Why do people believe in God if there's no valid proof?

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: jmebonner
Why do people keep posting the same type of question over and over? Now *that* is a question worth asking.

God makes them.

 

[Crono]

Originally posted by: sandorski
Complete Fail.

You admit that your argument fails?
You, sir, are true gentleman. It takes a lot to admit failure. Good for you!

 

[sandorski]

Originally posted by: Crono

Originally posted by: sandorski
Complete Fail.

You admit that your argument fails?
You, sir, are true gentleman. It takes a lot to admit failure. Good for you!

Now you're just Trolling. Congrats.

 

[Crono]

Originally posted by: sandorski

Originally posted by: Crono

Originally posted by: sandorski
Complete Fail.

You admit that your argument fails?
You, sir, are true gentleman. It takes a lot to admit failure. Good for you!

Now you're just Trolling. Congrats.

No, it's called sarcasm. And it wasn't even mean-spirited, I meant to prove a point. Trolling is more along the lines of two word responses that add nothing to the discussion. Example:

Originally posted by: sandorski
Complete Fail.

People misuse the word "troll" on forums. Very few people here troll or are trolls.

 

[Homerboy]

Just to recap this and every religious thread here on ATOT:

"I'm right, you're wrong."

Did I miss anything?

 

[So]

Originally posted by: Crono

Originally posted by: sandorski

Originally posted by: Crono

Originally posted by: sandorski
Complete Fail.

You admit that your argument fails?
You, sir, are true gentleman. It takes a lot to admit failure. Good for you!

Now you're just Trolling. Congrats.

No, it's called sarcasm. And it wasn't even mean-spirited, I meant to prove a point. Trolling is more along the lines of two word responses that add nothing to the discussion. Example:

Originally posted by: sandorski
Complete Fail.

People misuse the word "troll" on forums. Very few people here troll or are trolls.

Actually, I think some of them are really sophisticated trolls. Trolls don't necessarily do two word responses. Oftentimes they start threads like this or come in and stir the pot for laughs. In fact, I wouldn't consider it impossible that your character is entirely one really sophisticated troll. Not saying that's necessarily the case, but I could see it.

 

[sandorski]

Originally posted by: Crono

Originally posted by: sandorski

Originally posted by: Crono

Originally posted by: sandorski
Complete Fail.

You admit that your argument fails?
You, sir, are true gentleman. It takes a lot to admit failure. Good for you!

Now you're just Trolling. Congrats.

No, it's called sarcasm. And it wasn't even mean-spirited, I meant to prove a point. Trolling is more along the lines of two word responses that add nothing to the discussion. Example:

Originally posted by: sandorski
Complete Fail.

People misuse the word "troll" on forums. Very few people here troll or are trolls.

Your Post was "Complete Fail" because it was based upon the premise that I couldn't Prove my Existance to you. If that's not "Complete Fail", what is?

 

[So]

Originally posted by: Homerboy
Just to recap this and every religious thread here on ATOT:

"I'm right, you're wrong."

Did I miss anything?

Nope, that about covers it.

 

[SlitheryDee]

Originally posted by: Crono
You don't have a choice about whether to believe in existence, you automatically act on it. Those who don't are the dead. Either you are alive and believe, or you aren't and therefore you are dead. You can claim that you don't exist, but when some punches you in the face, you are going to react like someone who believes in his own existence. You say you have a choice to believe or not, but that's not true. You do have a choice to deny or not. You can say you don't believe in your own existence, but of course you do. You can pretend there is no God, you can say "there is no God", you can even tell yourself "there is no God".

That's one of the reasons the Bible never goes about arguing the existence of God, because it is evident.
But when the universe finally gets turned upside down, no one will be able to deny God, they will be saying either "*expletive God*" or "save me, God".

Oh I believe in my own existence. That belief is based upon the evidence of my senses. They tell me that there is space to occupy. They tell me that I have a location in this space from which I perceive it. I am right here. I take all this for granted because, without it, I would not know myself to be, whether I actually was or not. It isn't surprising that I would choose to call what my senses tell me "reality" because it is all I can possibly know. An interesting counterpoint to Descartes was that we cannot, with any certainty, say "I think" so much as "thought occurs". I'm going to go ahead and assume that I exist based on this powerful assortment of inputs that I am subject to, not to do so would be to entertain a notion for which I have no evidence, false or otherwise. I just don't get the "all signs point to God" argument I guess. Your idea would lead me to believe that all signs point to me, hence my inability to disbelieve in myself. There is an unaccountable leap in logic being made when we extend that to God's "evident" existence.

 

[xSauronx]

Originally posted by: Pepsei

Top Ten Signs You're a Fundamentalist Christian




10 - You vigorously deny the existence of thousands of gods claimed by other religions, but feel outraged when someone denies the existence of yours.

9 - You feel insulted and "dehumanized" when scientists say that people evolved from other life forms, but you have no problem with the Biblical claim that we were created from dirt.

8 - You laugh at polytheists, but you have no problem believing in a Triune God.

7 - Your face turns purple when you hear of the "atrocities" attributed to Allah, but you don't even flinch when hearing about how God/Jehovah slaughtered all the babies of Egypt in "Exodus" and ordered the elimination of entire ethnic groups in "Joshua" including women, children, and trees!

6 - You laugh at Hindu beliefs that deify humans, and Greek claims about gods sleeping with women, but you have no problem believing that the Holy Spirit impregnated Mary, who then gave birth to a man-god who got killed, came back to life and then ascended into the sky.

5 - You are willing to spend your life looking for little loopholes in the scientifically established age of Earth (few billion years), but you find nothing wrong with believing dates recorded by Bronze Age tribesmen sitting in their tents and guessing that Earth is a few generations old.

4 - You believe that the entire population of this planet with the exception of those who share your beliefs -- though excluding those in all rival sects - will spend Eternity in an infinite Hell of Suffering. And yet consider your religion the most "tolerant" and "loving."


3 - While modern science, history, geology, biology, and physics have failed to convince you otherwise, some idiot rolling around on the floor speaking in "tongues" may be all the evidence you need to "prove" Christianity.

2 - You define 0.01% as a "high success rate" when it comes to answered prayers. You consider that to be evidence that prayer works. And you think that the remaining 99.99% FAILURE was simply the will of God.

1 - You actually know a lot less than many atheists and agnostics do about the Bible, Christianity, and church history - but still call yourself a Christian.

link

nicely done

 

[Crono]

Originally posted by: So

Originally posted by: Crono

Originally posted by: sandorski

Originally posted by: Crono

Originally posted by: sandorski
Complete Fail.

You admit that your argument fails?
You, sir, are true gentleman. It takes a lot to admit failure. Good for you!

Now you're just Trolling. Congrats.

No, it's called sarcasm. And it wasn't even mean-spirited, I meant to prove a point. Trolling is more along the lines of two word responses that add nothing to the discussion. Example:

Originally posted by: sandorski
Complete Fail.

People misuse the word "troll" on forums. Very few people here troll or are trolls.

Actually, I think some of them are really sophisticated trolls. Trolls don't necessarily do two word responses. Oftentimes they start threads like this or come in and stir the pot for laughs. In fact, I wouldn't consider it impossible that your character is entirely one really sophisticated troll. Not saying that's necessarily the case, but I could see it.

I never attack people personally. I only attack arguments, and use reasoning (logic) in tandem with facts. If I ever attacked someone, or insulted someone, I apologize. It's never my intent to do so.

If you have some reason to think I'm a troll, there should be some evidence of it, unless you are going by some vague feeling or gut emotion, in which case you are entitled to that as long as you don't call me a troll (you didn't, so that's fine).

You're right that trolls can be sophisticated, but that's the exception rather than the norm. It's far easier to attack someone personally with a curse or insult than to create some complex persona and method of flaming.

 

[dud]

OP, this is the last place on earth to discuss the issue of God.

And by the way its called faith ...

 

[GagHalfrunt]

Originally posted by: Crono

Originally posted by: sandorski

Originally posted by: Crono

Originally posted by: sandorski
Complete Fail.

You admit that your argument fails?
You, sir, are true gentleman. It takes a lot to admit failure. Good for you!

Now you're just Trolling. Congrats.

No, it's called sarcasm. And it wasn't even mean-spirited, I meant to prove a point. Trolling is more along the lines of two word responses that add nothing to the discussion. Example:

Originally posted by: sandorski
Complete Fail.

People misuse the word "troll" on forums. Very few people here troll or are trolls.

Very few people on ANY forum are trolls. "Troll" is a child's synonym for "I lack the intelligence to dispute what you say." I love getting called a troll in a religion thread, it's just the other side admitting defeat.

 

[Crono]

Originally posted by: SlitheryDee

Originally posted by: Crono
You don't have a choice about whether to believe in existence, you automatically act on it. Those who don't are the dead. Either you are alive and believe, or you aren't and therefore you are dead. You can claim that you don't exist, but when some punches you in the face, you are going to react like someone who believes in his own existence. You say you have a choice to believe or not, but that's not true. You do have a choice to deny or not. You can say you don't believe in your own existence, but of course you do. You can pretend there is no God, you can say "there is no God", you can even tell yourself "there is no God".

That's one of the reasons the Bible never goes about arguing the existence of God, because it is evident.
But when the universe finally gets turned upside down, no one will be able to deny God, they will be saying either "*expletive God*" or "save me, God".

Oh I believe in my own existence. That belief is based upon the evidence of my senses. They tell me that there is space to occupy. They tell me that I have a location in this space from which I perceive it. I am right here. I take all this for granted because, without it, I would not know myself to be, whether I actually was or not. It isn't surprising that I would choose to call what my senses tell me "reality" because it is all I can possibly know. An interesting counterpoint to Descartes was that we cannot, with any certainty, say "I think" so much as "thought occurs". I'm going to go ahead and assume that I exist based on this powerful assortment of inputs that I am subject to, not to do so would be to entertain a notion for which I have no evidence, false or otherwise. I just don't get the "all signs point to God" argument I guess. Your idea would lead me to believe that all signs point to me, hence my inability to disbelieve in myself. There is an unaccountable leap in logic being made when we extend that to God's "evident" existence.

How so? You say there is, but you admit that you assume your own existence. How is that different from me assuming, as much as I assume my own existence, that God is real? I'm not telling you must acknowledge God is real. That is up to you. I am saying that both are fundamental beliefs that cannot be demonstrated to be true, except by referring back to themselves (circular logic). Will you agree with this? If not, there's nothing more I can say, the argument will continue forever ad nauseum (which could be said about religion threads on AT, too...).

 

[sandorski]

Originally posted by: Crono

Originally posted by: SlitheryDee

Originally posted by: Crono
You don't have a choice about whether to believe in existence, you automatically act on it. Those who don't are the dead. Either you are alive and believe, or you aren't and therefore you are dead. You can claim that you don't exist, but when some punches you in the face, you are going to react like someone who believes in his own existence. You say you have a choice to believe or not, but that's not true. You do have a choice to deny or not. You can say you don't believe in your own existence, but of course you do. You can pretend there is no God, you can say "there is no God", you can even tell yourself "there is no God".

That's one of the reasons the Bible never goes about arguing the existence of God, because it is evident.
But when the universe finally gets turned upside down, no one will be able to deny God, they will be saying either "*expletive God*" or "save me, God".

Oh I believe in my own existence. That belief is based upon the evidence of my senses. They tell me that there is space to occupy. They tell me that I have a location in this space from which I perceive it. I am right here. I take all this for granted because, without it, I would not know myself to be, whether I actually was or not. It isn't surprising that I would choose to call what my senses tell me "reality" because it is all I can possibly know. An interesting counterpoint to Descartes was that we cannot, with any certainty, say "I think" so much as "thought occurs". I'm going to go ahead and assume that I exist based on this powerful assortment of inputs that I am subject to, not to do so would be to entertain a notion for which I have no evidence, false or otherwise. I just don't get the "all signs point to God" argument I guess. Your idea would lead me to believe that all signs point to me, hence my inability to disbelieve in myself. There is an unaccountable leap in logic being made when we extend that to God's "evident" existence.

How so? You say there is, but you admit that you assume your own existence. How is that different from me assuming, as much as I assume my own existence, that God is real? I'm not telling you must acknowledge God is real. That is up to you. I am saying that both are fundamental beliefs that cannot be demonstrated to be true, except by referring back to themselves (circular logic). Will you agree with this? If not, there's nothing more I can say, the argument will continue forever ad nauseum (which could be said about religion threads on AT, too...).

You can't tell the difference between Your existance and that of a "God"? That's simply being Disingenuous or Delusional.

 

[imported_elwood]

Text

 

[videogames101]

Originally posted by: So
Oh god, not again. Even **I** have gotten sick of these threads (finally).

Conclusion: Some people are retards, others aren't. You think the people on the other side are the retards. Both sides are right about that one.

Wtf? One side is right, which means only 1 side if full of retards. Without evidence for god, not believing in god is the logical choice.

 

[videogames101]

Originally posted by: dud
OP, this is the last place on earth to discuss the issue of God.

And by the way its called faith ...

Faith is just a way of saying no reason at all.

 

[SlitheryDee]

Originally posted by: Crono
How so? You say there is, but you admit that you assume your own existence. How is that different from me assuming, as much as I assume my own existence, that God is real? I'm not telling you must acknowledge God is real. That is up to you. I am saying that both are fundamental beliefs that cannot be demonstrated to be true, except by referring back to themselves (circular logic). Will you agree with this? If not, there's nothing more I can say, the argument will continue forever ad nauseum (which could be said about religion threads on AT, too...).

For argument's sake I'll leave our ability to demonstrate our own existence alone, although the cogito has always been pretty compelling to me (even if the rest of it turns to hogwash).

So they are both beliefs that cannot be demonstrated to be true. My opinion is that only one of them is fundamental and referring back to themselves demonstrates nothing.

That places them on unequal footing. There is at least some reason to believe that I exist. I have senses which tell me where I'm located and if they are deceiving me, the fact that I exist to be deceived answers my question. It follows from the fact that I am not my senses themselves, but instead the thing that is retaining, sorting, and acting upon my senses that I exist.

Now, what does the belief in the existence of God come from? It has to stem from evidence of the senses as well, because that's all there is for anything to come from. Even ideas can't form without the senses to provide input to think about. AFTER your head has been filled with information from your senses you get to the point where you consider the existence of God. This reveals God to be an idea passed on AFTER the fundamental question of your own existence. You see? Right or wrong, the question of the existence of God is not fundamental. The question of your own existence is, and it comes long before the idea of God has ever been implanted in your mind. God is not a default conclusion, self-existence is. The two are not comparable in the way you are trying to compare them.

 

[IronWing]

Just one well placed time warp could have prevented this thread. There is no god.

 

[wahoyaho]

Because they fail at believing in themselves

 

[Brutus04]

Faith brother...

Some can accept, some can't...poor bastards

 

[meltdown75]

faith eliminates the need for proof. if you believe in your maker, in your God, in your "God" or god or YOUR OWN PERSONAL JESUS, or whateeeever the frick you call it, it transcends the need for "proof". faith defeats the need for proof.

 

[rudeguy]

Originally posted by: meltdown75
faith eliminates the need for proof. if you believe in your maker, in your God, in your "God" or god or YOUR OWN PERSONAL JESUS, or whateeeever the frick you call it, it transcends the need for "proof". faith defeats the need for proof.

Not necessarily. You need to believe before you can have faith. God showed himself to me in some pretty drastic ways before I had faith.

Its pretty simple. If you seek Him, you will find Him and all the proof you will need.

 

[meltdown75]

Originally posted by: NSFW

Originally posted by: meltdown75
faith eliminates the need for proof. if you believe in your maker, in your God, in your "God" or god or YOUR OWN PERSONAL JESUS, or whateeeever the frick you call it, it transcends the need for "proof". faith defeats the need for proof.

Not necessarily. You need to believe before you can have faith. God showed himself to me in some pretty drastic ways before I had faith.

Its pretty simple. If you seek Him, you will find Him and all the proof you will need.

well, believing is pretty much just believing that there is something greater than yourself and humanity as a whole. generally if your life is good, or even if your life is bad and you have an amazing experience to at least show you the amazingness of life anyway, you will realize that you are a tiny sack of scum running a fucking rat race and there has to be something greater. you (may) also realize the intricacies of life, and the fantastic set of cosmic coincidences that brought us to be, and the uniqueness of every single living being and thing on this planet, and you generally accept that life is so great that you begin to see it as a gift. but a gift from who? from what? oh, some people don't question some things, they just bide their time happily while they can, trying to live in harmony with everyone around them because they know that nothing lasts forever.

i agree with you, if you believe and you have faith, you will be SET and probably just drink a lot of beer all the time because you will be happy and not give a shit.