Why do AMD's CPUs get so much stick?

Page 2 - Seeking answers? Join the AnandTech community: where nearly half-a-million members share solutions and discuss the latest tech.

Leyawiin

Diamond Member
Nov 11, 2008
3,204
52
91
Ironically the only games I have installed right now is Fallout 4 and FIFA 16 because I just done a fresh reset of Windows, BUT here's a couple of 1440p Fallout 4 images with the frame rates (hopefully you can see them if they're not too small)

I'm uploading the actual link so you can zoom or whatever if Afterburner is a little small:

http://tinypic.com/r/v3zyq1/9

http://tinypic.com/r/j8eh6d/9

Settings:

http://tinypic.com/r/21c9rts/9

http://tinypic.com/r/2ljsy6a/9

Give me a few minutes and I'll just do FIFA if this isn't enough for you to take my word on it.

What's your view distances? You conveniently left that bit out. Regardless, you have a lot of settings turned down a lot or off altogether.
 
Last edited:

Vossy96

Junior Member
Mar 16, 2016
23
0
0
What's your view distances? You conveniently left that bit out. Regardless, you have a lot of settings turned down a lot or off altogether.

Ooops, so I did. Here:


Btw I just uploaded the video to YouTube. Just waiting for the 1440p option to become available because as of yet 360p seems to be the only quality I can choose. And yeah, I'm not running it on full ultra because even if my CPU could handle it my graphics card couldn't. The fact is, an FX 6300 on stock is running Fallout 4 on high-ultra at 1440p on playable framerates and yet for some reason, everybody on this forum is too close minded to accept it's even possible.
 
Last edited:

Vossy96

Junior Member
Mar 16, 2016
23
0
0
Here you guys go:

Now you can see clearly that it's quite stuttery and jumpy at times, but blame that on recording. Recording at full quality at 1440p was an absolute killer, so much so that I was monitoring usage on my second monitor and before I'd even got into the game, recording just the menus, and the CPU usage was at 39%.

Regardless, the freezing in the video wasn't there in the game so it's clearly something to do with the recording software not having enough processing power. Anyway, to all you close minded people who seem to think the FX chips are absolutely useless and base your "facts" solely on what you read online, without recording as you saw in the screenshots, I got around 45-60fps.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=muDjW1aw_CU

Before you all comment on how short the video is, that file alone was 10gb and it took an hour to upload, so yeah... you get the point.
 
Last edited:

cbn

Lifer
Mar 27, 2009
12,968
221
106
I was seriously tempted to get an i3 mainly due to the upgrade options on the same motherboard, but was put off because I read that most modern games, especially AAA titles need to utilize the higher core count.

Yes buying Core i3 does give a person a better upgrade path, but if planning to stick with low cost CPUs these days I think I would go FX8300. (reason: games are using eight threads much better now and low level APIs like DX12 and Vulkan use more cpu cores)

With that mentioned, I think the real test for a chip like FX-8300 is how well it would do in a lightly threaded game like Skyrim (or Skyrim total conversion mod "Enderal: The Shards of Order") with a midrange dGPU like your R9 380. Stutter or not?
 

cbn

Lifer
Mar 27, 2009
12,968
221
106
Vossy, if you have Skyrim and could test for stuttering with your FX6300 and R9 380 that would be great.
 

Vossy96

Junior Member
Mar 16, 2016
23
0
0
Vossy, if you have Skyrim and could test for stuttering with your FX6300 and R9 380 that would be great.

I do. Are there any particular mods you want me to install or would you prefer me to test a clean copy?

Edit: Oh I missed your first post. I'll get that downloaded now. You want me to record or just report the results?
 
Last edited:

TheELF

Diamond Member
Dec 22, 2012
3,993
744
126
Skyrim is capped at 60FPS and needs a minimum of CPU to achieve it,any stutter you might get will be due to reading huge amounts of textures.

You will have to test at the steps of dragonsreach looking down at whiterun 4:20 or in markath 5:00 or some other CPU heavy location and even then it doesn't take much to get good FPS.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ZS2fF3qSKw

The performance of Fallout 4 heavily depends on the area you are in
You can get 40-50FPS in one area and sub 20 in others
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kut95t2djLU
same for GTAV,west vinewood where most benchmarks are taking place is the most demanding area,driving on the highway outside the city is nothing compared to that.


Vids from celly g1820 and gtx650
 

Yuriman

Diamond Member
Jun 25, 2004
5,530
141
106
The main problem is that AMD hasn't released a new 8-core design since 2012, whereas Intel has had 4 generations of CPUs since then. AMD competes by slashing prices, but using video cards an an analogy, there are plenty of cases where today's mid-range cards are greatly preferable to last gen's high-end, even if they aren't necessarily faster at the same price points.

In general, AMD CPUs give you more and slower cores. In situations that can utilize all of those cores, AMD CPUs can outperform similarly-priced Intel CPUs - after all, you can often get an 8-core FX for close to the price of a dual-core i3, but in situations that can't fully utilize all of those cores, Intel CPUs outperform AMD CPUs, sometimes quite significantly, and so you often see Intel's i3's outperforming 8-core FX CPUs.

FX CPUs are still "fast enough" most of the time, which would make their performance deficiencies a moot point. If this were all that they had going against them, they'd still be fairly competitive. Unfortunately, AMD CPUs also consume much more power doing the same work, and put out more heat, which means you'll need to buy a larger power supply and more expensive CPU cooler (or deal with more noise), and if you live in a warm climate, you'll pay the the extra electricity they use twice because of air conditioning.

They also live on ancient platforms - 760G is from 2009, for instance. Intel motherboards have native solutions for things like USB 3.1, M.2, SATA III, and PCIe 3.0. AMD motherboards are available that have (most of) these things, but tend to cost more than their feature-equivalent Intel boards because they rely on a lot of added 3rd party controllers which are usually inferior (slower transfer speeds), and add to the cost of the boards, making them more expensive than an equal Intel board.

As such, it's generally a bad idea to build a system around an AMD FX CPU today, unless you have very specific need, and/or the downsides don't mean much to you.
 

cbn

Lifer
Mar 27, 2009
12,968
221
106
I do. Are there any particular mods you want me to install or would you prefer me to test a clean copy?

Edit: Oh I missed your first post. I'll get that downloaded now. You want me to record or just report the results?

A clean copy (ie, without mods).

And you don't have to record gameplay. Just let us know if it is smooth or not.

Thanks.
 

ZGR

Platinum Member
Oct 26, 2012
2,054
661
136
I could probably swap my 4690k for an FX8 and not notice the difference in most tasks. But on any older game where all the AI runs on 1 core will put it to shame.

But why would I want a desktop platform that is 4+ years old, inefficient, and is outperformed by Intel's 35/45W mobile offerings?

Even if I was on a budget, Intel's Sandy/Ivy Bridge would be a far better choice.

Now if I wasn't gaming but rather relied on a multithreaded workload, then the FX could be very price competetive to Intel's HEDT platform.
 

nerp

Diamond Member
Dec 31, 2005
9,866
105
106
For the record, how does your i3 perform gaming wise? I was seriously tempted to get an i3 mainly due to the upgrade options on the same motherboard, but was put off because I read that most modern games, especially AAA titles need to utilize the higher core count.

I don't game much, but without a discrete card I can play CS:GO at good framerates with reasonable settings. At some point I will pop in a discrete GPU and try to game more. Life is at the young kid/tons of work stage right now. From what I have seen, the i3-6100 is perfectly capable for games especially with a decent gfx card. I'm one of those people who don't have to game at max resolution or with everything cranked to enjoy the experience, nor do I get worried if I'm getting 75fps instead of 100+fps. I find that a lot of benchmarks will convince you that something is bad because it might be 'worse' when in fact it's more than enough. Interestingly, I think that last point I just made is really the crux of this thread.
 

MiddleOfTheRoad

Golden Member
Aug 6, 2014
1,123
5
0
That ain't 1440p. AMD CPUs suck for gaming as they simply cannot keep up minimum frames. You might have gotten used to the dips but Intel is consistent. AMD isn't. Intel will push 60FPS, AMD will drop to sub 40s in jarring dips you will feel. The chipset is also ancient. AMD needs a new design and a modern 2016 socket. If Zen won't do all that its over. If you want to post proof post a video.

That's nonsense. My i7 4790K dips just as much as my FX-8320 in intense games. Stop the FUD already. If anything, the FX is better at maintaining consistent minimum frames when at 4k.
 
Last edited:

MiddleOfTheRoad

Golden Member
Aug 6, 2014
1,123
5
0
As such, it's generally a bad idea to build a system around an AMD FX CPU today, unless you have very specific need, and/or the downsides don't mean much to you.

That's generally true unless you live next to a Micro Center. When you get a motherboard for free or nearly free with AMD CPU bundles -- the value equation changes quite a lot. I just built an FM2+ desktop for a friend -- because the Gigabyte motherboard was free after rebate. His entire build was $140 (he reused his monitor/keyboard/mouse) -- not bad for a casual gaming box / web surfer.

$60 A6-7400K CPU
$15 160 GB Hard Drive
$25 4GB G.Skill DDR3 - 2x2 1866 Mhz
$25 Rosewill Case
$15 Generic 450 Watt Power Supply
Free Motherboard
Free Ubuntu OS with Steam Client installed
 
Last edited:

Insert_Nickname

Diamond Member
May 6, 2012
4,971
1,692
136
I know I'm not going to get much out of this, but felt like posting anyway... :\

The chipset is also ancient. AMD needs a new design and a modern 2016 socket. If Zen won't do all that its over. If you want to post proof post a video.

Yuriman, going to have to edit your post a bit to include here; hope you don't mind.

They also live on ancient platforms - 760G is from 2009, for instance. Intel motherboards have native solutions for things like USB 3.1, M.2, SATA III, and PCIe 3.0. AMD motherboards are available that have (most of) these things, but tend to cost more than their feature-equivalent Intel boards because they rely on a lot of added 3rd party controllers which are usually inferior (slower transfer speeds), and add to the cost of the boards, making them more expensive than an equal Intel board.

AMD has a newer platform. FM2(+). Problem is there aren't any FX 6 or 8 cores for it. AM3+ has been an effective dead-end for years now.

Besides, AM4 is a few months away, if the June launch rumours can be believed. Granted, it'll launch with XV-based APUs, but still.

As for PCIe 3.0, M.2/U.2, SATA3, 10Gbit USB 3.1 support, here you go:

FM2+
http://www.asrock.com/mb/AMD/A88M-G3.1/

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...7689&cm_re=asrock_a88m-_-13-157-689-_-Product

AM3+
http://www.asrock.com/mb/AMD/970A-G3.1/

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157688

Neither of which are more or less expensive then feature equivalent Intel boards.

The main problem is that AMD hasn't released a new 8-core design since 2012, whereas Intel has had 4 generations of CPUs since then. AMD competes by slashing prices, but using video cards an an analogy, there are plenty of cases where today's mid-range cards are greatly preferable to last gen's high-end, even if they aren't necessarily faster at the same price points.

In general, AMD CPUs give you more and slower cores. In situations that can utilize all of those cores, AMD CPUs can outperform similarly-priced Intel CPUs - after all, you can often get an 8-core FX for close to the price of a dual-core i3, but in situations that can't fully utilize all of those cores, Intel CPUs outperform AMD CPUs, sometimes quite significantly, and so you often see Intel's i3's outperforming 8-core FX CPUs.

FX CPUs are still "fast enough" most of the time, which would make their performance deficiencies a moot point. If this were all that they had going against them, they'd still be fairly competitive. Unfortunately, AMD CPUs also consume much more power doing the same work, and put out more heat, which means you'll need to buy a larger power supply and more expensive CPU cooler (or deal with more noise), and if you live in a warm climate, you'll pay the the extra electricity they use twice because of air conditioning.

Edited out;

As such, it's generally a bad idea to build a system around an AMD FX CPU today, unless you have very specific need, and/or the downsides don't mean much to you.

This we agree on. However if you happen to have a spare or used AM3+ CPU, perhaps with a dead or ancient mainboard, those boards mentioned above can turn it into a quite competent secondary system.
 

Beer4Me

Senior member
Mar 16, 2011
564
20
76
I hereby blame this thread on Zika.

Obvious troll click bait title.

Also, we all know AMD CPU power consumption/performance ratio can not hold a candle to Intel.
 

MiddleOfTheRoad

Golden Member
Aug 6, 2014
1,123
5
0
I see the ADF post about how good AMD is at 720p, low or medium all the time.

So you are now dragging onboard graphics into the conversation regarding an entirely different platform (FM2+)? .....When the current discussion was about FX chips with discrete graphics cards. Way to completely move the goalposts, dude. The OP was about an FX-6300 -- that's not an APU.
 
Last edited:

Leyawiin

Diamond Member
Nov 11, 2008
3,204
52
91
Vossy, if you have Skyrim and could test for stuttering with your FX6300 and R9 380 that would be great.

I have an FX-8320E @ 4.2 Ghz on all 8 cores and right now I have my main PC's GTX 970 in it. I did a clean install of Skyrim (no mods). Using the Ultra preset @ 1920x1200 it drops below 60 FPS in a number of spots - looking over Whiterun from Dragonsreach, several places in Markarth, looking over the market area of Riften and while running through Riverwood. No better performance than the old Phenom II X4 980 BE I had with a GTX 670. In fact it seems worse - probably the greater mismatch of CPU & GPU is causing a bit more stuttering than with the Phenom II/GTX 670.

I need to do some quick screenshots - here we go:





Of those spots my i7 4790k only drops below 60 FPS in looking over Markarth (and even this its about 50 FPS instead of 32 FPS with the FX-8320E)
 
Last edited:

Phynaz

Lifer
Mar 13, 2006
10,140
819
126
So you are now dragging onboard graphics into the conversation regarding an entirely different platform (FM2+)? .....When the current discussion was about FX chips with discrete graphics cards. Way to completely move the goalposts, dude. The OP was about an FX-6300 -- that's not an APU.

Only Intel fanboys play/care about low detail settings......

I guess you can't deal with being proven wrong. I don't understand your emotional investment in AMD, but whatever.
 
Last edited:

AtenRa

Lifer
Feb 2, 2009
14,003
3,361
136
AMD chips are not competitive these days. That doesn't mean you can't run an AMD processor and have a perfectly capable machine. By all means, you can build an AMD box that will work well and get the job done plus play games well, too. But for not much more money you can have something that just blows the doors off of it. That's where we are now.

Looking forward to Zen.

Current Newegg prices

FX8350 = $159,99

Core i3 6300 = $155,99



 

Denithor

Diamond Member
Apr 11, 2004
6,300
23
81
Now you can see clearly that it's quite stuttery and jumpy at times, but blame that on recording. Recording at full quality at 1440p was an absolute killer, so much so that I was monitoring usage on my second monitor and before I'd even got into the game, recording just the menus, and the CPU usage was at 39%.

You DO understand that this is entirely because your CPU isn't strong enough to game and record simultaneously, right?

Only Intel fanboys play/care about low detail settings......

Hmm. Actually, it's because low detail is where the CPU is the bottleneck. Higher detail settings make the GPU work harder and it becomes the bottleneck. So...to properly compare CPU strength...low details.
 

Denithor

Diamond Member
Apr 11, 2004
6,300
23
81
AtenRa, you are right, in BF4MP more cores = much better experience. But very few games are as heavily threaded as BF4MP.

I wonder what impact DX12 will have on this effect? Will a stronger IPC/fewer threads chip do better or not?
 
sale-70-410-exam    | Exam-200-125-pdf    | we-sale-70-410-exam    | hot-sale-70-410-exam    | Latest-exam-700-603-Dumps    | Dumps-98-363-exams-date    | Certs-200-125-date    | Dumps-300-075-exams-date    | hot-sale-book-C8010-726-book    | Hot-Sale-200-310-Exam    | Exam-Description-200-310-dumps?    | hot-sale-book-200-125-book    | Latest-Updated-300-209-Exam    | Dumps-210-260-exams-date    | Download-200-125-Exam-PDF    | Exam-Description-300-101-dumps    | Certs-300-101-date    | Hot-Sale-300-075-Exam    | Latest-exam-200-125-Dumps    | Exam-Description-200-125-dumps    | Latest-Updated-300-075-Exam    | hot-sale-book-210-260-book    | Dumps-200-901-exams-date    | Certs-200-901-date    | Latest-exam-1Z0-062-Dumps    | Hot-Sale-1Z0-062-Exam    | Certs-CSSLP-date    | 100%-Pass-70-383-Exams    | Latest-JN0-360-real-exam-questions    | 100%-Pass-4A0-100-Real-Exam-Questions    | Dumps-300-135-exams-date    | Passed-200-105-Tech-Exams    | Latest-Updated-200-310-Exam    | Download-300-070-Exam-PDF    | Hot-Sale-JN0-360-Exam    | 100%-Pass-JN0-360-Exams    | 100%-Pass-JN0-360-Real-Exam-Questions    | Dumps-JN0-360-exams-date    | Exam-Description-1Z0-876-dumps    | Latest-exam-1Z0-876-Dumps    | Dumps-HPE0-Y53-exams-date    | 2017-Latest-HPE0-Y53-Exam    | 100%-Pass-HPE0-Y53-Real-Exam-Questions    | Pass-4A0-100-Exam    | Latest-4A0-100-Questions    | Dumps-98-365-exams-date    | 2017-Latest-98-365-Exam    | 100%-Pass-VCS-254-Exams    | 2017-Latest-VCS-273-Exam    | Dumps-200-355-exams-date    | 2017-Latest-300-320-Exam    | Pass-300-101-Exam    | 100%-Pass-300-115-Exams    |
http://www.portvapes.co.uk/    | http://www.portvapes.co.uk/    |