Why do you liberals show more outrage toward GWB than toward Al Qaeda? And why we should STAY in Iraq.

[MAW1082]

Dude, let me spell it out for you then.

1. We mess around in another county/region's business, people in that country get mad. (example: OSB)

2. OSB is mad the American military controls the middle east, whether it be through direct control by U.S. armed forces or some kind of proxy army. (example: US military in Saudi Arabia, support/creation of Israeli Armed forces, Pakistani army, etc.)

3. OSB doesn't seem to like American Imperialism very much, just like most Arabs probably don't. Is this such a hard concept to accept. In the American Revolution, Americans stood up to their imperial master at the cost of thousands of American and British lives. Now we're on the other side of an anti-imperialist revolt. If we continue to militarily and economically dominate the third world, terrorists / "freedom fighters" will continue to fight with their lives for the independance of their lands.

4. This exact theme has repeated itself throughout history. Imperialism is the history of the modern world.

5. Having said this, are we willing to accept the fact that terrorists will continue to flow from our assimilated lands, or are we willing to change the way we operate in the international community in order to promote world peace?

**Just in case you were wondering, a few examples of anti-imperialist movements are (Cuban Revolution, end to Apartheid in South Africa, Taiwan, seeminlgy endless cycles in South / Latin America)

**Killing Osama bin Laden will do absolutely nothing except further enrage his supporters.

 

[Spencer278]

Originally posted by: CADkindaGUY

Originally posted by: busmaster11
BTW, neocons, go ahead and continue to equate Iraq with the war on terror when the whole braintrust of neocon central is backtracking on that.

And yeah, CAD, Iraq may well have a brighter future now than before, but I'd like to see some evidence that that was important to any of you prior to 9/11.

Hardly

- you interchange AlQeada and Terrorism. Iraq is in response to the way the our outlook has changed. We have to be alot more firm in the world with people who don't uphold their end of diplomatic agreements. I don't give a rats ass about Al Qaeda-Saddam links because that's not why I have supported action against Saddam since he didn't hold up his end of the agreement. And yes - Iraq WAS important to me long before 9/11 as I have stated. It's too bad it wasn't a concern of those who choose coddling and appeasement instead of backing up words with action. I actually supported Clinton's action because he actually gave defined deadlines and actually acted when Saddam yet again chose not to do as he had agreed, but I don't think Clinton did enough. It doesn't take science to know that when people don't hold up their end of an agreement there are consequences.
It also doesn't take science to understand that someone who has bastardized religion in their selfish quest to destroy America or other Western worlds need to be destroyed. Yes, we need to understand them - understand that they hate America and the Western World and will use terror, chaos, and the killing of innocents in their quest.

Anyway - someone was yapping about a leaky roof and the use of a bucket. Well, that's exactly how using "law enforcement" to take care of Terrorism works. You see - we have to stop the water from entering the house and causing damage. If that is adding another layer of shingles -so be it. If we need a temporary tarp like the Patriot Act to cover the hole until we can fix the structural damage that has become apparant - so be it. Yes -we need to fix the roof but trying to understand the rain doesn't stop it from hitting your roof. But if some rain happens to slip through - we need that bucket and mop to take care of it. We need both law enforcement and better action to protect against terrorism.

CkG

Then if you just repair the roof you never fixed the cause of the whole. There is always another layer that can be added to fix the problem. Why stop with just partiot act which goal is mearly to trap a little water and a new lawyer of shingles which is really just a band aid. You need to understand not the rain but the whole in the roof. When you don't understand what is cause holes to form how do you intended to keep them from forming again?

 

[steveeast112]

Originally posted by: IndieSnob
I really think the topic of this thread should be....

'Why do you conservatives beleive that we can't. hate Bush and hate Osama at the same time'

Really, I'm so goddamn sick of you conservatives labeling every single liberal as being 'friends' of people like Sadaam and Osama, and even a few going as far as saying we'd rather elect either of those two over Bush. Face it, we dislike Bush for real reasons, reasons that none of you can disprove. So instead of focusing on showing us the truth, you throw a bunch of the 'if you're not with us, you're against us', and 'gee them liberals love them muslim extremists'. Do yourself a favor and get a brain before you post such hypocritical things, when in fact you're the same.

Excellent Post. I have not heard a single reason yet in this thread explaining the conservative postition. Rather, I just hear name-calling and fascism. Conservatives need to grow up, or at least give me a reason that Bush is good. The blame game has gone too far.

 

[conjur]

Originally posted by: Spencer278


Then if you just repair the roof you never fixed the cause of the whole. There is always another layer that can be added to fix the problem. Why stop with just partiot act which goal is mearly to trap a little water and a new lawyer of shingles which is really just a band aid. You need to understand not the rain but the whole in the roof. When you don't understand what is cause holes to form how do you intended to keep them from forming again?

But then they can't prove that might makes right. The myopic affliction that's spread amongst these neocons is going to be fatal to our country.

 

[steveeast112]

True conjur. Might doesn't make right. Look at Soviet Russia. They might have been powerful, but was it justified in invading Afghanistan and other republics? No, and it wasn't justified in exploiting its own people.

 

[CADsortaGUY]

Originally posted by: Spencer278
Then if you just repair the roof you never fixed the cause of the whole. There is always another layer that can be added to fix the problem. Why stop with just partiot act which goal is mearly to trap a little water and a new lawyer of shingles which is really just a band aid. You need to understand not the rain but the whole in the roof. When you don't understand what is cause holes to form how do you intended to keep them from forming again?

If you had been looking up - you'd have seen my post fly right over your head. Did you not read the part about repairing the roof? No - you must not have because you wouldn't have posted what you did if you had.

Oh well - I'm starting to agree with MAW about that intelligence level issue I still hold out hope though

CkG

 

[DealMonkey]

Dammit, where's Moonie to give an appropriate roof/hole/rain metaphor?

Anyway, sometimes I secretly wish that U.S. foreign policy would do a complete 180 and our new policy would be complete non-involvement in the Middle East region. We'd continue to buy their stinky oil just like the rest of the world of course . . . I know it would probably be seen as capitulating to terrorists (so save it), after all, you just know that's what they all want: to be left completely alone in their little zones of Islamic control so they can live out their tribal ways in peace.

 

[burnedout]

Originally posted by: steveeast112
True conjur. Might doesn't make right. Look at Soviet Russia. They might have been powerful, but was it justified in invading Afghanistan and other republics? No, and it wasn't justified in exploiting its own people.

The Soviets felt very strongly about their decision. Read declassified Soviet documents sometime to learn why.

 

[IndieSnob]

You know I also have other huge problems with your moronic most uniformed post, Crimson...

First off you say that liberals want GWB to be impeached. You know for the most part I don't think I've heard that out of the lips of any one single liberal politician, nor do I hear it from any news source, and not too many board postings, etc. but yet when Clinton got a simple blowjob which affected NO ONE all the republicans were up in arms and chanting 'impeach' from day one. Yet another misnomer you want to lump onto liberals. Pot meet kettle.

Secondly have you really seen any republicans, or anyone else for that matter have anti-terrorist demonstrations? No. Because as one other poster said do you really think the muslim extremists are listening to your particular voice? No! Instead they are listening to this naive dumb politician the Dub that you idiots seem to defend when you know you're just defending your hero so you can shave a few more dollars off that tax bill.

Thirdly don't act as if we're dumb. We know DAMN WELL that it was Al Quaeda and OBL who planned the attacks and flew those planes, have you heard anyone else say that it was GWB or is this just another quantum leap for you? Again quit sticking your foot in your mouth. Also you think there is no outrage toward these people from liberals? I guess anyone that is liberal that lost a family member either at the pentago or at the towers isn't outraged? I'm sure they'd be sickened and insulted to know that you're their voice. Again pull your foot out of your mouth or quit being so pathetically stupid.


I could go on and on, but I allready know I've caught you in your own hypocriscy, which is good enough for me. Come on republican, flame us liberals to take away from the fact that you really can't defend Bush like you really want to. You're playing a losing game, and showing your true colors. Congrats!

 

[burnedout]

You know for the most part I don't think I've heard that out of the lips of any one single liberal politician, nor do I hear it from any news source, board postings, etc. but yet when Clinton got a simple blowjob which affected NO ONE all the republicans were up in arms and chanting 'impeach' from day one. Yet another misnomer you want to lump onto liberals. Pot meet kettle.

Here's a couple from AT P&N:

Text

Text

To be fair, however, there exists a seemingly perpetual conflict on ATPN mainly consisting of oneupsmanship sprinkled with the occasional "gotcha".

 

[IndieSnob]

Originally posted by: burnedout

You know for the most part I don't think I've heard that out of the lips of any one single liberal politician, nor do I hear it from any news source, board postings, etc. but yet when Clinton got a simple blowjob which affected NO ONE all the republicans were up in arms and chanting 'impeach' from day one. Yet another misnomer you want to lump onto liberals. Pot meet kettle.

Here's a couple from AT P&N:

Text

Text

To be fair, however, there exists a seemingly perpetual conflict on ATPN mainly consisting of oneupsmanship sprinkled with the occasional "gotcha".

In all honesty, and not to backtrack, I meant to post 'much from board postings'. Also 2 threads and a few in each crying for it doesn't even close to equal the amount that went on during the clinton debacle. But thanks for showing me those none the less!

 

[Odoacer]

I'd jump in and pitch my conservative 2 cents rationally, but this thread has become such a sh!t-fest that I'll save my thoughts for the next topic that comes along.

 

[EXman]

Simple Osama is not in the White house he is in Las vegas!

 

[sandorski]

Originally posted by: EXman
Simple Osama is not in the White house he is in Las vegas!

What happens there, stays there!

 

[conjur]

Originally posted by: burnedout

Originally posted by: steveeast112
True conjur. Might doesn't make right. Look at Soviet Russia. They might have been powerful, but was it justified in invading Afghanistan and other republics? No, and it wasn't justified in exploiting its own people.

The Soviets felt very strongly about their decision. Read declassified Soviet documents sometime to learn why.

The Japanese felt strongly about bombing Pearl Harbor.
Hitler felt strongly about taking over Europe.
The Puritans felt strongly about burning "witches".

 

[burnedout]

Originally posted by: conjur

Originally posted by: burnedout

Originally posted by: steveeast112
True conjur. Might doesn't make right. Look at Soviet Russia. They might have been powerful, but was it justified in invading Afghanistan and other republics? No, and it wasn't justified in exploiting its own people.

The Soviets felt very strongly about their decision. Read declassified Soviet documents sometime to learn why.

The Japanese felt strongly about bombing Pearl Harbor.
Hitler felt strongly about taking over Europe.
The Puritans felt strongly about burning "witches".

Who provoked the Soviets? Mickey Mouse, right?

 

[sandorski]

Originally posted by: burnedout

Originally posted by: conjur

Originally posted by: burnedout

Originally posted by: steveeast112
True conjur. Might doesn't make right. Look at Soviet Russia. They might have been powerful, but was it justified in invading Afghanistan and other republics? No, and it wasn't justified in exploiting its own people.

The Soviets felt very strongly about their decision. Read declassified Soviet documents sometime to learn why.

The Japanese felt strongly about bombing Pearl Harbor.
Hitler felt strongly about taking over Europe.
The Puritans felt strongly about burning "witches".

Who provoked the Soviets? Mickey Mouse, right?

Walmartians.

 

[SniperWulf]

Originally posted by: Crimson
/rant on

Its amazing the hatred we see toward GWB by the liberals on this board. They are DEMANDING answers from him, wanting him impeached, wanting him to testify and explain why he didn't stop 9/11. They are chanting, they are yelling, they are demonstrating, they are shaking their fists... Down with Bush!!!!

But, if we bring up ANY suggestion that we fight Al Qaeda we get nothing but excuses as to why we shouldn't do it. No outrage, no anti-terrorist demonstrations, no testimonies.. no NOTHING. I think the liberals actually think GWB flew the planes into the buildings too..

Osama Bin Laden and Al Qaeda are responsible for the bombings.. THEY planned them, THEY executed them, THEY killed thousands of Americans. Yet there is no outrage toward them. They are martyrs.. they are misunderstood.. they are just protecting themselves from the evil Americans.

Personally, I am tired of it. I am tired of you liberals practically getting giddy when reports of American Soldiers dying come in and you post your 27 threads of why George Bush is evil and why he is somehow responsible for those deaths instead of the TERRORISTS that INFEST the Middle East.

With every American that dies in Iraq, that makes me even more resolved that we SHOULD be there, and that we NEED to be there. These Arab countries need to be dealt with NOW before they get their hands on Nukes and other weapons. Its absolutely HORRIBLE that any American dies, but I think for every one that does, they are potentially saving THOUSANDS of others by they heroic acts. Extremist Islamic terrorists need to be EXTERMINATED now.

"But, look at Afganistan, look at Iraq.. Look at the people uprising against us!!! They don't want us there.. and things are no better now than they were pre-9/11".. - Afganistan and Iraq and other Middle Eastern countries are in chaos? No SH|T.. they have been for the past 3000 years.. they haven't lived in peace during that whole time. They are either killing eachother, or they are killing someone else. These idiots have proven they are unable to function in modern society.. at least if we have a troop presence there, we can respond quicker when they decide to start doing something STUPID like they have for thousands of years. These Islamic countries have been blaming one group or another for their problems for centuries.. its about time someone goes in there and smacks them upside the head. They have billions if not trillions of dollars in oil underneath their sand, and they STILL can't manage to pull their people out of the middle ages.

What will it take for you liberals to see this? 3000 deaths not enough, thats George Bush's fault.. he killed them. What happens in 2-3 years when someone blows off a nuke in Manhatten? How many trains have to blow up in Spain? You need to pull your heads out of the sand and realize this world is becoming a more dangerous place every second. Its our DUTY to keep this world safe for our children and grandchildren. Britain, France, and others in Europe made the mistake of sticking their heads in the sand when Germany was building up their military machine. And it cost the United States 10's of thousands of lives in order to correct that problem. If we don't deal with the Islamic Terrorist threat now, we have the potential to reach that number again because we now live in an age where one person with a nuke in a truck can kill 100,000 people.. it no longer takes a 10 year military buildup.

The liberals are simply using the Iraq/9-11 issue as a political tool.. and its sickening.. You have no issues in which you can turn to the American people and say why your candidate should be chosen to be President other than to blame the current President for every bad thing that happens in the world.

Call me a neo-con, call me a war monger, call me whatever you want. But personally I applaud our President for having the guts to deal with a threat to my family. Thank GOD for President Bush.. thank GOD for our troops dying to protect me and my family.. I thank god every day that this country has people brave enough to die to protect us for these evil people.. and the one thing you will NEVER see me do is to blame ANYONE other than the terrorists themselves for the death of American soldiers and civilians.

/rant off

And what exactly did Al Queda and terrorist have to do with Saddam and Iraq again? They found no weapons of mass destruction that W claimed they had. Iraq wasn't even bothering us. Saddam and Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11. Why bother them? Sure Saddam was a dictator, and we "liberated" Iraq, but the question is did they want to be liberated? Did they even want our help? Some did, but really and truly I feel that the majority didn't. If they did, our soldiers wouldn't be getting killed on daily basis. The middle east has always fought each other, I say let them fight! Get our soldiers outta there!