Why do so many people feel that they are entitled to promotion due to tenure alone?

[88keys]

Several months ago I started a new job as a QC Tech that I discussed here.

It has been going really really well and has exceeded my expectations thus far except for some jealous co-workers that I have to deal with.

Of course I deal with a couple people who work on the shop floor who wanted my position and felt they were more deserving of the job due to tenure. Most of it has died down once people figured out that I knew what I was doing but there still have been a few buggers that I have to deal with from time to time. However I'll probably have another round of this nonsense once people find out the plan is to have me in the engineering dept as a Junior Engineer by Spring and my classes start this coming week so I can't really keep this a secret much longer.
The drama mostly amounts to petty attempts to get under my skin of which I pay no mind to. The one thing I find in common with these people is that they all have lousy attitudes and I even confronted a few people about them about it. The general response is "I've worked here x amount of years and I'm still doing the same [random swear word] job for the same pay blah blah blah" So I ask in response "Why do you think that is? What have you done to better yourself in your 'x amount of years' with the company?" Have you taken any initiative to learn anything"
I try really hard to not be condescending when I do it but I probably still do, and it has still worked in shutting some people down.

I've worked in these types of places for awhile now and I find this mentality to be so common and I really don't get it. What makes anyone think that mediocrely performing the same task for so many years automatically should entitle a person to a promotion regardless of qualifications?

 

[shortylickens]

Because for a very long time thats exactly how it worked. Especially when labor unions forced their influence on large businesses.

Time was the only thing used to determine promotions and raises and benefits. And that was strictly for the benefit of the union and union bosses, not the company.


Anyway, people got used to it, so for many current workers thats the expectation.

 

[local]

Sometimes people believe that they will be tho ones to replace their boss or get some other promotion related to their position if they have been working under it for many years. I believe that it is a reasonable expectation but like you said they have to show some initiative to get themselves there. I have been with my company for 11 years and worked my way up from jobsite cleanup crew to project manager. Most of the people I worked with in the field are still there doing the same exact thing 11 years later because they put in zero effort. We give them opportunities to get training and advance but they just don't want to do it.

But if you think about it promotion happens automatically in real life as if you live long enough you find yourself replacing your parents then your grandparents through almost no effort of you own.

 

[Tweak155]

I think dedication has value, but nothing more than maybe a nice bonus for 10 years of service or something. Shouldn't be a guaranteed promotion.

 

[Newell Steamer]

I see the opposite in the office world.

It's usually new people that expect to become managers within a few weeks of their arrival. They usually 'seed' their move with making tons of WTF observations (oh, what a dumb place to put the copier or why do we do it THAT way?) and after they cobble together a powerpoint presentation from other people's slides, they expect to get a promotion - but, NO responsibility (which doesn't make any sense).

9 times out of 10, its usually someone in their late 20s trying to play catch up to their dreams and goals of becoming a multi-billionaire CEO by 30.

 

[purbeast0]

sounds like you work for a pretty crappy company if there are that many unhappy employees.

 

[NuclearNed]

We have people in my department who day after day provide no meaningful contribution to the company, but they feel like they deserve the same promotions/raises/bonuses/etc as those of us who bust our butts every day to take up the slack. Welcome to the new American culture, where everyone expects to be rewarded for simply showing up. These precious little unique snowflakes have been raised this way from a young age.

 

[SlitheryDee]

"If you haven't fired me, I must be doing a good job. If I'm doing a good job, I should get a promotion".

 

[brianmanahan]

where i am at, they wanted me to be a manager not because of tenure, but because i am good at my job

i told them no thanks. i am good at my job because i like it. don't take me out of a job that i like and put me in some horrible management position!

 

[88keys]

Because for a very long time thats exactly how it worked. Especially when labor unions forced their influence on large businesses.

Time was the only thing used to determine promotions and raises and benefits. And that was strictly for the benefit of the union and union bosses, not the company.


Anyway, people got used to it, so for many current workers thats the expectation.

I briefly worked in a union shop and it was the worst job I ever had and I highly doubt that I'd ever join another labor union. Granted there were a few VERY knowledgeable and skilled people in their QA lab; but there were also some of the most worthless people that I've ever worked with in my life. The thing is that if you're young and trying to get ahead; a union is really not what you want to be in.

Sometimes people believe that they will be tho ones to replace their boss or get some other promotion related to their position if they have been working under it for many years. I believe that it is a reasonable expectation but like you said they have to show some initiative to get themselves there. I have been with my company for 11 years and worked my way up from jobsite cleanup crew to project manager. Most of the people I worked with in the field are still there doing the same exact thing 11 years later because they put in zero effort. We give them opportunities to get training and advance but they just don't want to do it.

I see this alot and some of my friends insist that I'm really 'lucky' or something. More often than not I can pick out obvious reasons why people are passed over for promotions, but any attempts to explain them are usually lost on these people because they are completely oblivious to their bad work habits.

I'm not going to sit here and say it's easy to get ahead in the world. And to be honest, it's actually quite difficult working in a factory without a college education. It takes alot of time, hard work, and patience to get noticed and opportunities to shine certainly don't come everyday. But you need to seize them when they do and understand that you might have to do some jobs that you don't want to do in order to get to where you want to be.
Right out of high school I started out working for an auto supplier 12 years ago and it's where I learned most of what I now know in regards to advance blueprint reading, GD&T, etc. And now I'm finally going to advance to the engineering dept much quicker than I had anticipated and have some valuable skills under my belt which will create many more opportunities for me in the future both financially and my career.

 

[dave_the_nerd]

If X number of people work at the same job and do an equally good job, how else do you determine who gets what? If the skillset is portable and the company has costs associated with hiring new people, how do you minimize turnover and incentivize sticking with the job?

Not saying it's always that simple, but tenure has a place in the math.

 

[88keys]

If X number of people work at the same job and do an equally good job, how else do you determine who gets what? If the skillset is portable and the company has costs associated with hiring new people, how do you minimize turnover and incentivize sticking with the job?

Not saying it's always that simple, but tenure has a place in the math.

Vacation time.

 

[CoPhotoGuy]

If X number of people work at the same job and do an equally good job, how else do you determine who gets what? If the skillset is portable and the company has costs associated with hiring new people, how do you minimize turnover and incentivize sticking with the job?

Not saying it's always that simple, but tenure has a place in the math.

Tenure does have a place, but I see similar things where I am. Some people just don't have the drive. I've rocketed ahead of lots of people who have been here longer than I have.

 

[dave_the_nerd]

Vacation time.

Compensation package, in other words.

In companies where compensation is primarily tied to "rank" and there are multiple levels of non-management people with mostly similar job responsibilities (associate engineer, engineer, senior engineer, lead engineer, senior distinguished engineer, etc.), giving somebody an income boost as a reward usually means a promotion.

YMMV in small companies where the boss has a phone number and can do whatever the heck he wants. But for those of us who work for large, faceless multinationals, HR is a thing.

 

[dave_the_nerd]

Tenure does have a place, but I see similar things where I am. Some people just don't have the drive. I've rocketed ahead of lots of people who have been here longer than I have.

Right, so, the opposite of what OP is complaining about then? :biggrin:

 

[who?]

If you promote from within and have to train that person in their new job and train their replacement you have two people in training but if you put the new person into the higher job you only have to train them because you're keeping your current employees in the jobs they already know. Having fewer people training reduces the risk of screwups.

 

[arcenite]

Because for a very long time thats exactly how it worked.

This, but to add on to your explanation, the Y generation and millennials are getting FUCKED. At least, in comparison to the boomers. Companies can't legally fix the 'problem' with the boomers for risk of age discrimination suits, but they can fix it with the new hires coming in. So you have a huge gap -- and it sucks for those that are simply victims of life's lack of fairness.

And it doesn't stop there. Pensions and retirement benefits to name two more. Add the ridiculous price of college on top and you have a cockmeat sandwich of a situation.

 

[Jumpem]

That is how it worked for a very long time, and still works in unions.

 

[88keys]

This, but to add on to your explanation, the Y generation and millennials are getting FUCKED. At least, in comparison to the boomers. Companies can't legally fix the 'problem' with the boomers for risk of age discrimination suits, but they can fix it with the new hires coming in. So you have a huge gap -- and it sucks for those that are simply victims of life's lack of fairness.

And it doesn't stop there. Pensions and retirement benefits to name two more. Add the ridiculous price of college on top and you have a cockmeat sandwich of a situation.

I think that's beginning to change and the biggest form of age discrimination I see is against people over 50.

 

[CoPhotoGuy]

Right, so, the opposite of what OP is complaining about then? :biggrin:

No..OP is complaining about people who have been there longer complaining about him being hired/promoted vs. them due to tenure. I've heard some complaining regarding my moves up the ladder from those more tenured than I am. Seems to be the same thing.

 

[OverVolt]

This, but to add on to your explanation, the Y generation and millennials are getting FUCKED. At least, in comparison to the boomers. Companies can't legally fix the 'problem' with the boomers for risk of age discrimination suits, but they can fix it with the new hires coming in. So you have a huge gap -- and it sucks for those that are simply victims of life's lack of fairness.

And it doesn't stop there. Pensions and retirement benefits to name two more. Add the ridiculous price of college on top and you have a cockmeat sandwich of a situation.

I agree.

 

[SKORPI0]

It's just about the same with new college graduates expecting they are entitled to a high paying job with no actual work experience/history and most of the time no clue on how to actually do it correctly. Thinking that a degree is the the golden ticket. ^_^

Tenure at that company and training for that employee to the next level should be taken into consideration, if/when that person has shown their initiative to better themselves. Not being complacent to their current position. Employees not up to company standards and expectations shouldn't even be considered for promotion.

Of course in the end it is who you know in that company (kissing ass) and not what you know (working hard/skills improvement/non-tardiness) usually happens a lot too. :\

 

[brianmanahan]

And it doesn't stop there. Pensions and retirement benefits to name two more. Add the ridiculous price of college on top and you have a c**kmeat sandwich of a situation.

it might be harder to find, but not impossible. you just gotta be on top of your game.

i work at a place with a a %1.5 salary pension on top of the %6 401k match, and college was free due to scholarships

 

[arcenite]

it might be harder to find, but not impossible. you just gotta be on top of your game.

i work at a place with a a %1.5 salary pension on top of the %6 401k match, and college was free due to scholarships

I'm sure you recognize that scholarships are special because not everyone gets them. Scholarships do not negate nor are they a counter to the issue with the cost of college. However, good on you for caring early enough on in your life to get a scholarship.

Regarding your pension and 401k -- I'm not saying the generations entering the workforce today don't get the same or similar -- I'm saying what were your colleagues offered 10-20-30-even 40 years ago? My guess is, more than the company offers today. And then people wonder why those in their early careers want "MORE". It's not that they want more, it's that they want the same treatment those before them received for the same or similar amount of effort.

 

[Kneedragger]

It's just about the same with new college graduates expecting they are entitled to a high paying job with no actual work experience/history and most of the time no clue on how to actually do it correctly. Thinking that a degree is the the golden ticket. ^_^

Tenure at that company and training for that employee to the next level should be taken into consideration, if/when that person has shown their initiative to better themselves. Not being complacent to their current position. Employees not up to company standards and expectations shouldn't even be considered for promotion.

Of course in the end it is who you know in that company (kissing ass) and not what you know (working hard/skills improvement/non-tardiness) usually happens a lot too. :\

This