I wouldn't have a problem if a temporary amnesty was given, only for the people currently here because it would be a logistical and financial nightmare to round all of them up and deport them. Then our borders should be sealed tighter, a new Soc Sec database tied directly to employers be made, and a new deportation law for illegals be established. Unless you have a better solution, please enlighten me.Originally posted by: WhipperSnapper
Originally posted by: palehorse74
I don't care if you're black, white, brown, yellow, green, or purple! the fact is that there are legal immigrants, and there are illegal immigrants. It is only the latter that we have any problem with!
Now hold on...if all of these illegals...if all 12 or 20 million of them were declared to be "legal" overnight, would you then no longer have a problem? What if we declared that immigration-at-will were to be completely legal and opened up our borders, allowing the U.S. population to swell to 1 billion within a few years. All of the immigrants would, of course, be legal. Would you have a problem with it or would it be OK with you?
My point is that the issue is not merely illegal immigration, but also mass immigration--legal or illegal.
One of the huge issues that has gone unrecognized in this debate is whether the proper approach for the U.S. government is to ask, "Is a given amount of immigration in the rational selfish interest of the American people? Instead, people seem to believe that, like a religious mystic, we should follow tradition and allow immigration because it occurred in the past.
Yes, because you are all for the rich get richer and the poor get poorer. We need a solution that doesn't promote a bigger divide between the lower and uppers, this mentality is the exact same one that got us into this mess (businesses seeing dollar signs by hiring illegals to work for under minimum wage).Originally posted by: Zebo
WTF do I care for? Other than my property values will go though roof with 12 million new Social Security numbers/potential home buyers? :thumbsup: You guys just think negative.
Edit: that reminds me.. I'm hungry out the door now to this hole in the wall where no english is spoken but they have the best food.
What was stopping her from running a successful daycare in her own country? What was stopping her from applying for legal immigration, and then opening up her business here? No pity from me.Originally posted by: Zedtom
I saw a Mexican national lady on the news who was in trouble for running an unlicensed daycare center out of her home. She said she can't get licensed because she is not a legal resident.
If this country granted her amnesty and allowed her to become a citizen, would she go get licensed? You know the answer already.
Originally posted by: CessnaFlyer
In Central and South America, the people mass in the streets, with the not so subtle threat of violence imminent.
Originally posted by: piasabird
America does not have the guts to do what China did and call out the tanks and the military and kill the protestors. It is just a fact that in the USA we have this kind of reverence for the protestors. However this could cause an eventual civil war if it get violent.
Originally posted by: DigitalX
Each American is born with hundreds of thousands if not more in (national) debt. more people less debt per person.
We need more people to pay into the social security and medicare system. If you think you are paying a lot now, just think how much we have to pay when large numbers of baby boomers start collecting.
Lets get more people to pay for social security for the aging baby boomers!!!
I m trying to think what he is trying to say, but he s undestanding about US immigration history is limited.TextSo genius if your familly or you came here legally, after immigration laws were set up, you are a legal immigrant. There is a difference between illegal and legal immigrants, you should look into that.
Originally posted by: jrenz
Originally posted by: RichardE
It is sad, that illegals, people who do not have most of the rights you do, are more politically active in your country.
Taking to the streets and protesting is about the only way they can be politically active. And drawing the conclusion that *if* they get their way, they will continue to be politically active... I think that is wrong. I recall hearing that only 3% of the latino population voted in the last election, which may or may not be accurate, but realize that political activism now does not equate to continued activism once immediate goals are achieved.
Originally posted by: RichardE
Illegal Immigrants will get everything they are lobbying for solely because they are politcally active. Whereas the majoirty of people against it sit on there ass, saying "ugh..this is bad because of (insert talking point here)", Illegals take to the streets, protesting, making there voice heard.
Your friendly politicians see this, and realise all the votes he can have, from an obviously politically active demographic and will push through tooth and nail for them to get everything they wish. Why? Because if illegals are protesting right now, when they can't vote...if they are politcally active without any rights, how will they reward the guy who gives it to them?
It is sad, that illegals, people who do not have most of the rights you do, are more politically active in your country.
Originally posted by: ExpertNovice
Originally posted by: RichardE
Illegal Immigrants will get everything they are lobbying for solely because they are politcally active. Whereas the majoirty of people against it sit on there ass, saying "ugh..this is bad because of (insert talking point here)", Illegals take to the streets, protesting, making there voice heard.
Your friendly politicians see this, and realise all the votes he can have, from an obviously politically active demographic and will push through tooth and nail for them to get everything they wish. Why? Because if illegals are protesting right now, when they can't vote...if they are politcally active without any rights, how will they reward the guy who gives it to them?
It is sad, that illegals, people who do not have most of the rights you do, are more politically active in your country.
The liberal cities are not allowing protests in favor of closing and protecting our borders. They have a lot to gain by such actions. More votes, the ability to remove the right of self defense and gun ownership from legal and honest citizens. Even the ability to squelch free speech by making certain statements illegal (think enforced PC speech).
The law abiding citizens have not gone and protested the protestors because of how violent the protestors have been. Luckily, most law abiding citizens have stayed away so the protests have been reasonbly free of violence, meaning no deaths.
In support of your statement:
GAO finds problems with SSN in October 2003
A couple of excerpts:
In 2002, The SSA issued nearly 6 million new SSN's, of which 1.3 million were issued to noncitizens.
GAO investigators were able to obtain SSN's using counterfeit documents.
Individuals may receive 52 replacement cards per year. Of the 18 million cards issued in 2002 69% were replacements.
The ability to obtain many replacement cards with relatively weak documentation may allow individuals to impersonate others by using counterfeit documents to obtain SSN's for a range of illicit uses, including selling them to noncitizens.
You will be happy to know that the practice of issuing SSN cards for the purpose of obtaining a drivers license has been stopped. I also believe that some of the problems reported two years ago have been stopped, but not all.
Originally posted by: Googer
I am not making this up.
When I lost my job many years ago, I went to the welfare office to ask about food stamps and assistance. I was only granted $10 in food. Meanwhile in the parking lot several of non-english speaking (definitly illeagal) Mexicans pull up (when (I am waiting) in nice brand new Trucks and Cars (or almost new, nicer than mine). A few of them were customized with fancy wheels, paint jobs, booming CD players, flashing lights and nice clothing. WHen I saw and heard how much they get, I was floored. Many of them were recieveing $500 in food (some got $100+) and were given free medical aid.
It just is not right when they are here illeagaly, driving a vehicle worth $14,000 or more and getting free welfare aid.
I also see this when I am at the grocery store (in Florida). When I look at their receipts, they often have triple digit balances left on their food stamp cards. Then I watch them walk out to the nice car in the parking lot.
Originally posted by: palehorse74
they are not "undocumented people" goddamnit, they are fvcking illegal immigrants!
your intentional omition of the word "illegal" from your vocabulary says it all.... your agenda is a fvcking joke.
Originally posted by: Googer
Originally posted by: ExpertNovice
Originally posted by: RichardE
Illegal Immigrants will get everything they are lobbying for solely because they are politcally active. Whereas the majoirty of people against it sit on there ass, saying "ugh..this is bad because of (insert talking point here)", Illegals take to the streets, protesting, making there voice heard.
Your friendly politicians see this, and realise all the votes he can have, from an obviously politically active demographic and will push through tooth and nail for them to get everything they wish. Why? Because if illegals are protesting right now, when they can't vote...if they are politcally active without any rights, how will they reward the guy who gives it to them?
It is sad, that illegals, people who do not have most of the rights you do, are more politically active in your country.
The liberal cities are not allowing protests in favor of closing and protecting our borders. They have a lot to gain by such actions. More votes, the ability to remove the right of self defense and gun ownership from legal and honest citizens. Even the ability to squelch free speech by making certain statements illegal (think enforced PC speech).
The law abiding citizens have not gone and protested the protestors because of how violent the protestors have been. Luckily, most law abiding citizens have stayed away so the protests have been reasonbly free of violence, meaning no deaths.
In support of your statement:
GAO finds problems with SSN in October 2003
A couple of excerpts:
In 2002, The SSA issued nearly 6 million new SSN's, of which 1.3 million were issued to noncitizens.
GAO investigators were able to obtain SSN's using counterfeit documents.
Individuals may receive 52 replacement cards per year. Of the 18 million cards issued in 2002 69% were replacements.
The ability to obtain many replacement cards with relatively weak documentation may allow individuals to impersonate others by using counterfeit documents to obtain SSN's for a range of illicit uses, including selling them to noncitizens.
You will be happy to know that the practice of issuing SSN cards for the purpose of obtaining a drivers license has been stopped. I also believe that some of the problems reported two years ago have been stopped, but not all.
If you have a SSN, then you can collect free money. Illeagal Immigrants never contribute but always take.
I am not making this up.
When I lost my job many years ago, I went to the welfare office to ask about food stamps and assistance. I was only granted $10 in food. Meanwhile in the parking lot several of non-english speaking (definitly illeagal) Mexicans pull up (when (I am waiting) in nice brand new Trucks and Cars (or almost new, nicer than mine). A few of them were customized with fancy wheels, paint jobs, booming CD players, flashing lights and nice clothing. WHen I saw and heard how much they get, I was floored. Many of them were recieveing $500 in food (some got $100+) and were given free medical aid.
It just is not right when they are here illeagaly, driving a vehicle worth $14,000 or more and getting free welfare aid.
I also see this when I am at the grocery store (in Florida). When I look at their receipts, they often have triple digit balances left on their food stamp cards. Then I watch them walk out to the nice car in the parking lot.
again, labeling me racist simply because i disagree with you is laughable. give it up steeple...Originally posted by: Steeplerot
Originally posted by: palehorse74
they are not "undocumented people" goddamnit, they are fvcking illegal immigrants!
your intentional omition of the word "illegal" from your vocabulary says it all.... your agenda is a fvcking joke.
And your agenda keeps insisting that you use illegal to cover up the real reason why you support this.
Originally posted by: WHAMPOM
Originally posted by: Googer
Originally posted by: ExpertNovice
Originally posted by: RichardE
Illegal Immigrants will get everything they are lobbying for solely because they are politcally active. Whereas the majoirty of people against it sit on there ass, saying "ugh..this is bad because of (insert talking point here)", Illegals take to the streets, protesting, making there voice heard.
Your friendly politicians see this, and realise all the votes he can have, from an obviously politically active demographic and will push through tooth and nail for them to get everything they wish. Why? Because if illegals are protesting right now, when they can't vote...if they are politcally active without any rights, how will they reward the guy who gives it to them?
It is sad, that illegals, people who do not have most of the rights you do, are more politically active in your country.
The liberal cities are not allowing protests in favor of closing and protecting our borders. They have a lot to gain by such actions. More votes, the ability to remove the right of self defense and gun ownership from legal and honest citizens. Even the ability to squelch free speech by making certain statements illegal (think enforced PC speech).
The law abiding citizens have not gone and protested the protestors because of how violent the protestors have been. Luckily, most law abiding citizens have stayed away so the protests have been reasonbly free of violence, meaning no deaths.
In support of your statement:
GAO finds problems with SSN in October 2003
A couple of excerpts:
In 2002, The SSA issued nearly 6 million new SSN's, of which 1.3 million were issued to noncitizens.
GAO investigators were able to obtain SSN's using counterfeit documents.
Individuals may receive 52 replacement cards per year. Of the 18 million cards issued in 2002 69% were replacements.
The ability to obtain many replacement cards with relatively weak documentation may allow individuals to impersonate others by using counterfeit documents to obtain SSN's for a range of illicit uses, including selling them to noncitizens.
You will be happy to know that the practice of issuing SSN cards for the purpose of obtaining a drivers license has been stopped. I also believe that some of the problems reported two years ago have been stopped, but not all.
If you have a SSN, then you can collect free money. Illeagal Immigrants never contribute but always take.
I am not making this up.
When I lost my job many years ago, I went to the welfare office to ask about food stamps and assistance. I was only granted $10 in food. Meanwhile in the parking lot several of non-english speaking (definitly illeagal) Mexicans pull up (when (I am waiting) in nice brand new Trucks and Cars (or almost new, nicer than mine). A few of them were customized with fancy wheels, paint jobs, booming CD players, flashing lights and nice clothing. WHen I saw and heard how much they get, I was floored. Many of them were recieveing $500 in food (some got $100+) and were given free medical aid.
It just is not right when they are here illeagaly, driving a vehicle worth $14,000 or more and getting free welfare aid.
I also see this when I am at the grocery store (in Florida). When I look at their receipts, they often have triple digit balances left on their food stamp cards. Then I watch them walk out to the nice car in the parking lot.
You are in Florida and don't have a clue? They are Cuban, with big money countrymen making sure the politicians greet them with open arms, cash in hand, and all in exchange for future votes. Legal as soon as they step on dry land.
Originally posted by: Steeplerot
Originally posted by: Googer
I am not making this up.
When I lost my job many years ago, I went to the welfare office to ask about food stamps and assistance. I was only granted $10 in food. Meanwhile in the parking lot several of non-english speaking (definitly illeagal) Mexicans pull up (when (I am waiting) in nice brand new Trucks and Cars (or almost new, nicer than mine). A few of them were customized with fancy wheels, paint jobs, booming CD players, flashing lights and nice clothing. WHen I saw and heard how much they get, I was floored. Many of them were recieveing $500 in food (some got $100+) and were given free medical aid.
It just is not right when they are here illeagaly, driving a vehicle worth $14,000 or more and getting free welfare aid.
I also see this when I am at the grocery store (in Florida). When I look at their receipts, they often have triple digit balances left on their food stamp cards. Then I watch them walk out to the nice car in the parking lot.
That would be cubans not mexicans, (mexicans in FL haha) and they are citizens and can get welfare, mexicans will get turned away for cash/food stamps as the law will not allow undocumented people to get such things, I call BS.