make it start winning again, but if it's doomed to continue to lose, you find a better team. This is all immigrants have ever done in history.

 

[Dissipate]

Patriotism is for the sheeple. I fly the Black Flag.