Why Do Women Get Paid Less Than Men? An Insider Look....

[s0me0nesmind1]

Warning: This is much less of a "factual argument" and more of an opinionated debate topic. You have been warned. Please have experience on the topic, that obviously plays a bigger factor.



My general view simply boils down to this: After living with my wife for quite some time now I have studied how she evolves with her work. She often complains, but does very little. When it comes to work, if they don't answer my calling, it's time to go. There have been times she has come home to cry on my shoulder from what happened at work.

This is simply to bring on the emphasis for WHY there is a pay gap between genders. It's not because managers have a sexist view. It's because women have a lack of adapting to the working world like men do.


So let me walk you through myself and my wife as far as salary goes.

Myself - Graduation From College (Business MIS/CIS Degree)
1st Job - Age 22 - 25 - ~$45k
2nd Job - Age 25 - 26 - ~$65k - Through Networking and talking with others
3rd Job - $75k (Now Ahead)

Wife - Graduated From College of Science / Engineering (Double Major - Physics + Other)
1st Job (Only Major Job After) - ~$55k Starting. ~ Age 23 - 31. Pay now ~$68k

Case-in Point? I'm 26. She is 31. I am making more... and she has a double major with physics work. Am I bragging? Hell no. My point is simply being that women are obvious to getting in a "comfort zone". She has friends at work, I can guarantee she would have issues "leaving" them by having to get a new job. I've told to her to pack her shit and leave and but well... that's a different topic



What it boils down to:

Who is more willing to pack up their shit, move, and take a job elsewhere on a whim? Men.
Who is more willing to change jobs in general? Men.
What do you need to do to get ahead in life these days? Change jobs.
Fin.

Discuss.

 

[Anarchist420]

Men actually dont make more than women do. Women make more per hour they work vs per hour men work and they're less likely to be unemployed. And that only makes sense given that women have higher fluid intelligence and lower crystallized intelligence than men do, since women adapt better, and since fluid intelligence correlates with wages while crystallized doesnt.

 

[Tweak155]

My wife is 26 and earns almost exactly the same as you do before OT. This is due to me pushing her though (and sometimes writing the email for her and letting her send it). While I'm "still ahead" of her at 30, I take every opportunity to teach her what I've learned to get what I want. She argues me sometimes still but now she sees when she does what I suggest, it turns out great for her. So now she'll suck it up and do it and not once has it failed, even though she might bemoan a little.

Perhaps you should take a different perspective on things as to who is "falling behind" in your relationship.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

My wife is 26 and earns almost exactly the same as you do before OT. This is due to me pushing her though (and sometimes writing the email for her and letting her send it). While I'm "still ahead" of her at 30, I take every opportunity to teach her what I've learned to get what I want. She argues me sometimes still but now she sees when she does what I suggest, it turns out great for her. So now she'll suck it up and do it and not once has it failed, even though she might bemoan a little.

Perhaps you should take a different perspective on things as to who is "falling behind" in your relationship.

I've told to her to pack her shit and leave and but well... that's a different topic

ARRR avast Matey! Stay on topic! Ye' be gettin' off course!

If anything you helped me, because you admitted your woman couldn't do jack shit for herself. Imagine a woman in place without your ability for you to put your foot down and say "NO! Put your foot down and tell your boss to fuck off." That is the entire concept. That women aren't able to do anything without the help of men, isn't it?

 

[Tweak155]

ARRR avast Matey! Stay on topic! Ye' be gettin' off course!

If anything you helped me, because you admitted your woman couldn't do jack shit for herself. Imagine a woman in place without your ability for you to put your foot down and say "NO! Put your foot down and tell your boss to fuck off." That is the entire concept. That women aren't able to do anything without the help of men, isn't it?

Clearly I haven't helped you as you haven't changed your attitude. My wife wouldn't listen to me at first either. One of us succeeded, the other is you.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

Clearly I haven't helped you as you haven't changed your attitude. My wife wouldn't listen to me at first either. One of us succeeded, the other is you.

If you're delving into the off-topic part... no... no she will not listen.

Of course, that's not the topic I made this thread for.

 

[Slew Foot]

I cant speak for other industries but in healthcare, women physicians rarely work full time. They rarely take on extra tasks, serve on committees, or get advanced training. Most of them want to work a shift 8 hours a day, 3 days a week, and collect whatever salary someone is willing to pay them. They wont negotiate anything, and wont ever leave their job. As opposed to men who will work multiple jobs simultaneously, get advanced training, negotiate ruthlessly, and switch jobs at a whim if they can.

 

[Zorba]

I can see this is quickly turning into a nice sexist rant fest, but I'll add my experience:

I have a BS and MS in Mechanical Engineering, my wife only has a BS in Mechanical Engineering, both 30. She started out making 8K/yr less than me. Now she is making more than 4K/yr more than I do, even though my salary has gone up ~50% in 7 years.

I've met just as many men that will let companies walk all over them as women. At my first job I worked with men with my exact background but 5 years of experience making 10K/yr less than me, 7 years later they still work for that shit hole. All the women I directly worked with there either got promoted or left.

 

[Brainonska511]

I can see this is quickly turning into a nice sexist rant fest

Of course it's going to turn into that. It's P&N. And everyone's going to fill it with their anecdotes that happen to support their personal perspective about why the OP is or isn't correct.

 

[saratoga172]

I cant speak for other industries but in healthcare, women physicians rarely work full time. They rarely take on extra tasks, serve on committees, or get advanced training. Most of them want to work a shift 8 hours a day, 3 days a week, and collect whatever salary someone is willing to pay them. They wont negotiate anything, and wont ever leave their job. As opposed to men who will work multiple jobs simultaneously, get advanced training, negotiate ruthlessly, and switch jobs at a whim if they can.

That's really what I see even with my gf and other women in my industry. Men push themselves to advance but women get comfortable and stay put. Difference in personality I guess.

 

[DominionSeraph]

Conservatards gonna 'tard.

 

[justoh]

Conservatards gonna 'tard.

How many of your 8000 posts are merely this same boring statement?

 

[positivedoppler]

It's been my experience that Women get the benefit over men in the engineering world due to the ridiculous men to women ratio. Some do get preferential treatment while at the same time a higher percentage of the women seem also seems to be more interested in managing and directing vs actually staying in engineering. I definitely see a proportional amount of women in managing and project engineering role than men. No problem for me, I enjoy working for a pretty face.

In the business world, I can only guess it's different. This is just me theorizing btw. There is a social aspect to advancing. Women usually bare the blunt of the burden when it comes to raising kids and are less likely to participate in after work bar outings.

 

[Newell Steamer]

Discuss.

Discuss, what, your anecdotal account of what you claim is the truth? This "Insider" look is frankly nothing.

Your sliver of the world does not represent the world. Trust me, I would love for that to be the case (but, only if my sliver of the world dictated how everything else ran - ain't I a stinker?), but that is not reality.

Come back with facts, figures, studies, etc. and back what you claim "isn't happening". So, much like racism and rape, we now have someone claiming women aren't being paid less,... based on what one person sees, in their own world no less.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

I can see this is quickly turning into a nice sexist rant fest, but I'll add my experience:

I have a BS and MS in Mechanical Engineering, my wife only has a BS in Mechanical Engineering, both 30. She started out making 8K/yr less than me. Now she is making more than 4K/yr more than I do, even though my salary has gone up ~50% in 7 years.

I've met just as many men that will let companies walk all over them as women. At my first job I worked with men with my exact background but 5 years of experience making 10K/yr less than me, 7 years later they still work for that shit hole. All the women I directly worked with there either got promoted or left.

I think that is semi the point of this thread: The ENTIRE world will walk all over you if you let it. No one is going to walk by your desk is and say "Wait - Mary, you're still here after 8 years? How much are you making? $60k!?!?! That's only $5k more than what you started with! I'm going to talk to the executives and get some motions passed on getting you bumped up to $80k.".

That's precisely it. It requires your OWN DUE DILIGENCE. Men or Women (but the point of this thread being the majority women) - people will walk over you if you let them. Workforce included.

 

[fskimospy]

I wonder what the odds are of a forum that is comprised of nearly entirely men coming to the conclusion that men have ended up in a superior place due to something other than their own admirable attributes is?

My guess is somewhere approaching zero.

 

[Paratus]

My wife and I are the same age, graduated from the same school, with the same degree. She had 10% better GPA than me. We started out in the same field and she made 10% more than me.

We both now work for the same employer. She makes ~15% more than I.

Was there a point to this other than trying to find anecdotal evidence to support some stereotypical viewpoint?

 

[Attic]

I mostly interested in salary and pay broken down with women who pursued a career while not having children and women who pursued a career while trying to bear children and raise a family.


If different, compare those two lines to what men earn in similar roles.

It is not in business best interest to not retain talent, but if there is an angle to underpay women that will be certainly be used.

 

[Anarchist420]

I mostly interested in salary and pay broken down with women who pursued a career while not having children and women who pursued a career while trying to bear children and raise a family. If different, compare those two lines to what men earn in similar roles. It is not in business best interest to not retain talent, but if there is an angle to underpay women that will be certainly be used.

+1. Childless women in the private sector make more than men do in the private sector because women are more talented overall. Figures saying women make less are distorted because there are too many public sector jobs (which favor men by far), because most women have kids, and because female CEOs make less than male CEOs only because female CEOs put the money back into the company and pay workers more (looking at how much CEOs get paid by sex is stupid because overpaid CEOs generally run worse companies that dont necessarily have higher revenue).

And anyone who favors more govt thinking it will help females is an idiot just like those who think the entity that militarizes cops everywhere favors blacks way more than it hurts them.

 

[Sattern]

My great aunt is over 90 years old and she doesn't believe women should be paid as much as men for various reasons.

Them being, but not limited to: they take days off from work because of family, they have more health issues and generally can't perform as well as men because of most being glued to their phones.

This is coming from a 93 year old women who has worked in the past and I agree with her completely because there are many liability issues you can't get rid of.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

I mostly interested in salary and pay broken down with women who pursued a career while not having children and women who pursued a career while trying to bear children and raise a family.


If different, compare those two lines to what men earn in similar roles.

It is not in business best interest to not retain talent, but if there is an angle to underpay women that will be certainly be used.

To be quite honest, each and every business these days has done an overall horrible job of maintaining talent in general (men, women, thing, anyone). Turnover in general has just climbed at alarming rates due to the fact that no one is keeping up raises with inflation. I think women are the ones being taken advantage of there because they have a problem being willing to look for another position.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

I can see this is quickly turning into a nice sexist rant fest, but I'll add my experience:

I have a BS and MS in Mechanical Engineering, my wife only has a BS in Mechanical Engineering, both 30. She started out making 8K/yr less than me. Now she is making more than 4K/yr more than I do, even though my salary has gone up ~50% in 7 years.

I've met just as many men that will let companies walk all over them as women. At my first job I worked with men with my exact background but 5 years of experience making 10K/yr less than me, 7 years later they still work for that shit hole. All the women I directly worked with there either got promoted or left.

Agreed - but it becomes a proportional study - who is more likely to let a company walk all over them? Testosterone men? Or child caring women? Again, this isn't a factual argument, hence the warning at the top.

All sides are going to have different outcomes, it's merely a debate. I'm not about to say anyone here is wrong or full of shit.

 

[Veliko]

My great aunt is over 90 years old and she doesn't believe women should be paid as much as men for various reasons.

Them being, but not limited to: they take days off from work because of family, they have more health issues and generally can't perform as well as men because of most being glued to their phones.

This is coming from a 93 year old women who has worked in the past and I agree with her completely because there are many liability issues you can't get rid of.

Your great aunt at least has the excuse that she's old but I don't know what yours is.

Would you be happy if your employer paid men less because they're more likely to get into a physical confrontation with colleagues?

 

[Knowing]

Consider that housewives have 0 reportable income, but live in a home with a phone while the homeless (who are overwhelmingly male) don't live in a home with a phone and cannot report their income when polled "scientifically."

There's an enormous collection of reasons that women don't make the same amount of money as men, even when you compare them on as equitable terms as possible.

 

[Zodiark1593]

Warning: This is much less of a "factual argument" and more of an opinionated debate topic. You have been warned. Please have experience on the topic, that obviously plays a bigger factor.



My general view simply boils down to this: After living with my wife for quite some time now I have studied how she evolves with her work. She often complains, but does very little. When it comes to work, if they don't answer my calling, it's time to go. There have been times she has come home to cry on my shoulder from what happened at work.

This is simply to bring on the emphasis for WHY there is a pay gap between genders. It's not because managers have a sexist view. It's because women have a lack of adapting to the working world like men do.


So let me walk you through myself and my wife as far as salary goes.

Myself - Graduation From College (Business MIS/CIS Degree)
1st Job - Age 22 - 25 - ~$45k
2nd Job - Age 25 - 26 - ~$65k - Through Networking and talking with others
3rd Job - $75k (Now Ahead)

Wife - Graduated From College of Science / Engineering (Double Major - Physics + Other)
1st Job (Only Major Job After) - ~$55k Starting. ~ Age 23 - 31. Pay now ~$68k

Case-in Point? I'm 26. She is 31. I am making more... and she has a double major with physics work. Am I bragging? Hell no. My point is simply being that women are obvious to getting in a "comfort zone". She has friends at work, I can guarantee she would have issues "leaving" them by having to get a new job. I've told to her to pack her shit and leave and but well... that's a different topic



What it boils down to:

Who is more willing to pack up their shit, move, and take a job elsewhere on a whim? Men.
Who is more willing to change jobs in general? Men.
What do you need to do to get ahead in life these days? Change jobs.
Fin.

Discuss.

To make a lot of money often involve taking risks (the big difference between the successful, and everyone else). Historically, men are much more the risk takers than women, and are more likely to take preemptive action for their own benefit. Employers know this, so men are typically paid more to reduce the chances of good employees up and leaving.

Most women, seek stability, and so are unlikely to leave a job (and subsequently, people) they're used to. As the employer sees (most) women as less likely to leave, said employer doesn't need to pay as much to ensure they don't up and leave for better opportunity.

While there are definitely exceptions in both genders (in personality, and the pay to reflect it), I agree with the OP.

With this rationale in mind, I theorize pure-sexism has a relatively small role in the pay gap.