Why Democrats should pack the courts.

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Jhhnn

IN MEMORIAM
Nov 11, 1999
62,365
14,681
136
You may be happy as Democrats that hundreds of thousands of Libertarian Party members and over a hundred thousand Green Party members are totally disenfranchised in the California vote, but try not to pretend that it's anything except massively scaled voter suppression.

In the sample ballots I saw there isn't a place to write in alternative/protest candidates for US Senate or Gov.

Upon further review, you are correct. I don't like that, either. OTOH, elections are about determining a winner so whenever the Greens, the Libertopians or anybody else gets into the top 2 during the primary they'll be on the ballot.

It's also the result of prop 14, a voter approved measure that has withstood court challenge.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Write..._Proposition_14_impact_on_write-in_candidates
 

ivwshane

Lifer
May 15, 2000
32,345
15,156
136
If you live in California and hope to vote for a Libertarian or Green Party or Independent Party or even a Republican Party candidate for Governor or Senator what are your choices? None, you are only allowed to vote for a Democratic candidate because of the way the majority Party Democrats have gamed the system.

You are literally too stupid to understand why you are wrong. As has been pointed out already in this thread, its been explained to you multiple times that the top candidates winning the most votes getting to go into the primary is about as Democratic as you can get.

Don't worry, no need to reply, we all know you'll refuse to understand and you'll continue lying about it because that's what piece of shit liars like you do, they ignore reality.
 
Jul 9, 2009
10,723
2,064
136
You are literally too stupid to understand why you are wrong. As has been pointed out already in this thread, its been explained to you multiple times that the top candidates winning the most votes getting to go into the primary is about as Democratic as you can get.

Don't worry, no need to reply, we all know you'll refuse to understand and you'll continue lying about it because that's what piece of shit liars like you do, they ignore reality.
Just don't bother whining to me about voter suppression or the rest of the partisan Democrat bullshit you asked about.
 

Paratus

Lifer
Jun 4, 2004
16,848
13,784
146
Just don't bother whining to me about voter suppression or the rest of the partisan Democrat bullshit you asked about.
True or false some California’s voted for a republican, green, or libertarian politician during the 2018 election year.
 

JSt0rm

Lifer
Sep 5, 2000
27,399
3,947
126
Upon further review, you are correct. I don't like that, either. OTOH, elections are about determining a winner so whenever the Greens, the Libertopians or anybody else gets into the top 2 during the primary they'll be on the ballot.

It's also the result of prop 14, a voter approved measure that has withstood court challenge.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Write..._Proposition_14_impact_on_write-in_candidates

the way it is now he atleast has a chance. Every election before that was decided in democratic run offs before the election.
 

Paratus

Lifer
Jun 4, 2004
16,848
13,784
146
the way it is now he atleast has a chance. Every election before that was decided in democratic run offs before the election.

It’s telling that in an election process that favors being accountable to the majority instead of the minority like the electoral college, republicans can’t compete on their ideas or policies.

Maybe the republicans should focus on winning in CA under the rules as they are instead of whining about the way they wish they were.
 

JSt0rm

Lifer
Sep 5, 2000
27,399
3,947
126
It also keep dem candidates more centered as they are wanting the same set of voters.
 

Greenman

Lifer
Oct 15, 1999
20,657
5,346
136
It wasn't a dirty trick. It's just an unintended consequence of the electoral college system. Prior to the 2000 election, we hadn't experienced that anomaly since the 1880's.

If you actually think about it at all, The way Trump won does not justify his radical agenda in the slightest. A rational politician who actually cared about the will of the people wouldn't execute such policy under these circumstances.

Which explains why he's a Republican. They don't care about that, either.
It's not an "unintended consequence" at all. It's the entire reason for having the electoral collage. It's all about the states, and making sure every state has a say in electing the president.
 

JSt0rm

Lifer
Sep 5, 2000
27,399
3,947
126
It's not an "unintended consequence" at all. It's the entire reason for having the electoral collage. It's all about the states, and making sure every state has a say in electing the president.

It should always be 1 vote equals 1 vote. People in higher density aren’t worth as much
 
Feb 4, 2009
34,703
15,951
136
It's not an "unintended consequence" at all. It's the entire reason for having the electoral collage. It's all about the states, and making sure every state has a say in electing the president.

That’s highly debatable, appears the main concern was what happens if people elect the King of England to be President or Jesus or Jeb Jones because their could have been dozens of Jeb Jones candidates spread amugst all the State. Someone smart was needed to decide.
 

umbrella39

Lifer
Jun 11, 2004
13,819
1,126
126
It should always be 1 vote equals 1 vote. People in higher density aren’t worth as much

Fucking liberal socialist talk right there...

Everyone knows registered and active voter in Wyoming should count 6x as much as the same person voting in California or Texas...

The only people who still support the antiquated and obsolete Electoral College are those who were happy twice now their minority voice gets to scream louder than the majority...

If it's such a great fucking idea institute in on the State Level for every Senate and Governor's election... Why should the people in the UP in Michigan have to let the voters from Macomb, Oakland, and Wayne Counties decide these races every 4 years...

People should NOT be punished for where they live and people who support the EC do so knowing this is 100% the case... They support it because it keeps the minority in power...
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
84,825
49,526
136
It's not an "unintended consequence" at all. It's the entire reason for having the electoral collage. It's all about the states, and making sure every state has a say in electing the president.

The primary purposes of the electoral college were:

1) first and foremost to protect slavery.
2) to prevent unqualified demagogues from getting power.

Considering the first goal was evil and the second goal a failure it’s long past time to scrap it.
 
Reactions: Zorba

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
84,825
49,526
136

Greenman

Lifer
Oct 15, 1999
20,657
5,346
136
We are both a republic and a democracy.

We really need to put civics classes back in school for people like you. It’s amazing to me that you don’t even know the basic type of government of the country you have lived in your whole life.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/volokh-conspiracy/wp/2016/11/14/the-united-states-is-both-a-republic-and-a-democracy-because-democracy-is-like-cash/
If we're going to pick nits, the US is a constitutional republic, a democratic form of government. Originally, direct voting stopped at the house, senators were chosen by the state legislature.
 

Maxima1

Diamond Member
Jan 15, 2013
3,522
759
146
If we're going to pick nits, the US is a constitutional republic, a democratic form of government. Originally, direct voting stopped at the house, senators were chosen by the state legislature.

"Democracy" and "Republic" were used interchangeably way back. It's okay to call it a representative democracy. The founders concerns were about a direct democracy. We've also added an amendment to vote directly for Senators, so there's that as well.
 

Jhhnn

IN MEMORIAM
Nov 11, 1999
62,365
14,681
136
"Democracy" and "Republic" were used interchangeably way back. It's okay to call it a representative democracy. The founders concerns were about a direct democracy. We've also added an amendment to vote directly for Senators, so there's that as well.
Yeh, the Founders understood the danger of demagogues like Trump back when the only media to amplify their message was the printing press.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
84,825
49,526
136
If we're going to pick nits, the US is a constitutional republic, a democratic form of government. Originally, direct voting stopped at the house, senators were chosen by the state legislature.

Yes, we are a democratic republic. If Taj is going to be a pedantic idiot he should at least be correct in his pedantry.

‘The US is a republic, not a democracy’ is one of my favorite things where stupid people try and sound smart, only to own themselves.
 

Jhhnn

IN MEMORIAM
Nov 11, 1999
62,365
14,681
136
It's not an "unintended consequence" at all. It's the entire reason for having the electoral collage. It's all about the states, and making sure every state has a say in electing the president.

Having a President who did not obtain a plurality of votes is an anomaly. It's only happened 4 times in our history. Prior to 2000, it hadn't happened since 1888.

The EC doesn't accomplish what you claim, anyway-

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7wC42HgLA4k
 

Steeplerot

Lifer
Mar 29, 2004
13,051
6
81
It would be nice to see electoral districts redrawn, even if it means ignoring state lines somehow. No reason my vote should be worth 1/7th of some cowpoke in Idaho that has no connection to the USA as a whole since they live near 4 people in 100 miles, and they are all white also. Nothing wrong with that, but it's so easy to fearmonger them as they are sheltered from what is going on and they have not shown a effort to learn better then getting told brown people are coming for the plastic crap they have hoarded from wal mart in their house in the middle of nowhere. Having a minority party GOP endlessly keep the majority stifled is total bs. Every election cycle and census they are just going to keep caging districts to keep them in power. This is how a banana republic keeps a few elites in power at the expense of the citizens. With that said it is a damn good strategy, it even disenfranchises people who would vote but feel the odds stacked against them and their vote is mostly useless.
 
Last edited:

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
84,825
49,526
136
It’s telling that in an election process that favors being accountable to the majority instead of the minority like the electoral college, republicans can’t compete on their ideas or policies.

Maybe the republicans should focus on winning in CA under the rules as they are instead of whining about the way they wish they were.

Taj is extremely angry that California instituted a system where the people who get the most votes win as opposed to the winners being determined by the letter after their name.
 

hal2kilo

Lifer
Feb 24, 2009
23,654
10,517
136
He is a very reliable vote when it counts, which is what matters. I would have bet a great deal of money that if Manchin’s vote had been the deciding one on Kavanaugh he would have voted against him, for example.
You have more faith than I do.
 

Zorba

Lifer
Oct 22, 1999
14,875
10,300
136
Everyone knows registered and active voter in Wyoming should count 6x as much as the same person voting in California or Texas...

This is not the real bullshit of the EC. A vote in Wyoming, California and Texas is all equally worthless. A vote in Florida or Ohio is worth 1000x a vote in any of those states. 80,000 people in three states overruled 3M in the other 47 states.

This argument just feeds the "its about state's power" crap, the truth is ~42 states have absolutely no power in a presidential election due to the partisan leanings of those states.
 
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