Why do we make the 'minority' distinction?

[bradly1101]

I know it's a word that contains truth; there are fewer numbers in the non-white groups in the U.S., but IMO it also gives us the supposed rationality that allows segregation and a high number of other disparities.

I heard my elderly aunt use the words "minorities" and "they" in a sentence. She really wasn't trying to be racist, but I wonder why "they" are even considered "they?"

I've noticed that outside of criminals (which of course exist in all groups), some countries seem to have integrated their populations more smoothly. Is it because majorities there don't make as many distinctions, or don't concern themselves as much? Does the majority see itself as no different than the minority and vice versa? Is that even considered desirable here anymore?

I live in a mixed area, and was threatened because of my skin color once, but am regularly in multi-racial places with no problems, so although race played a role, this was of course more about hate taking over someone's mind as it has with all humans, we all recognize it. I have wondered why ever since. Why did he hate me? Did he think I hated him? Was it purely because of skin color, or does it include territory, and did the fact that I'm in a manual wheelchair play a role? I know these aren't questions for you, but this one is: Why do some places get this right?

I know that some of the places that seem to do well with immigration also have had terror attacks, and I don't mean this conversation to be about who or where has had the most attacks, most dead, etc., or what race or ideology is best, least violent, etc.

This is what I think about the argument that shows that crime can and should be divided by race.

 

[ivwshane]

I would guess and I think I've read that places that have more minorities tend to have more racial harmony. Race in big cities isn't a big deal as it is in more rural, homogenous areas. Most racism stems from a lack of exposure to other types of people.

 

[bradly1101]

I would guess and I think I've read that places that have more minorities tend to have more racial harmony. Race in big cities isn't a big deal as it is in more rural, homogenous areas is. Most racism stems from a lack of exposure to other types of people.

The experience I had was in a city, ls it our ignorance of others? Rural distance? Where modern segregation is, and that's where ideologs are, all attempts seem stymied. With exposure increasing, are we going to see on average more unification or division?
Edit: too sleepy

 

[bbhaag]

I would guess and I think I've read that places that have more minorities tend to have more racial harmony. Race in big cities isn't a big deal as it is in more rural, homogenous areas. Most racism stems from a lack of exposure to other types of people.

Are you really sure about that? I think that Los Angeles, St. Louis and many other large metropolitan areas might disagree with your interpretation of "Race in big cities isn't a big deal".

 

[bbhaag]

I know it's a word that contains truth; there are fewer numbers in the non-white groups in the U.S., but IMO it also gives us the supposed rationality that allows segregation and a high number of other disparities.

I heard my elderly aunt use the words "minorities" and "they" in a sentence. She really wasn't trying to be racist, but I wonder why "they" are even considered "they?"

I've noticed that outside of criminals (which of course exist in all groups), some countries seem to have integrated their populations more smoothly. Is it because majorities there don't make as many distinctions, or don't concern themselves as much? Does the majority see itself as no different than the minority and vice versa? Is that even considered desirable here anymore?

I live in a mixed area, and was threatened because of my skin color once, but am regularly in multi-racial places with no problems, so although race played a role, this was of course more about hate taking over someone's mind as it has with all humans, we all recognize it. I have wondered why ever since. Why did he hate me? Did he think I hated him? Was it purely because of skin color, or does it include territory, and did the fact that I'm in a manual wheelchair play a role? I know these aren't questions for you, but this one is: Why do some places get this right?

I know that some of the places that seem to do well with immigration also have had terror attacks, and I don't mean this conversation to be about who or where has had the most attacks, most dead, etc., or what race or ideology is best, least violent, etc.

This is what I think about the argument that shows that crime can and should be divided by race.

Can you give some examples of countries that have integrated minorities and immigrants into their population smoothly and on a large scale.

 

[Victorian Gray]

Can you give some examples of countries that have integrated minorities and immigrants into their population smoothly and on a large scale.

Canada. Roughly 1/4 of our population is foreign born.

 

[TheVrolok]

Canada. Roughly 1/4 of our population is foreign born.

Not that I'm disagreeing with you, but the question is race not place of birth. What percentage of that quarter are European whites? Serious question. (of course I take it as a given that Canada is more welcoming, receptive, and progressive than bastian of racism we have down here)

 

[Jaskalas]

I believe the racial divisions have multiple factors to enhance them in the United States.

First of all, fighting a bloody civil war and the way it which it ended, in Sherman's march, left half the country angry and bitter on the subject. Blacks who remained in the South were targeted for vengeance and it was real ugly for 100 years following. Betting many minorities fled that violence only to hear horror stories involving those that remained. Even today, friction from that mistreatment has got to be huge. That hatred is the very reason Southern symbols are being attacked and torn down in 2017.

Then the cities they fled to, such as Chicago, had large mafia gangs shooting it out with people. This lead to a social fabric of violence, and affected poor people the most. Entire neighborhoods of those cities are divided by race, and by poverty. Chicago's south side is famous for one thing. Maybe America's guns are perpetuating a maddening sickness of gangs seeking vengeance on one another, which is turned into racial stereotypes, fear, and resentment.

Speaking of resentment. Did I mention poverty? Our trickle down politics these past 40 years has got to be crushing race relations under the tension of mere survival. The struggle is real, and with humanity's natural tendency towards tribalism, America's history of bitter division, is it any wonder we are picking open old wounds that modern societies should have healed from and moved past?

Perhaps it begins with cycles of poverty and violence that we are far too ignorant to properly address and cure.

 

[96Firebird]

Canada. Roughly 1/4 of our population is foreign born.

I've watched Canadian news and politics, especially this summer. You guys are just as racist as the US, trust me.

Just a couple I remember from my few weekends spent at the cottage (Global News is the only station we get on our antenna)...

https://globalnews.ca/news/3530643/dash-cam-racist-verbal-attack/

https://globalnews.ca/news/3692313/racist-tirade-skytrain/

 

[Commodus]

I've watched Canadian news and politics, especially this summer. You guys are just as racist as the US, trust me.

Just a couple I remember from my few weekends spent at the cottage (Global News is the only station we get on our antenna)...

https://globalnews.ca/news/3530643/dash-cam-racist-verbal-attack/

https://globalnews.ca/news/3692313/racist-tirade-skytrain/

No, they're not. They absolutely aren't.

There's a difference between racism existing in a country and being widespread. Do you see racist groups marching proudly in Canada, feeling like they have the support of the government? No, you don't. Do you see politicians who court racism getting much success in Canada? No, you don't. There were a couple of candidates for the country's Conservative Party leadership who styled themselves as Trump-wannabes, complete with racist dogwhistles; they got shut down. It's very open to immigration, and its current leadership is some of the most diverse you'll see in the G8.

This isn't to say racism isn't a problem in Canada, but it's not nearly as pervasive as it is in the US. If nothing else, the lack of a slavery legacy means there are fewer people desperately clinging to racism as part of their cultural identity.

 

[96Firebird]

Yes, yes they are. Have you been to a Canadian town outside of a major city? I've posted this here before, but rural Canadians are just as racist as rural Americans. I walked into a store in the small town near my cottage, and once the owner learned we were from the states she raved about Trump. She was excited that he was keeping immigrants out and exclaimed how she wished Trudeau was kicked out of office because he let's everyone in.

Not to mention the far right political party in Canada is just as crazy as it is here. They are just not in power, so the news doesn't focus on them.

 

[unseenmorbidity]

I would guess and I think I've read that places that have more minorities tend to have more racial harmony. Race in big cities isn't a big deal as it is in more rural, homogenous areas. Most racism stems from a lack of exposure to other types of people.

So, it might interest you to know that segregation in schools still exists. It's predominantly in the north, like NYC.

 

[Commodus]

Yes, yes they are. Have you been to a Canadian town outside of a major city? I've posted this here before, but rural Canadians are just as racist as rural Americans. I walked into a store in the small town near my cottage, and once the owner learned we were from the states she raved about Trump. She was excited that he was keeping immigrants out and exclaimed how she wished Trudeau was kicked out of office because he let's everyone in.

Not to mention the far right political party in Canada is just as crazy as it is here. They are just not in power, so the news doesn't focus on them.

I have been, and I know that rural Canada has its share of racism. Alberta in particular. But here's the thing: the clear majority of Canada's population not only lives in major cities (81 percent, according to stats), but lives in a relative handful of cities that tend to be very multicultural and pro-immigration. Imagine if most of the American population lived in a fraction of the cities it does now, and nearly all of them were the liberal ones like New York and San Francisco; that's Canada's distribution.

Which far-right party are you referring to? The Conservatives are definitely right-wing, but not far right, and the Bloc Quebecois isn't what I'd characterize as far right these days.

It sounds like you're confusing personal anecdotes with broader statistics. Yes, you can certainly find racists in Canada. But one small town store operator doesn't represent the sum total of racism in Canada. Again, show me where the emboldened racist marches and tolerated islamophobia are -- you won't really find them.

 

[ivwshane]

So, it might interest you to know that segregation in schools still exists. It's predominantly in the north, like NYC.

You are correct.

 

[bradly1101]

Can you give some examples of countries that have integrated minorities and immigrants into their population smoothly and on a large scale.

All these countries are smaller, but why can't their acceptance, lack of fear, lack of feeling better than, whatever it is be upscaled here? Going by my experiences in Germany, Austria, and Belgium I didn't see job sectors as dominated by race as I see here. It seemed normal there for all races to be wearing a suit and tie, carrying a briefcase/satchel, and entering and exiting an office building. Here if you visit downtown L.A. the business people scurrying about are vastly white, while just a few short blocks away is skid row dominated by black and brown people languishing in poverty. I just didn't see that there.

Since then there has obviously been an influx of migrants from Africa and the Middle East escaping violent race and religious differences, poverty, crime, terrorism, and coalition, Syrian, Russian, and Iraqi bombs. This is a relatively new situation born of overpopulation (IMO), and fueled by these perceived differences in their home countries. Still many places in Europe welcome these folks, try to integrate them, get them jobs, and give them benefits with barely a whimper. They aren't generally considered "illegals" nor are they relegated to "less than" status. That's not to say that there hasn't been nationalistic, racist uprisings, and although some of those groups are gaining seats in government since they do represent some views, overall the strength of integration there will prevail over divisiveness (IMO).

Here in this forum I remember a member proudly saying that he confronted brown people speaking Spanish by emphatically telling them to speak English. Would he have said that to a white Dutch couple speaking Dutch? Race aside, who would say such a thing? I don't wonder how I would feel if in my travels while speaking English if someone said to me, "Speak [whatever]!" I know I wouldn't feel welcome. It's my guess that this happens often in the U.S., although mainly in the middle.

In Mexico whites are welcomed with ease, and many have happily immigrated there with few if any racial problems. I know that having a job or being financially independent have advantages in immigration everywhere.

"If your move to Mexico involves retirement, Mexico makes that easy. Retirement visas are granted liberally and one can achieve Permanent Resident status without transitioning through the Temporary Residency process. Visas are easy to obtain and the process begins at the Mexican embassy in your home state or province."

I could go on about other countries/regions. Although connected, this is more about race than immigration. I see whites welcomed all over the world, even honored in some historically black areas/countries. Why aren't many whites in the U.S. as embracing to not only immigrants but to different races in general? Going by my experience in my first post, many blacks feel mutually. Why do we in the U.S. (whites and blacks) embrace hatred of "others" so much? Doesn't integration have demonstrably better outcomes? Are we still so tribal? Why do some places overcome that instinct?

 

[Victorian Gray]

Not that I'm disagreeing with you, but the question is race not place of birth. What percentage of that quarter are European whites? Serious question. (of course I take it as a given that Canada is more welcoming, receptive, and progressive than bastian of racism we have down here)

These charts should answer your question.

https://www.statcan.gc.ca/pub/11-630-x/11-630-x2016006-eng.htm

"In the past 11 years, China, India and the Philippines have been the top three sources of immigration to Canada."

http://canadaimmigrants.com/canada-immigration-by-source-country-2015/

 

[bradly1101]

That hatred is the very reason Southern symbols are being attacked and torn down in 2017.

Is it hatred that's tearing them down, or a desire to overcome hatred?

Otherwise I agree with all your points. They are the causes of our problem, but knowing that, I wonder why there hasn't been a reckoning with those historic sensitivities. In 2017 we seem to be slipping back, not moving forward. Civil rights defined the 1960's, and it feels like we're worse now with segregation and ill feeling.

 

[bradly1101]

So, it might interest you to know that segregation in schools still exists. It's predominantly in the north, like NYC.

I disagree. Segregation is everywhere, and not just in schools.

"...Of course, it wasn’t just the nasty politics of the early 1900s that made Charlotte into the segregated city it is today. Redlining in the 1930s made it difficult for black homeowners to get loans to buy or repair their homes. Federal highway construction in the 1960s and 1970s decimated traditionally black neighborhoods and displaced whole communities to the outer edges of town (including the neighborhood where former transportation secretary Anthony Foxx grew up). Gentrification continues to displace black and Latino Charlotte residents from neighborhoods where they had long lived.

But the policies that continue to segregate Charlotte and other Southern cities have their roots in the nasty racial battles of the late 19th century. To segregate residents, there had to first be an idea that white people were superior and that black people deserved less. That idea was a strategy pushed by elite whites to make sure they could hold onto power. It took hold and has never lost its grip."

Good article on this.

 

[J.Wilkins]

I know it's a word that contains truth; there are fewer numbers in the non-white groups in the U.S., but IMO it also gives us the supposed rationality that allows segregation and a high number of other disparities.

I heard my elderly aunt use the words "minorities" and "they" in a sentence. She really wasn't trying to be racist, but I wonder why "they" are even considered "they?"

I've noticed that outside of criminals (which of course exist in all groups), some countries seem to have integrated their populations more smoothly. Is it because majorities there don't make as many distinctions, or don't concern themselves as much? Does the majority see itself as no different than the minority and vice versa? Is that even considered desirable here anymore?

I live in a mixed area, and was threatened because of my skin color once, but am regularly in multi-racial places with no problems, so although race played a role, this was of course more about hate taking over someone's mind as it has with all humans, we all recognize it. I have wondered why ever since. Why did he hate me? Did he think I hated him? Was it purely because of skin color, or does it include territory, and did the fact that I'm in a manual wheelchair play a role? I know these aren't questions for you, but this one is: Why do some places get this right?

I know that some of the places that seem to do well with immigration also have had terror attacks, and I don't mean this conversation to be about who or where has had the most attacks, most dead, etc., or what race or ideology is best, least violent, etc.

This is what I think about the argument that shows that crime can and should be divided by race.

The distinction is today needed simply to give the "minorities" a fighting chance. We started out this way and now there is no way to ensure that they get the benefits that they previously lacked except through affirmative actions towards them.

It sucks but we can't go back and fix the past and we still can't fix the present.

 

[bradly1101]

The distinction is today needed simply to give the "minorities" a fighting chance. We started out this way and now there is no way to ensure that they get the benefits that they previously lacked except through affirmative actions towards them.

It sucks but we can't go back and fix the past and we still can't fix the present.

Yes, racial statistics allow people to see what needs to be done, where to focus for better or worse, but too often I see them used as a way to justify differences. Overall does the collection and dissemination of these statistics pull us together or push us apart? (For the record, I see Britain as a place that has done well with integration.)

 

[J.Wilkins]

Yes, racial statistics allow people to see what needs to be done, where to focus for better or worse, but too often I see them used as a way to justify differences. Overall does the collection and dissemination of these statistics pull us together or push us apart? (For the record, I see Britain as a place that has done well with integration.)

Oh it's a divider for sure, but it's one that is absolutely necessary in nations where there has been or is today a divider that relates to the subject.

I would say that somehow all of that has gone away here but we still have it in some places and there the common law resolves the problem since it's based on liberalism which means that equality is a given.

Sure, we still have some inequalities but in law we have an absolute ban on any form of discrimination and that is as far as we can go to treat everyone as equals which was our goal.

We don't share the same history, we didn't go from slavery to continuously regarding black people as a lower standing race as you did so we don't have the same disparity and with the aggressive onslaught of liberalism we did away with the idea of minorities and brought everyone together as Englismen. This doesn't mean that we don't have divides because we are certainly not perfect but this kind of problem isn't one we share.

 

[bradly1101]

Oh it's a divider for sure, but it's one that is absolutely necessary in nations where there has been or is today a divider that relates to the subject.

I would say that somehow all of that has gone away here but we still have it in some places and there the common law resolves the problem since it's based on liberalism which means that equality is a given.

Sure, we still have some inequalities but in law we have an absolute ban on any form of discrimination and that is as far as we can go to treat everyone as equals which was our goal.

We don't share the same history, we didn't go from slavery to continuously regarding black people as a lower standing race as you did so we don't have the same disparity and with the aggressive onslaught of liberalism we did away with the idea of minorities and brought everyone together as Englismen. This doesn't mean that we don't have divides because we are certainly not perfect but this kind of problem isn't one we share.

I wonder why America can't be inspired by such places. It seems very difficult here to admit mistakes even (or especially) about something so huge.

 

[J.Wilkins]

I wonder why America can't be inspired by such places. It seems very difficult here to admit mistakes even (or especially) about something so huge.

Given that you still teach that people escaped religious oppression in England to form a new community (the exact opposite is true) and the rest of the bullshit taught about how the US never made a single mistake in the history of mankind at all ever never at all ever... Well... If you don't learn from your mistakes even when you nuke nations for no reason WHAT SO EVER then you are doomed to repeat that bullshit.

Or to put it another way, if you think you have everything figured out, why on earth would you change anything?

 

[MajinCry]

America is a country founded on the genocide (sexual and labour enslavement, followed by mass extermination) of an entire race, with it proceeding to subject another race to sexual and labour enslavement during it's teenage years.

Wondering why the US has problems among an interracial population is dumb. Everybody knows why; because of all the bad shit the majority did to the minority, all the bad shit the majority continues to do to the minority, and the lingering aftereffects of both.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Well of course it's to know who is on the approved list to hate.