Why do Z97 boards max out at 8GB modules?

[Troff]

Is there a hard technical reason why there are no Z97 boards that will accept memory modules larger than 8MB a piece? I'd be more than happy to spend the extra money to get >16GB onto an ITX board.

 

[master_shake_]

i think its a limitation of the 1150 cpus memory controller....

the xeon varaint allows for more iirc.

nope im a liar its the same limitation.

 

[Troff]

Do you have a source for that? I'm having a really hard time finding any specs on the haswell memory controller beyond "up to 32GB".

 

[Troff]

Never mind. Now that I know what to google for I found this:

"Intel currently supports 8Gb components and 16GB modules only on their Atom C2000 series (Codename 'Avoton') and Atom E3800 (Baytrail-I) processor series. New BIOS versions for these platforms are required to use the memory and are available now.
For most standard Intel processors that are used in desktop PC's, laptops or servers, Intel is not yet supporting the new high capacity memories. According to Intel, "it is not POR" (-> Plan Of Record) for them to analyze the possibility to support them"

I'd still be interested in a good original source for the lack of 8Gb package support though...

 

[bunnyfubbles]

because DDR3 only goes up to 8GB, requiring registered modules to go beyond that, which in turn requires server motherboards/CPUs to utilize (and gets very expensive)

if you really need that much memory in an ITX form, well, you might be SOL for now because I don't know of any that support registered. Although I have seen an extended ITX board that has 4 memory slots, but that might not fit in most consumer ITX cases (and is also just shy of $300...)

looks like you'll be waiting a long time for Skylake and 16+GB DDR4 modules, or else you need to reevaluate your memory requirements and bump up to mATX if you come to the realization that 16GB is too limiting for ITX.

 

[Troff]

While I think your conclusion is spot on, I was quoting from a press release for 16GB unbuffered DDR3

 

[bunnyfubbles]

hmm, well I looked into it and apparently there was some news just this past Thursday from Intelligent Memory about a 16GB module they're producing, I was unaware of that. Anyway, if you read the entire press release it reveals that they're basically at the mercy of Intel and the manufacturers to get support to the mainstream processors, and that ASUS even has it working on their X79 boards after updating their BIOS. But that's only a positive confirmation for X79 on LGA 2011 (which supports registered DDR3, something I don't think is true of 1155/1150, not sure how that might affect the chances of seeing support for the memory for Intel's mainstream), and X79 doesn't exist in ITX form (the closest is Shuttle's option which is more of a cross between ITX and mATX) so its still going to be a waiting game, but with any luck you might not have to wait as long.

 

[ShintaiDK]

because DDR3 only goes up to 8GB, requiring registered modules to go beyond that, which in turn requires server motherboards/CPUs to utilize (and gets very expensive)

^^ This. In short its a DDR3 limitation.

You have to wait for DDR4 if you want higher density "desktop and laptop" modules. However you may be limited to 2 DIMMS with DDr4.

 

[Troff]

I don't think it's a DDR3 limitation. The DDR3 standard specifies up to 8Gb (as in bit) modules, which is not at all the same thing as 8GB (as in byte) sticks. The existence of unbuffered 16GB sticks that work on pretty much every other platform seems to point in the same direction.

 

[Dufus]

Haswell supports 512GiB of addressing. No reason not to be able to support up to 32GiB DIMM's if they were available other than BIOS code.

 

[Troff]

Turns out it is a limitation of the haswell memory controller: http://forums.tweaktown.com/asrock/58195-why-do-z97-boards-max-out-8gb-per-stick.html#post485273

 

[Dufus]

Read the post you linked again.

Note: DIMM module support is based on availability and is subject to change.

At the time there were no 8Gb SDRAM chips to test with. Column and Row are multiplexed on the same data lines and while there are reserved column addresses for special function there are enough for higher densities.

 

[aigomorla]

http://www.anandtech.com/show/7742/im-intelligent-memory-to-release-16gb-unregistered-ddr3-modules

The JEDEC specifications for DDR3 do account for the use of 8 Gbit packages (either one 8 Gbit die or two 4 Gbit dies per package), should these be available. However I am told that currently there is a fundamental non-fixable issue on all Intel processors (except Avoton and Rangeley, other Silvermont (BayTrail) is affected) that means that these dies are not recognised. In their specifications for Ivy Bridge-E, Intel do state that 8Gb packages are supported (link, page 10), however this apparently has not been the case so far and I'M is working with motherboard manufacturers to further pin down this issue.

 

[Anteaus]

Is there a market for dimms that large in the consumer world? 32 GB is excessive for games and general photo and video editing. For heavier editing there are proper workstation solutions. The Z97 is marketed as a gaming board and there are exactly zero games that benefit directly from that much ram. As it stands now once you hit 8-12 GB ram, diminishing returns is the name of the game.

I guess what I'm saying is that even if technically they could make them, there is only a tiny subset of builders who would actually buy them and even then it's about bragging rights.

 

[Troff]

No, it's about virtualization. There's no way I'm sharing OS with the kids for my next computer. That combined with an ITX build just being a whole lot less of an eye sore makes 16GB dimms very attractive for me.

 

[Anteaus]

No, it's about virtualization. There's no way I'm sharing OS with the kids for my next computer. That combined with an ITX build just being a whole lot less of an eye sore makes 16GB dimms very attractive for me.

I'm new to the whole virtualization scene. How will that work? Do you leave the native OS install to kids for games and what not and simply run a VM for yourself? Or is there a specially VM OS you install that you use to virtualize all OSs?

Does virtualization sap performance?

 

[aigomorla]

I'm new to the whole virtualization scene. How will that work? Do you leave the native OS install to kids for games and what not and simply run a VM for yourself? Or is there a specially VM OS you install that you use to virtualize all OSs?

Does virtualization sap performance?

basically...

u have a Vsphere... that is the main OS which your computer boots up.
Then inside the Vsphere, your system sets up Virtualized OS's.

So you basically install an OS ontop of that OS.
You can repeat as many OS's installs u require.

Does it Tap resources?
Yes it does.
You can set and assign cores / ram / HDD space specific to the OS installed, on the Sphere.
The more Virtualized client you need, the more resources you will need. Ie. cores, Ram and storage spaces.

A lot of people i know use eSXi, as its very small and lite.
Others use windows Server 2012 with Hyper-V, but this route requires a LOT of resources.

 

[DracoDan]

basically...

u have a Vsphere... that is the main OS which your computer boots up.
Then inside the Vsphere, your system sets up Virtualized OS's.

So you basically install an OS ontop of that OS.
You can repeat as many OS's installs u require.

Does it Tap resources?
Yes it does.
You can set and assign cores / ram / HDD space specific to the OS installed, on the Sphere.
The more Virtualized client you need, the more resources you will need. Ie. cores, Ram and storage spaces.

A lot of people i know use eSXi, as its very small and lite.
Others use windows Server 2012 with Hyper-V, but this route requires a LOT of resources.

I think you're missing an important aspect of virtualization with VSphere...

The host system that actually runs your VMs has no way to actually interact with the VMs running on it from the console. How this works is you use a client from another PC to connect to the VMs. This can be the VSphere client, rdp, SSH, etc. You could also set up a thin client for connecting to your VM.

In regards to the memory, rather than pay what I'm sure will be an exorbitant price for those memory modules, you should look at getting something with more slots. If you had 6 slots you could get to 48GB.